Scottish Politics / Independence - Vol 12

[alangla]

hidetheelephants said:

So many questions; AUIU most of the stuff for the scheme arrived on barges and why wasn't the damage spotted and the wagons told to GTF before it fked the ramps? This isn't something that suddenly broke having been fine the day before and "oh it will be months because the parts have to come from Poland" screams of no one having a fking clue and no one wants the blame.

It’s one of those things that you just can’t imagine happening to Western Ferries, despite operating similar boats, albeit from different docks, and carrying plenty of HGVs

[dxg]

hidetheelephants said:

Jader1973 said:

alangla said:

Another ferry goosed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce5lv3ddp6jo

The replacement that’s being brought in to cover was ordered when Jim Callaghan was in number 10…

It appears the lorries going over for the Millport seafront bdisation project have buggered the boat.

So many questions; AUIU most of the stuff for the scheme arrived on barges and why wasn't the damage spotted and the wagons told to GTF before it fked the ramps? This isn't something that suddenly broke having been fine the day before and "oh it will be months because the parts have to come from Poland" screams of no one having a fking clue and no one wants the blame.

Currently selling a flat in Millport. This is the kind of thing that could scupper the deal. Were lucky to get away with the works themselves not getting in the way. I guess we're protected a little by the Scottish system (an offer has been accepted, but any deal can be backed out of - just with consequences).

[hidetheelephants]

alangla said:

hidetheelephants said:

So many questions; AUIU most of the stuff for the scheme arrived on barges and why wasn't the damage spotted and the wagons told to GTF before it fked the ramps? This isn't something that suddenly broke having been fine the day before and "oh it will be months because the parts have to come from Poland" screams of no one having a fking clue and no one wants the blame.

It’s one of those things that you just can’t imagine happening to Western Ferries, despite operating similar boats, albeit from different docks, and carrying plenty of HGVs

Western run proper ferries that run from linkspans rather than glorified landing craft that run aground on a concrete slipway.

[Taffer]

The Ro-Ro equipment should be getting a more in-depth inspection on a weekly basis - the hinges lie on the exterior of the ship, so gaining close access to them requires inspection by small boat for the first ramp section, and a climb on top of the ramp (with fall arresters, etc) for the second section. Not a simple job compared to the small locking ramps that Western Ferries use.

Whether the crew noticed the damage, reported it and were told to sit on it, or they missed it is unknown. After damage occurred to one ramp though, it seems odd they just operated single-ended without a thorough inspection of the other ramp.

[TheJimi]

Jader1973 said:

alangla said:

Another ferry goosed https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/ce5lv3ddp6jo

The replacement that’s being brought in to cover was ordered when Jim Callaghan was in number 10…

It appears the lorries going over for the Millport seafront bdisation project have buggered the boat.

fk me -



That's just negligent on the part of CalMac.

[Snow and Rocks]

TheJimi said:

fk me -



That's just negligent on the part of CalMac.

Absolutely - is there a weight limit for road users beyond what is road legal? If so, why wasn't it enforced?

If any road legal truck can use it then the design isn't fit for purpose.

[sherman]

Snow and Rocks said:

TheJimi said:

fk me -



That's just negligent on the part of CalMac.

Absolutely - is there a weight limit for road users beyond what is road legal? If so, why wasn't it enforced?

If any road legal truck can use it then the design isn't fit for purpose.

Anything can be road legal as long as the weight is spread over enough axles.
All boats have a weight limit for big items.

Why it wasnt checked or enforced is just idiotic.

[irc]

The Spectator with an update on the hate crime bill.

So far 3% of reports have been crimes.
40 cops doing overtime every day to deal with it.
The PR campaign cost £400'000

https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/scottish-gover...

I'd be wanting to know how many non crime hate incidents have been recorded. Surprised no journo has asked this yet.

I'll wait for an update though I suppose it is an easy answer for a FOI request.

Edit. Police Scotland publish updates.

https://www.scotland.police.uk/spa-media/ivafzuny/...

[Snow and Rocks]

sherman said:

Anything can be road legal as long as the weight is spread over enough axles.
All boats have a weight limit for big items.

Why it wasnt checked or enforced is just idiotic.

Yep, I would and expect and hope (but who knows!) that trucks over the usual 44T limit would have to make special arrangements but I meant a specifically low limit that would routinely need enforced?

[Roderick Spode]

irc said:

I'd be wanting to know how many non crime hate incidents have been recorded. Surprised no journo has asked this yet.

I can't quite understand how there have only been 30 recorded NCHI - according to the legislation, any report where a complaint fails to meet the threshold of criminal responsibility, but is considered by the complainant to have been motivated by hate, then that should be recorded as a NCHI.

[tim0409]

Roderick Spode said:

irc said:

I'd be wanting to know how many non crime hate incidents have been recorded. Surprised no journo has asked this yet.

I can't quite understand how there have only been 30 recorded NCHI - according to the legislation, any report where a complaint fails to meet the threshold of criminal responsibility, but is considered by the complainant to have been motivated by hate, then that should be recorded as a NCHI.

I made this very point when I commented on the Times article regarding JK Rowling. The police disregarded both their own guidelines and the legislation in concluding that the complaints made against JKR would not be recorded as a NCHI. It is not up to the Police to assess whether or not it is a recordable hate incident by using some arbitrary legal test, but purely if the complainant thinks it was motivated by hate, bonkers as that sounds.

I would love Police Scotland to attempt to record anything against JKR as they will find themselves attempting to explain their logic in court before they know it.

[Klippie]

Its a total mess and surprise surprise funding was available to carry it out, it would appear there is a pot of cash so minorities can get money to spend on trivial nonsense to make themselves look and feel important and make the rest of us normal people bow to their whims...its out of control, these people need to be shouted down and removed from government.

[irc]

Roderick Spode said:

irc said:

I'd be wanting to know how many non crime hate incidents have been recorded. Surprised no journo has asked this yet.

I can't quite understand how there have only been 30 recorded NCHI - according to the legislation, any report where a complaint fails to meet the threshold of criminal responsibility, but is considered by the complainant to have been motivated by hate, then that should be recorded as a NCHI.

Yes, the whole no evidence required thing is coming home to roost. As far as I remember it was the Lawrence Inquiry which removed any need for evidence in recording incidents.

" 1.2 The Stephen Lawrence Inquiry report states that: A racist incident is any incident which is perceived to be racist by the victim or any other person."

On that basis the famous too many whites speech should be recorded as racist.

[Roderick Spode]

It would be most tempting, in that case, to submit a complaint regarding Yousless and his HUWHITE speech, with the relevant excerpt from the legislation, and demand that a NCHI be recorded against him. I have viewed it today for the first time(!), the act of viewing is considered a new publication in Scotland, and therefore falls under the remit of Yousless' Blasphemy Law the Hate Crime Legislation.

This law is the very definition of A Bad Law, and will be studied by legal students in years to come as an example of how not to draft legislation.

[Silverbullet767]

Roderick Spode said:

It would be most tempting, in that case, to submit a complaint regarding Yousless and his HUWHITE speech, with the relevant excerpt from the legislation, and demand that a NCHI be recorded against him. I have viewed it today for the first time(!), the act of viewing is considered a new publication in Scotland, and therefore falls under the remit of Yousless' Blasphemy Law the Hate Crime Legislation.

This law is the very definition of A Bad Law, and will be studied by legal students in years to come as an example of how not to draft legislation.

I'm definitely not alone in reporting that very video, on the 1st of April. Nothing will come of it.

[irc]

Silverbullet767 said:

I'm definitely not alone in reporting that very video, on the 1st of April. Nothing will come of it.

You are correct. But if the law was followed to the letter it is not the job of the police to assess whether or not that was a racist incident. If anyone feels it is then it is.

According to Police Scotland guidelines if a hate crime is reported but no crime established it will be recorded as a hate incident. No ifs. No buts. It will be.

Seems they are ignoring their own guidelines.

https://www.scotland.police.uk/spa-media/1igmlx53/...

[hutchst]

irc said:

Yes, the whole no evidence required thing is coming home to roost. As far as I remember it was the Lawrence Inquiry which removed any need for evidence in recording incidents.

" 1.2 The Stephen Lawrence Inquiry report states that: A racist incident is any incident which is perceived to be racist by the victim or any other person."

On that basis the famous too many whites speech should be recorded as racist.

The recommendation of the Lawrence Inquiry was to record the number of recorded racist incidents. There is nothing about keeping a register of names and addresses of people that have not committed any crime.

[irc]

hutchst said:

The recommendation of the Lawrence Inquiry was to record the number of recorded racist incidents. There is nothing about keeping a register of names and addresses of people that have not committed any crime.

But id was Lawrence that removed the need for evidence.

[Klippie]

It can't be long now till Dumza pokes his nose back into the Israel Gazza Hamas and now Iran conflict...I wonder who will get the next cash injection, it sure as fk won't be anything in Scotland that's for sure.

I've had a great idea...why not send our globetrotting No1 fat piggy Angus Robertson as Scotland's peacekeeping special envoy to the middle east, after all our politicians are world class and should be able to resolve their little stramash in no time.

[dxg]

Interesting: https://twitter.com/AgentP22/status/17794400662233...

While the linked Facebook bod may be an outlier, it really does illustrate the point that the law has not been thought through.

Clearly, the SNP only had a particular form of hate in mind...