Law - Free Speech - Conundrum - Quandary

[nickfrog]

In a democracy it's crucial that free speech is not an absolute right In fact I don't know of any democracy where it is. Can anyone name one?

[Biggy Stardust]

Seasonal Hero said:

Should I be able to call a black man a ‘n*****’’?

If black guys are allowed then you should be allowed, if not then not. Otherwise that's racial discrimination. All are allowed or all are forbidden- a decision should be made & all abide by it.

Would you agree?

[Biggy Stardust]

monthou said:

She hasn't been attacked.
Her employer has seemingly decided - or is possibly in the process of deciding - that her exercising her freedom of speech as she has is incompatible with her employment.
Should she be able to say whatever she wants without consequence?

You don't consider sacking to be an attack? I don't mean physically.

She got what she might have reasonably expected- I just don't consider it compatible with the concept of genuine free speech.

[monthou]

Biggy Stardust said:

monthou said:

She hasn't been attacked.
Her employer has seemingly decided - or is possibly in the process of deciding - that her exercising her freedom of speech as she has is incompatible with her employment.
Should she be able to say whatever she wants without consequence?

You don't consider sacking to be an attack? I don't mean physically.

She got what she might have reasonably expected- I just don't consider it compatible with the concept of genuine free speech.

That comes back to free speech = say what you like to anyone with no consequences.
Which means your rights trump their rights to respond.
Doesn't sound fair.

[Randy Winkman]

Biggy Stardust said:

Seasonal Hero said:

Should I be able to call a black man a ‘n*****’’?

If black guys are allowed then you should be allowed, if not then not. Otherwise that's racial discrimination. All are allowed or all are forbidden- a decision should be made & all abide by it.

Would you agree?

I'd suggest that racial discrimination is more about intent than actual words. If anyone used the word in public I'd judge the situation on it's merits and that might include the race of the person using the word. As a 59 year old white man I'd never say it in public but would be interested to hear if any similar people would.

[Seasonal Hero]

Biggy Stardust said:

If black guys are allowed then you should be allowed, if not then not. Otherwise that's racial discrimination. All are allowed or all are forbidden- a decision should be made & all abide by it.

Would you agree?

No. Because it’s a racial slur that has been taken back by the black community to remove its power in that sense. It’s also a slur that can’t be made by someone with the same skin colour in the racial sense.

To suggest that a white man not being allowed to use it being racial discrimination is off the scale mental.

I’m starting to think you haven’t thought this through.

[smn159]

Biggy Stardust said:

Seasonal Hero said:

Should I be able to call a black man a ‘n*****’’?

If black guys are allowed then you should be allowed, if not then not. Otherwise that's racial discrimination. All are allowed or all are forbidden- a decision should be made & all abide by it.

Would you agree?

Spot on! Those so-called rappers use the N-word all the time without consequence. I shout it once at my son's football match and get asked to leave.

These days you can't even say you're English without getting locked up and thrown in jail.

[Biggy Stardust]

Seasonal Hero said:

No. Because it’s a racial slur that has been taken back by the black community to remove its power in that sense. It’s also a slur that can’t be made by someone with the same skin colour in the racial sense.

To suggest that a white man not being allowed to use it being racial discrimination is off the scale mental.

I’m starting to think you haven’t thought this through.

All should be treated the same- anything else is discrimination. Think it through.

[Seasonal Hero]

smn159 said:

Spot on! Those so-called rappers use the N-word all the time without consequence. I shout it once at my son's football match and get asked to leave.

These days you can't even say you're English without getting locked up and thrown in jail.

Speaking of which I’m off to see Mr Lee tomorrow.

[Biggy Stardust]

monthou said:

That comes back to free speech = say what you like to anyone with no consequences.
Which means your rights trump their rights to respond.
Doesn't sound fair.

Free speech does equal say what you want without consequence.

It doesn't actually exist but that's what it means, even for for stuff you don't like.

[smn159]

Biggy Stardust said:

All should be treated the same- anything else is discrimination. Think it through.

Why bother? You clearly haven't

[monthou]

Biggy Stardust said:

Free speech does equal say what you want without consequence.

Saying it doesn't make it so.
Why should your rights trump someone else's?

[Biggy Stardust]

If it comes with a cost then it isn't free.

[Biggy Stardust]

smn159 said:

Biggy Stardust said:

All should be treated the same- anything else is discrimination. Think it through.

Why bother? You clearly haven't

So treating black people differently to white people isn't discrimination? I won't bother with you.

[Seasonal Hero]

Biggy Stardust said:

If it comes with a cost then it isn't free.

[Randy Winkman]

Biggy Stardust said:

Seasonal Hero said:

No. Because it’s a racial slur that has been taken back by the black community to remove its power in that sense. It’s also a slur that can’t be made by someone with the same skin colour in the racial sense.

To suggest that a white man not being allowed to use it being racial discrimination is off the scale mental.

I’m starting to think you haven’t thought this through.

All should be treated the same- anything else is discrimination. Think it through.

Can you understand that when Michael Jackson said something was "Bad" it meant something a bit different from when my teachers said the same thing about my homework?

[Seasonal Hero]

Biggy Stardust said:

All should be treated the same- anything else is discrimination. Think it through.

Mr Binary is in town clearly.

If you can’t understand the difference then I can explain it for you but I can’t understand it for you.

[monthou]

Biggy Stardust said:

If it comes with a cost then it isn't free.

If you're free to say it...

One more time - why should your rights trump someone else's?

[chrispmartha]

Don’t think Biggy understands context or nuance by the looks of it.

Or what Free Speech means either.

Biggy you are perfectly free to use the N word if you like, it’s not illegal in and of itself.

[nickfrog]

Seasonal Hero said:

Biggy Stardust said:

All should be treated the same- anything else is discrimination. Think it through.

Mr Binary is in town clearly.

If you can’t understand the difference then I can explain it for you but I can’t understand it for you.

You're not going to reason with Biggy. It's mostly emotions with a bit of posturing.