Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?
Discussion
Dagnir said:
Exactly my point.
Unless you compare the same crime, you can't demonstrate whether the sentences for said crime were less, or more lenient.
Average salaries have risen in the past few decades...does that mean we're all richer?
You do understand inflation and how that will impact salaries don't you? I'm not sure there is inflationary pressure on length of sentences, although I did go to university, so it's probably beyond my understanding. /sarcasm.Unless you compare the same crime, you can't demonstrate whether the sentences for said crime were less, or more lenient.
Average salaries have risen in the past few decades...does that mean we're all richer?
Dagnir said:
You people just can't help yourselves can you?
It's hilarious. Like some kind of fanatical compulsion.
Must...not.....admit truth.....must deflect....deflect......Britain bad....Britain evil.....look over there!
It's people like this that birthed the whole NPC thing.
heebeegeetee said:
Dagnir said:
heebeegeetee said:
Dear god 
From making a comment on PH to "'it's people like this that birthed the whole NPC thing."
What a f
king nutcase you must be!
This Islamic threat to the UK, is it changing your life in any way? I know it's not mine. Remind me what I'm supposed to be scared of? What "truth" is it I must not admit?
How do you not see it though?From making a comment on PH to "'it's people like this that birthed the whole NPC thing."
What a f
king nutcase you must be! This Islamic threat to the UK, is it changing your life in any way? I know it's not mine. Remind me what I'm supposed to be scared of? What "truth" is it I must not admit?
We were, for whatever reason, discussing who the greater threat to us was (radical islam or Russia) and because you're not allowed to actually articulate what we all already know....you have to delect onto how evil the British Army is.
You're so programmed to hate Britain, that you prostrate yourself in the defense of people that want you dead.
You REALLY don't see it?
I fecking don't, no! I've gone from making a comment on a motoring forum to all of that! What the hell is wrong with you?
The history of Britain has caused a great deal of difficulty in the world, the consequences of which is causing problems to this day and is still affecting us.
That's just fact, and you extrapolate that to: "You're so programmed to hate Britain, that you prostrate yourself in the defense of people that want you dead."
You are insane!
I can certainly see what's triggering you.
PS: Show me where I've "defended".
The choice was A or B.
The correct answer is A.
You're programmed to not say A, so instead you say look how bad C is though.
You deflected what you saw as an attack on A, onto C instead.
...and rather amazingly, you've just done it again!
You're so programmed to hate Britain that you're still trying to insert her as the bad person in the equation...when she wasn't even part of it in the first place.
Another example:
Two women are talking about whether David Mitchell or Russell Brand were more likely to sexually assult someone. Mavis actually really likes Russell Brand, so instead of saying the correct answer, she starts moaning about bad her her ex-husband used to treat her.
You are Mavis
See it now?
tangerine_sedge said:
You do understand inflation and how that will impact salaries don't you? I'm not sure there is inflationary pressure on length of sentences, although I did go to university, so it's probably beyond my understanding. /sarcasm.
There are other factors involved? The overall abstract statistic doesn't show the real picture??Nooo, surely not.
Dagnir said:
tangerine_sedge said:
You do understand inflation and how that will impact salaries don't you? I'm not sure there is inflationary pressure on length of sentences, although I did go to university, so it's probably beyond my understanding. /sarcasm.
There are other factors involved? The overall abstract statistic doesn't show the real picture??Nooo, surely not.
Dagnir said:
Lets try some logic...
The choice was A or B.
The correct answer is A.
You're programmed to not say A, so instead you say look how bad C is though.
You deflected what you saw as an attack on A, onto C instead.
...and rather amazingly, you've just done it again!
You're so programmed to hate Britain that you're still trying to insert her as the bad person in the equation...when she wasn't even part of it in the first place.
Another example:
Two women are talking about whether David Mitchell or Russell Brand were more likely to sexually assult someone. Mavis actually really likes Russell Brand, so instead of saying the correct answer, she starts moaning about bad her her ex-husband used to treat her.
You are Mavis
See it now?
You ok hun? The choice was A or B.
The correct answer is A.
You're programmed to not say A, so instead you say look how bad C is though.
You deflected what you saw as an attack on A, onto C instead.
...and rather amazingly, you've just done it again!
You're so programmed to hate Britain that you're still trying to insert her as the bad person in the equation...when she wasn't even part of it in the first place.
Another example:
Two women are talking about whether David Mitchell or Russell Brand were more likely to sexually assult someone. Mavis actually really likes Russell Brand, so instead of saying the correct answer, she starts moaning about bad her her ex-husband used to treat her.
You are Mavis
See it now?
Kermit power said:
I'd never really given much thought to Reform UK before seeing a surprising number of people on the "Voting Intentions" thread saying that they were actually considering voting for them. What's more, it seems from opinion polls that around 10% of the country are actually considering voting for them, so I went to have a look at their policies and found this...
We live in a country which has had declining birth rates and increasing life expectancy for decades. Basically every year for the past half century has seen more people retiring than children reaching adulthood to replace them, and this dial will shift by a further million over the next 15 years. Every year - without net immigration - the ratio of workers to pensioners will continue to fall and the tax burden per worker to support those pensioners will continue to rise.
You might support the policy of net zero immigration or you might not. That is your own personal opinion, and there are surely more than enough other threads on here debating that.
You may also support the idea of zero waiting lists. Nobody likes waiting for medical care, of course, even if it would be very costly to deliver.
Lastly, you might also favour the idea of lower taxation. Who doesn't?
Regardless of your views on those three individual topics, however, surely nobody can truly look at all three together and believe they are any more deliverable than a kosher vegetarian bacon sarnie???
I find it honestly scary that the state of mainstream British politics has reached a point where 10% of the British electorate can actually look at Reform UK's three short, clear, easy to understand yet completely mutually exclusive policies and think "yes, that would be an improvement"!?! You could have all three, of course, but only if you're willing to pursue a ruthless euthanasia policy to cull the sick, elderly or otherwise unproductive in society, and I'd hope not too many people actually want that?
How on earth have we come to this??? Surely something has to change?
They're not mututally exclusive, repeal the nonsensical and astronomically expensive Climate Change Act and all its illegitimate offspring will wither on the vine, then there's cheaper energy and lower taxes in the pipeline which can be used partly to lower the tax burden and to assist with other political aims.We live in a country which has had declining birth rates and increasing life expectancy for decades. Basically every year for the past half century has seen more people retiring than children reaching adulthood to replace them, and this dial will shift by a further million over the next 15 years. Every year - without net immigration - the ratio of workers to pensioners will continue to fall and the tax burden per worker to support those pensioners will continue to rise.
You might support the policy of net zero immigration or you might not. That is your own personal opinion, and there are surely more than enough other threads on here debating that.
You may also support the idea of zero waiting lists. Nobody likes waiting for medical care, of course, even if it would be very costly to deliver.
Lastly, you might also favour the idea of lower taxation. Who doesn't?
Regardless of your views on those three individual topics, however, surely nobody can truly look at all three together and believe they are any more deliverable than a kosher vegetarian bacon sarnie???
I find it honestly scary that the state of mainstream British politics has reached a point where 10% of the British electorate can actually look at Reform UK's three short, clear, easy to understand yet completely mutually exclusive policies and think "yes, that would be an improvement"!?! You could have all three, of course, but only if you're willing to pursue a ruthless euthanasia policy to cull the sick, elderly or otherwise unproductive in society, and I'd hope not too many people actually want that?
How on earth have we come to this??? Surely something has to change?
No need to read beyond the last sentence of the abstract (pdf)
https://www.researchgate.net/journal/Environmental...
Reality in a headline from IPCC guru.
https://public.substack.com/p/cambridge-university...
Cost of CCA per household as calculated by Labour way back at the Bill stage.
https://www.peterlilley.co.uk/1421-lilley-seeks-an...
£8,000 pa energy bills; major lowballing errors in Net Zero costings by 4 national bodles (amazing coincidence)
https://www.netzerowatch.com/all-news/new-study-wa...
https://www.netzerowatch.com/all-news/an-extraordi...
The previous comment is quite a good illustration of Reform's popularity and the operation of populism in general.
Its the idea that we live in a world of easy solutions but that our elected representatives are hell-bent on picking alternatives that make the lives of their electorate harder; if only we could just see sense and elect some plain-speaking, common-sense-supermen outsider-types!
Why no existing member has had the epiphany "I can fix everything and my grateful electors will keep me in office (this office which I covet) forever" - is a mystery that is only solved by admitting that public policy is complicated, challenging and driven by broadly sound consideration - or you can turn left down the conspiracy rabbit hole...
Its the idea that we live in a world of easy solutions but that our elected representatives are hell-bent on picking alternatives that make the lives of their electorate harder; if only we could just see sense and elect some plain-speaking, common-sense-supermen outsider-types!
Why no existing member has had the epiphany "I can fix everything and my grateful electors will keep me in office (this office which I covet) forever" - is a mystery that is only solved by admitting that public policy is complicated, challenging and driven by broadly sound consideration - or you can turn left down the conspiracy rabbit hole...
AmyRichardson said:
... is a mystery that is only solved by admitting that public policy is complicated,.
Unfortunately, in the UK we use this reason too often and therefore its difficult to work out what is too complicated to change quickly.The IR35 abolition for example, is a simple change, reform have committed to do it, it should have been done already but the truth (I think) is we have a government class to pre-occupied with ever increasing taxation and not efficiency.
In a parallel universe the Lib Dem. should be hoovering up these easy win policy gaps (like IR35 and the 45p rate) that, sit right on their doorstep in key Tory battleground seats but they have lost the plot.
There's probably 2 million votes to be won simply by removing IR35, it's a political no-brainer.
Carl_VivaEspana said:
AmyRichardson said:
... is a mystery that is only solved by admitting that public policy is complicated,.
Unfortunately, in the UK we use this reason too often and therefore its difficult to work out what is too complicated to change quickly.The IR35 abolition for example, is a simple change, reform have committed to do it, it should have been done already but the truth (I think) is we have a government class to pre-occupied with ever increasing taxation and not efficiency.
In a parallel universe the Lib Dem. should be hoovering up these easy win policy gaps (like IR35 and the 45p rate) that, sit right on their doorstep in key Tory battleground seats but they have lost the plot.
There's probably 2 million votes to be won simply by removing IR35, it's a political no-brainer.
My up to date thoughts on Reform...
So I'm a Conservative, centre right thinking Brexit voter etc etc. I'm sure just admitting that will immediately trigger some, but meh - like it or not there are a few of us.
The Conservatives have completely betrayed everything they said they stood for and their voter base. I honestly hope they win zero seats at the next election. I want to see them destroyed.
I thought maybe Reform would hoover up traditional Conservatives, and give a two fingered saloot to those Conservatives who would lose their seats to Reform. In the last voting intention poll here, that's who I ticked.
But no. Turns out they're just pandering to the likes of Hope not Hate and stting on their potential candidates. Yes, I do like Beau Dade. As a long term Lotus Eaters subscriber I think he's great. But a bit too Right for Reform it seems...FFS.
So that's Reform off the table... leaving nobody for me to vote for (and probably people my ilk?).
Funnily enough, I'm now embracing the thought of a Labour landslide just to see how effectively they can hammer home those few nails left in the coffin for Britain. Then in maybe 10 years time we'll have a 'sensible' centre-right party to vote for to make things better.
Just thought I'd say that. If you disagree with any or all of it, that's absolutely fine. I'm so done with politics, I honestly don't care any more, and don't have much energy left to argue the toss.
So I'm a Conservative, centre right thinking Brexit voter etc etc. I'm sure just admitting that will immediately trigger some, but meh - like it or not there are a few of us.
The Conservatives have completely betrayed everything they said they stood for and their voter base. I honestly hope they win zero seats at the next election. I want to see them destroyed.
I thought maybe Reform would hoover up traditional Conservatives, and give a two fingered saloot to those Conservatives who would lose their seats to Reform. In the last voting intention poll here, that's who I ticked.
But no. Turns out they're just pandering to the likes of Hope not Hate and s
tting on their potential candidates. Yes, I do like Beau Dade. As a long term Lotus Eaters subscriber I think he's great. But a bit too Right for Reform it seems...FFS.So that's Reform off the table... leaving nobody for me to vote for (and probably people my ilk?).
Funnily enough, I'm now embracing the thought of a Labour landslide just to see how effectively they can hammer home those few nails left in the coffin for Britain. Then in maybe 10 years time we'll have a 'sensible' centre-right party to vote for to make things better.
Just thought I'd say that. If you disagree with any or all of it, that's absolutely fine. I'm so done with politics, I honestly don't care any more, and don't have much energy left to argue the toss.
rohrl said:
Why does everyone always say “I’m centre-right” or “I’m centre-left” even when they’re obviously a very long way from the centre? No one ever describes themselves as far right or far left do they?
Fair point. How would you describe yourself?Google recons...
Generally, the left wing is characterized by an emphasis on "ideas such as freedom, equality, fraternity, rights, progress, reform and internationalism" while the right wing is characterized by an emphasis on "notions such as authority, hierarchy, order, duty, tradition, reaction and nationalism".
I must say I think they have 'ideas such as freedom' and 'notions such as authority' around the wrong way? Seems 'reform' is a left wing ideology too...figures
Along with that quick Google...I also did the first (US centric) quiz that appeared https://www.politicalpersonality.org/test/
Apparently I'm a...
'Freedom Steward
You are an independent spirit who champions individual autonomy.
Freedom Stewards value privacy, autonomy, and are generally distrustful of the political order. You feel that the world would be better off if people just took care of themselves and didn’t rely on government institutions. You prefer to keep to yourself, rather than engage in public political campaigns. Generally a hard worker, you pave your own way and just want the government to stay out of it.'
So there you are. Quite accurate actually.
Timothy Bucktu said:
rohrl said:
Why does everyone always say “I’m centre-right” or “I’m centre-left” even when they’re obviously a very long way from the centre? No one ever describes themselves as far right or far left do they?
Fair point. How would you describe yourself?
Timothy Bucktu said:
I also did the first (US centric) quiz that appeared https://www.politicalpersonality.org/test/
Apparently I'm a...
'Freedom Steward
You are an independent spirit who champions individual autonomy.
Freedom Stewards value privacy, autonomy, and are generally distrustful of the political order. You feel that the world would be better off if people just took care of themselves and didn’t rely on government institutions. You prefer to keep to yourself, rather than engage in public political campaigns. Generally a hard worker, you pave your own way and just want the government to stay out of it.'
So there you are. Quite accurate actually.
Not sure about the answer I got.................Apparently I'm a...
'Freedom Steward
You are an independent spirit who champions individual autonomy.
Freedom Stewards value privacy, autonomy, and are generally distrustful of the political order. You feel that the world would be better off if people just took care of themselves and didn’t rely on government institutions. You prefer to keep to yourself, rather than engage in public political campaigns. Generally a hard worker, you pave your own way and just want the government to stay out of it.'
So there you are. Quite accurate actually.
I'm guessing it's the USA centric questions
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff