Reform UK - A symptom of all that is wrong?
Discussion
smn159 said:
President Merkin said:
And the 10% rump have always been with us. They're an indication of low engagement, light education, high blame cohorts, exploited by the same kind of chancers since forever. A notable occurence in these threads is supportive posters railing against the notion they may be being led by the nose & by extension, manipulable but there is lots of evidence they are precisely that.
Human nature dictates that no one likes to think they can be swayed by others but I can point you to a hundred advertising agencies who know better & what's the difference? One guy is selling you Coco Pops, someone else the idea that you can't get a Doctor's appointment because some Syrian guy fleeing Russian cluster bombs has nicked your place in the queue.
If you want an insight into how Reform, UKIP, BNP, all the rest of the 10% crowd whip up their base, then read this. It even contains a reference to the often seen in here refrain - They're all as bad as each other.
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/did-aust...
Always a surprise how easily some of those most affected can be convinced that austerity was a good thing and that the resulting decline in services and crumbling infrastructure is somehow the fault of a relatively small number of asylum seekers.Human nature dictates that no one likes to think they can be swayed by others but I can point you to a hundred advertising agencies who know better & what's the difference? One guy is selling you Coco Pops, someone else the idea that you can't get a Doctor's appointment because some Syrian guy fleeing Russian cluster bombs has nicked your place in the queue.
If you want an insight into how Reform, UKIP, BNP, all the rest of the 10% crowd whip up their base, then read this. It even contains a reference to the often seen in here refrain - They're all as bad as each other.
https://blogs.lse.ac.uk/politicsandpolicy/did-aust...
I guess that some just don't like foreigners and will happily wag their tails at anything which reinforces their prejudices.
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
Yes, that will teach me to use The Guardian ‘facts’.
The Guardian facts were correct it was your misinterpretation that was the issue.crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
Yes, that will teach me to use The Guardian ‘facts’.
The Guardian facts were correct it was your misinterpretation that was the issue.cheesejunkie said:
smn159 said:
Always a surprise how easily some of those most affected can be convinced that austerity was a good thing and that the resulting decline in services and crumbling infrastructure is somehow the fault of a relatively small number of asylum seekers.
I guess that some just don't like foreigners and will happily wag their tails at anything which reinforces their prejudices.
Wag their fingers.I guess that some just don't like foreigners and will happily wag their tails at anything which reinforces their prejudices.
The mental image of a load of geriatrics wagging their tails is hurting my mind's eye
.Agreed, parties like reform prey on disaffection and don't offer workable solutions.
Labour are set to form a new U.K. Government this year, and yet they will bring no meaningful changes, and so the spiral of decay will continue.
NerveAgent said:
One of the things I find most interesting, is how their new “saviours” are new, different and against the “establishment”. But all the main players are the same people from the last time, and the time before that.
Instructive to look at a list of their main donors. Hedge fund managers, overseas based millionaires, a bloke who was removed from his own company following allegations that he sexually harassed or assaulted 13 women over 25 years... Breath of fresh air indeed
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
Yes, that will teach me to use The Guardian ‘facts’.
The Guardian facts were correct it was your misinterpretation that was the issue.smn159 said:
NerveAgent said:
One of the things I find most interesting, is how their new “saviours” are new, different and against the “establishment”. But all the main players are the same people from the last time, and the time before that.
Instructive to look at a list of their main donors. Hedge fund managers, overseas based millionaires, a bloke who was removed from his own company following allegations that he sexually harassed or assaulted 13 women over 25 years... Breath of fresh air indeed
What’s the problem with hedge fund managers?
crankedup5 said:
Disatisfaction arising from poor policy decisions over past decades by all Governments seeking short term re-election gimmicks has led their Country to where we are now. Not just in the U.K. but across Europe we see the rise of the Right.
Labour are set to form a new U.K. Government this year, and yet they will bring no meaningful changes, and so the spiral of decay will continue.
Oh god this never gets old.Labour are set to form a new U.K. Government this year, and yet they will bring no meaningful changes, and so the spiral of decay will continue.
https://starwarsintrocreator.kassellabs.io/#!/ENwP...
b
hstewie said:
hstewie said:crankedup5 said:
Disatisfaction arising from poor policy decisions over past decades by all Governments seeking short term re-election gimmicks has led their Country to where we are now. Not just in the U.K. but across Europe we see the rise of the Right.
Labour are set to form a new U.K. Government this year, and yet they will bring no meaningful changes, and so the spiral of decay will continue.
Oh god this never gets old.Labour are set to form a new U.K. Government this year, and yet they will bring no meaningful changes, and so the spiral of decay will continue.
https://starwarsintrocreator.kassellabs.io/#!/ENwP...
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
Yes, that will teach me to use The Guardian ‘facts’.
The Guardian facts were correct it was your misinterpretation that was the issue.smn159 said:
Always a surprise how easily some of those most affected can be convinced that austerity was a good thing and that the resulting decline in services and crumbling infrastructure is somehow the fault of a relatively small number of asylum seekers.
I guess that some just don't like foreigners and will happily wag their tails at anything which reinforces their prejudices.
The only part of that I'd demur from is the last sentence. Again, there will always be the fag end demographic made up of xenophobes & racists, ripe for the picking by Nige, Tyndal, Griffin, Mosely, however far you want to go back but there is also plenty of research out there that dissatisfaction with the EU, to pick an obvious issue, was down in the single digits as recently as the mid 2000's yanno, when the cascade of choppers from Jimmy Goldsmith down started deploying time honoured tactics fomenting unrest among the receptive. I guess that some just don't like foreigners and will happily wag their tails at anything which reinforces their prejudices.
My point being (again) people are less curious & consequently more malleable than they believe themselves to be & those effects are more observable in populations you would variously describe as deprived, less educated, more reliant on the welfare state & older and combinations thereof.
Dave200 said:
Jordie Barretts sock said:
crankedup5 said:
A few posters 
you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students.
Oh dear. This immigrant also knows how to spell 'whether'. you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students. Another slip? I think not.
Never mind your argument your lack of basic English grammar is pointing to a limited education. Which explains quite a lot.
this thread said:
A man walks into a bar and tries to convince someone of something with data. They don't believe in data. Hilarity ensues.
That's the last few pages of this thread, from my reading of it.Some people make decisions based on data, some don't. Some do it on trust in their chosen people or implicit faith in something.
You'll never convince someone of something with data if they don't make decisions like that in the first place, just as someone who make decisions based on faith/trust in others will never convince someone who makes decisions based on data of anything.
I'd also opine that the majority of people don't change their mind once they have decided something, even if the the basis of that decision on (eg. data or trust) turns out to be false later on. Sure, there are outliers who actually do change their minds, but I think they are a small minority.
To my mind, the reform party is mostly trading on brexit not bringing the benefits those who voted for it wanted. It has the potential to split the right into two ineffective blocks of voters (thanks to our first-past-the-post voting system in general elections), leaving Labour a relatively easy win, potentially with a large majority.
Pan Pan Pan said:
Dave200 said:
Jordie Barretts sock said:
crankedup5 said:
A few posters you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students.
Oh dear. This immigrant also knows how to spell 'whether'. you can coast from stats to stats offered from differing outlets, most will present entirely differing ‘facts and figures’.For example the students entering the U.K. mentioned earlier, no mention of family members accompany of students and wether that was included or not in the stats presented. We do know that family members are now restricted to overseas students. Another slip? I think not.
Never mind your argument your lack of basic English grammar is pointing to a limited education. Which explains quite a lot.
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
chrispmartha said:
crankedup5 said:
Yes, that will teach me to use The Guardian ‘facts’.
The Guardian facts were correct it was your misinterpretation that was the issue.Dave200 said:
It's a classic thing you see with older folks. They don't like having their views challenged, and they aren't open to new ideas. Thus it's very difficult for them to fess up and admit errors.
Whereas a lot of younger people display breathtaking arrogance always convinced that they’re right and anyone disagreeing must be stupid. Arrogance can be rooted in a strong sense of narcissism and is exacerbated by a lack of self-awareness. bad company said:
Whereas a lot of younger people display breathtaking arrogance always convinced that they’re right and anyone disagreeing must be stupid. Arrogance can be rooted in a strong sense of narcissism and is exacerbated by a lack of self-awareness.
So people can be dheads at any age, it's a fair country in that regard.What are reform offering?
Who are they appealing to?
What does anyone voting for them expect to achieve?
It isn't those younger people with so called breathtaking arrogance voting for them.
Gassing Station | News, Politics & Economics | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff