Teacher fired for not using preferred pronouns!

[chrispmartha]

andyA700 said:

sugerbear said:

irc said:

So the student wanted to be male but still be a girl for the purposes of entering competition. Logical.

They were eligible for the competition. That’s all you need to worry about.

If that is correct, then the pupil was misgendering themselves.
You can't have it all ways.

But i thought that’s what you wanted?

Everything based on ‘Biology’?

[Oakey]

bhstewie said:

Again lots of posts on people’s views on gender and on what legislation says and how people are interpreting it.

Why do people need legislation to tell them how they should behave?

Do people really think the way this teacher is reported as treating this student was decent or polite?

Is it how you’d like to be treated?

When it comes to gender issues (like this), or a donor being racist ("where's the evidence?") or someone being a rapist (ie, Russell Brand "innocent until proven guilty) these posters are sticklers for the law and guidance.

Climate policy? COVID rules? ULEZ? Not so much.

[biggles330d]

Would never have happened in my day. Everyone was: Hey, You, Child. Completely gender neutral. lol

[Rufus Stone]

biggles330d said:

Would never have happened in my day. Everyone was: Hey, You, Child. Completely gender neutral. lol

We were referred to just by our surname at my school.

[chrispmartha]

Rufus Stone said:

biggles330d said:

Would never have happened in my day. Everyone was: Hey, You, Child. Completely gender neutral. lol

We were referred to just by our surname at my school.

A lot of my teachers called me by my nickname :-)

[bitchstewie]

GMT13 said:

bhstewie said:

Again lots of posts on people’s views on gender and on what legislation says and how people are interpreting it.

Why do people need legislation to tell them how they should behave?

Do people really think the way this teacher is reported as treating this student was decent or polite?

Is it how you’d like to be treated?

His account, if you actually read it, is that he was decent and polite. He avoided using the male name (or any name when referring to her for that matter) because that would be tacit approval of the transition without her parents consent. The bullying claim comes because he wrote her female name when listing the team for a female competition on the board. It'd be a bit fking weird if he wrote a male name to compete in a female competition would it not?

This 'decent and polite' thing you keep going on about, as if your views give you some sort of moral high ground, is completely wrong. Supporting such delusion until irreversible damage is done to young people's bodies, is definitely not 'decent and polite', it's horrific.

Trust me it really doesn't take much to have the moral high ground on some of the views on this subject.

You don't have to agree with or fully understand all of this stuff to know that if someone is asking you to call them Sarah you don't call them Steve because you think your views trump theirs.

[Who_Goes_Blue]

andyA700 said:

sugerbear said:

irc said:

So the student wanted to be male but still be a girl for the purposes of entering competition. Logical.

They were eligible for the competition. That’s all you need to worry about.

If that is correct, then the pupil was misgendering themselves.
You can't have it all ways.

But that is exactly how they want it, and to be able to flip flop between sides whenever they want and for people to just go along with it.

[turbobloke]

chrispmartha said:

GMT13 said:

bhstewie said:

Again lots of posts on people’s views on gender and on what legislation says and how people are interpreting it.

Why do people need legislation to tell them how they should behave?

Do people really think the way this teacher is reported as treating this student was decent or polite?

Is it how you’d like to be treated?

His account, if you actually read it, is that he was decent and polite. He avoided using the male name (or any name when referring to her for that matter) because that would be tacit approval of the transition without her parents consent. The bullying claim comes because he wrote her female name when listing the team for a female competition on the board. It'd be a bit fking weird if he wrote a male name to compete in a female competition would it not?

This 'decent and polite' thing you keep going on about, as if your views give you some sort of moral high ground, is completely wrong. Supporting such delusion until irreversible damage is done to young people's bodies, is definitely not 'decent and polite', it's horrific.

It wouldn’t be that weird writing a ‘male name’ on a white board in a ‘female’ competition.

It’s letters on a board, I thought Gender Criticals only care about Biology?

Post content claiming to know what other people think about or care about, particularly in a leading and pejorative question, is just an opposing viewpoint wrapped in rhetoric. In this case, together with a dubious analogy, it avoids the core matter which is how schools respond - policy.

Gender Criticals, invented name calling on top. There's not much learning from history here. In a related context, the independent Inclusion At Work Panel examined diversity and inclusion practices in public and private organisations and found, in a report published this week, that such initiatives are rarely based on solid evidence and are often counterproductive or even outside the law.

Having already received juvenile abuse for mentioning gov't guidance while agreeing that there'a no reason for edu professionals not te be polite, there may now be more incoming, it'll change nothing. Such is the low bar of a typical NP&E thread covering these matters.

[bitchstewie]

Hey turbobloke apologies but I think I missed your answer to this one.

bhstewie said:

Afraid I’m struggling with the word salad.

Was what the teacher said polite and decent?

It isn’t a trick question.

And if you mean ScottHill no it wasn’t.

Like I said it isn't a trick question.

Just a yes or no will do.

[chrispmartha]

Who_Goes_Blue said:

andyA700 said:

sugerbear said:

irc said:

So the student wanted to be male but still be a girl for the purposes of entering competition. Logical.

They were eligible for the competition. That’s all you need to worry about.

If that is correct, then the pupil was misgendering themselves.
You can't have it all ways.

But that is exactly how they want it, and to be able to flip flop between sides whenever they want and for people to just go along with it.

Do ‘they’?

Do you think Trans people are an homogenous group of people?

[JagLover]

chrispmartha said:

Who_Goes_Blue said:

andyA700 said:

sugerbear said:

irc said:

So the student wanted to be male but still be a girl for the purposes of entering competition. Logical.

They were eligible for the competition. That’s all you need to worry about.

If that is correct, then the pupil was misgendering themselves.
You can't have it all ways.

But that is exactly how they want it, and to be able to flip flop between sides whenever they want and for people to just go along with it.

Do ‘they’?

Do you think Trans people are an homogenous group of people?

Not addressed to me but "they" may refer to attention seeking teenage girls who have embraced the latest fad. Such as the notorious example of one who passed a note to their teacher each day of what their pronouns would be for that day.

[Rufus Stone]

bhstewie said:

Hey turbobloke apologies but I think I missed your answer to this one.

bhstewie said:

Afraid I’m struggling with the word salad.

Was what the teacher said polite and decent?

It isn’t a trick question.

And if you mean ScottHill no it wasn’t.

Like I said it isn't a trick question.

Just a yes or no will do.

You appear to be ignoring the teachers version of events. Why is that?

[chrispmartha]

JagLover said:

chrispmartha said:

Who_Goes_Blue said:

andyA700 said:

sugerbear said:

irc said:

So the student wanted to be male but still be a girl for the purposes of entering competition. Logical.

They were eligible for the competition. That’s all you need to worry about.

If that is correct, then the pupil was misgendering themselves.
You can't have it all ways.

But that is exactly how they want it, and to be able to flip flop between sides whenever they want and for people to just go along with it.

Do ‘they’?

Do you think Trans people are an homogenous group of people?

Not addressed to me but "they" may refer to attention seeking teenage girls who have embraced the latest fad. Such as the notorious example of one who passed a note to their teacher each day of what their pronouns would be for that day.

Point stands, do you use individual instances to label everyone in that group?

[chrispmartha]

Rufus Stone said:

bhstewie said:

Hey turbobloke apologies but I think I missed your answer to this one.

bhstewie said:

Afraid I’m struggling with the word salad.

Was what the teacher said polite and decent?

It isn’t a trick question.

And if you mean ScottHill no it wasn’t.

Like I said it isn't a trick question.

Just a yes or no will do.

You appear to be ignoring the teachers version of events. Why is that?

Why couldn’t the teacher allow the student into the female competition but still use the pupils preferred name? Or at least ask the student which name they wanted to go by in the competition?

[bitchstewie]

Rufus Stone said:

You appear to be ignoring the teachers version of events. Why is that?

Because his version of events is still pretty gross.

"I believe the student was immersed in a cult. I believe transgender ideology is a cult and should not be encouraged and supported in schools."

Tells me enough to form that view.

Why on earth would you use or write down a name someone has explicitly said they don't want you to use?

[MickC]

bhstewie said:

I always find it odd that when faced between simply being decent and polite to someone who's probably not having the easiest of times and who would appreciate a little support or being completely and deliberately obnoxious to them on purpose how many people will try to defend someone taking the being completely and deliberately obnoxious to them on purpose approach.

How do you know they were being deliberately obnoxious? Even if they tried to avoid the issue and call them they/their or other non gender pronouns I bet the person would have taken offence. If you want respect for your views, the way to do it is to ask and persuade and respect THEIR views too, not try to force someone else to have to 'respect' your own views, then have them sacked if they don't.

Also, this is a 60 year old MATHS teacher. Maths teachers are not known for their philosophy knowledge, maths at that level is pretty much set in stone, and his mindset will probably reflect that. We should not loose a (presumably) decent Maths teacher over this stuff.

[Timothy Bucktu]

Luckily the Socialist utopia of Scotland has enacted laws to see this exact sort of vile classroom violence result in jail time! And not a moment too soon I say...

[GMT13]

bhstewie said:

Because his version of events is still pretty gross.

"I believe the student was immersed in a cult. I believe transgender ideology is a cult and should not be encouraged and supported in schools."

Tells me enough to form that view.

Why on earth would you use or write down a name someone has explicitly said they don't want you to use?

Body Integrity Dysphoria or 'Transability' has many similarities with Gender Dysphoria. The sufferer wishes to identify as disabled and it can result in harmful consequences such as self amputation.

With Body Integrity Disorder there is a recognition that there is a mental illness at play that should be treated. Self amputation certainly isn't encouraged in order to be polite. There is a diagnosis and cognitive behavioural therapy offered as treatment.

Obviously with the very similar condition, Gender Dysphoria, amputation and other disfigurement is actively encouraged. Even worse, it's encouraged in school age children.

[turbobloke]

GMT13 said:

bhstewie said:

Because his version of events is still pretty gross.

"I believe the student was immersed in a cult. I believe transgender ideology is a cult and should not be encouraged and supported in schools."

Tells me enough to form that view.

Why on earth would you use or write down a name someone has explicitly said they don't want you to use?

Body Integrity Dysphoria or 'Transability' has many similarities with Gender Dysphoria. The sufferer wishes to identify as disabled and it can result in harmful consequences such as self amputation.

With Body Integrity Disorder there is a recognition that there is a mental illness at play that should be treated. Self amputation certainly isn't encouraged in order to be polite. There is a diagnosis and cognitive behavioural therapy offered as treatment.

Obviously with the very similar condition, Gender Dysphoria, amputation and other disfigurement is actively encouraged. Even worse, it's encouraged in school age children.

It'll all work out if teachers ignore guidelines - just teach maths and be polite.
/irony

[8.4L 154]

Is nobody concerned about why there was a girls only math's test in the first place. Presumably with prizes as the children were clambering to participate.

Do girls need separate quizzes because of biological (dis)advantages in maths. Was there an equivalent boys test, had the school done a proper assessment on the impact of segregated testing and it's PSED towards other protected characteristics which might be indirectly discriminated against, particularly when they know one of those pc's most likely to be affected is present in the class.

Can segregated maths testing be justified or was it just another tool for harassment.