Russia Invades Ukraine. Volume 4

[BikeBikeBIke]

isaldiri said:

Oh cmon anyone who isn't sufficiently pro ukraine or expresses a view that is not positive towards ukraine gets swiftly denounced as a russian troll/shill. Can't exactly come as a surprise to posters on the thread I'd have thought.....

That's just not true. It's fine to be pro Russian as long as you do it with fact and reason. The reason the tankies are denounced as Russian shills is not because they're pro Russian it's becaise when challenged won't back it up with sane reasoning, either dodge or parrot Russian vranyo and whataboutary.

Personally, I'd love to hear a well reasoned case that Russia are right here and this war is good for Ukriane amd Europe and Russia I actively seek out that case on Twitter and Telegram. I strongly suspect there isn't one, but if there is I'm more than willing to be convinced.

[borcy]

https://twitter.com/ColbyBadhwar/status/1772962802...

Bit more on possible f16 options.

[borcy]

https://newsukraine.rbc.ua/news/russians-massively...

Ukrainian grid attacked overnight.

[borcy]

https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1773970...

An interview with Zelenskyy.

[gruffalo]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68692195

I find myself in agreement with Donald Tusk, that has not often happened.

[Digga]

gruffalo said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68692195

I find myself in agreement with Donald Tusk, that has not often happened.

In fairness to Tusk, on the subject of Russia and specifically Ukraine he’s been excellent. He and Sikorsky are showing consistent and clear opinions.

[_Al_]

Digga said:

gruffalo said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68692195

I find myself in agreement with Donald Tusk, that has not often happened.

In fairness to Tusk, on the subject of Russia and specifically Ukraine he’s been excellent. He and Sikorsky are showing consistent and clear opinions.

Does seem to be coming across as a pragmatic realistic leader. Something that’s been missing for some time in the western world. Must have been on the same distance learning course as Zelenskyy…

[Oliver Hardy]

_Al_ said:

Digga said:

gruffalo said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-68692195

I find myself in agreement with Donald Tusk, that has not often happened.

In fairness to Tusk, on the subject of Russia and specifically Ukraine he’s been excellent. He and Sikorsky are showing consistent and clear opinions.

Does seem to be coming across as a pragmatic realistic leader. Something that’s been missing for some time in the western world. Must have been on the same distance learning course as Zelenskyy…

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

[CharlesdeGaulle]

Oliver Hardy said:

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

I find that rather surprising. Got any links?

[Oliver Hardy]

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Oliver Hardy said:

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

I find that rather surprising. Got any links?

I will try and find some a bit later, if I recall rightly he was also against building the gas import facilities

[blueST]

Oliver Hardy said:

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Oliver Hardy said:

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

I find that rather surprising. Got any links?

I will try and find some a bit later, if I recall rightly he was also against building the gas import facilities

I don't think it's unreasonable given all that's happened that he may genuinely have changed stance.

[Oilchange]

Oliver Hardy said:

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Oliver Hardy said:

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

I find that rather surprising. Got any links?

I will try and find some a bit later, if I recall rightly he was also against building the gas import facilities

Could he have had shares in Nordstream?

[W12GT]

borcy said:

https://twitter.com/Gerashchenko_en/status/1773970...

An interview with Zelenskyy.

If I ran a warfare company, I’d be sending every single thing to Ukraine. Or should I say I’d send it all to Russia via Ukraine.

I seriously hope we the West get our act together ASAP and expedite deliveries. We are seeing the worst atrocities we’ve seen in my lifetime and not doing enough. One of my daughter’s best friends is Ukrainian and her dad is out there doing what he can to enable Ukraine to survive.

Слава Україні!

[Hill92]

Oliver Hardy said:

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Oliver Hardy said:

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

I find that rather surprising. Got any links?

I will try and find some a bit later, if I recall rightly he was also against building the gas import facilities

There was the Baltic Pipe project which fell apart due to international partners pulling out in the wake of the global financial crisis. Tusk's government therefore switched to building a LNG import terminal without them. Denmark then later returned to the Baltic Pipe project and that was completed as well.

https://energia.rp.pl/komentarze-i-opinie/art38215...

He was also critical of Germany's reliance on Russia gas 10 years ago.

https://www.euractiv.com/section/energy/news/tusk-...

[Evanivitch]

W12GT said:

If I ran a warfare company, I’d be sending every single thing to Ukraine. Or should I say I’d send it all to Russia via Ukraine.

Within the constraints of technology security, that's exactly what they're doing.

[BikeBikeBIke]

blueST said:

I don't think it's unreasonable given all that's happened that he may genuinely have changed stance.

This. I've spent 20 years giving Putin the benifit of the doubt (and Soviet Russia before that).

Zelensky was described as Putin's puppet so he's changed his mind too!

Feb 22 demonstrated to us all that the worst interpretation was the correct one and Russia were just stealing land and maliciously meddling. We were, broadly speaking, the good guys all along.

[Digga]

BikeBikeBIke said:

blueST said:

I don't think it's unreasonable given all that's happened that he may genuinely have changed stance.

This. I've spent 20 years giving Putin the benifit of the doubt (and Soviet Russia before that).

Zelensky was described as Putin's puppet so he's changed his mind too!

Feb 22 demonstrated to us all that the worst interpretation was the correct one and Russia were just stealing land and maliciously meddling. We were, broadly speaking, the good guys all along.

Agree, the flawed hope (assumption) that a post millennial, globalist Russia would play nice was not restricted to the West. Many former soviet states fell for the same idea.

As for being opposed to German dependence on Russian gas and oil, well he was not wrong there.

[trickywoo]

Although it’s not been in the mainstream news the situation at the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Power Plant isn’t at all good.

https://www.oecd-nea.org/jcms/pl_66130/ukraine-cur...

I’d hoped there were behind the scenes negotiations to improve the situation but it doesn’t appear so.

[BikeBikeBIke]

300 ground to air missiles arriving sooner from France. Hopefully this equates to a couple of hundred Russian missiles that don't hit Ukrainian assets or people:

https://x.com/aidefranceukr/status/177426496253531...

[Oliver Hardy]

CharlesdeGaulle said:

Oliver Hardy said:

When he was last in government he was cosying up to Russia, criticizing the last government for trying to strengthen Polands' military

I find that rather surprising. Got any links?

I will try and find some a bit later, if I recall rightly he was also against building the gas import facilities