Banning the Burqini...

[BJG1]

Prizam said:

Haven't read the whole thread, but...

When i go to Qatar, If i went on a public beach in normal or long length shorts, i would be thrown in jail. Very very quickly. And jail out there is not nice. Really not nice! And i would be there for a very long time. And then promptly deported never to return.


In Qatar, sticking two fingers up at some one is a really serious offence. Again, probably jail or some serious bother at least.

Qatar's rules are wrong though, why would we want to be more like that? A huge part of our culture is freedom of expression and choice. This is not something many middle eastern countries have and they are much the poorer for it.

[lionelf]

BJG1 said:

lionelf said:

Countdown said:

It's not only a stupid, moronic law by the French. It's contrary to basic western values.

Or seeks to uphold them dependent upon your stand point.

Channel 4 news made this point last night. It's Liberalism v Liberalism in a way.

No it isn't, it's liberalism vs authoritarianism/fascism.

A liberal would condemn many aspects of Islam but not seek to impose their own values on somebody else through law. There can be no argument made that this rule is I'm anyway liberal.

Of course they would seek to impose their values on somebody else by law, where should I begin?

Equal oppotunites for women
Equal pay for women
Freedom from oppression

The list of laws imposing western values on non-westerners is endless.

[Alpinestars]

BJG1 said:

Qatar's rules are wrong though, why would we want to be more like that? A huge part of our culture is freedom of expression and choice. This is not something many middle eastern countries have and they are much the poorer for it.

Agree.

And the rule is not designed to differentiate between one section of society and another.

[Mothersruin]

BJG1 said:

Mothersruin said:

I'm not a racist.

Explain why I'm a racist? What country was she from?

You are racist because you support an incredibly racist rule. You can argue a religion isn't a race if you like and substitute racist for bigot but the point is still the same. You are dehumanising a person because they look different from you and you're scared of that. You are happy for armed police to force a woman to remove her clothes because someone of the same race as her carried out a terrorist attack. You are refusing to look at these people as a diverse range of individuals and lumping them all into your own warped view of their beliefs and values.

I couldn't give a st what anyone looks like. I do give a st about western civilisation being undermined by a Stone Age, sexist, homophobic, backward religion being given carte blanche by a bunch of hand wringing apologists who who shout loudest. I'm sick of it.

As I made very clear. I'm super happy for anyone to embrace our way of life and enjoy the wonderful life we've battled hard to achieve. Our rules though. If you'd prefer different rules, there's probably somewhere better for you. Thanks for coming, sorry it didn't work out.

Simple.

If that makes me a racist, then so be it. Probably only in your, and your likes, eyes. I'll cope with that.

[BJG1]

lionelf said:

Of course they would seek to impose their values on somebody else by law, where should I begin?

Equal oppotunites for women
Equal pay for women
Freedom from oppression

The list of laws imposing western values on non-westerners is endless.

Those aren't impositions of values, they are freedoms from imposition. If a woman wants to earn less or if somebody wants to be oppressed they are free to do so.

[BJG1]

Mothersruin said:

I couldn't give a st what anyone looks like. I do give a st about western civilisation being undermined by a Stone Age, sexist, homophobic, backward religion being given carte blanche by a bunch of hand wringing apologists who who shout loudest. I'm sick of it.

As I made very clear. I'm super happy for anyone to embrace our way of life and enjoy the wonderful life we've battled hard to achieve. Our rules though. If you'd prefer different rules, there's probably somewhere better for you. Thanks for coming, sorry it didn't work out.

Simple.

If that makes me a racist, then so be it. Probably only in your, and your likes, eyes. I'll cope with that.

What are you on about "our way of life"? Judging by your posts, I think it's probable I live about as different a lifestyle from you as your average Muslim does.

If you don't care what someone looks like why do you want to tell somebody on a beach they need to look different?

[anonymous-user]

Just wondering what the score is if a non-Muslim woman sits on a beach next to a Muslim woman, both with covered arms and legs and headdress? Do they both get done? Say their husbands and kids are in the water and getting some sun but they need to cover themselves because they got burnt the day before or are just covering up an embarrassing or delicate condition, how do the authorities distinguish between them?

[BJG1]

anonymous said:

[redacted]

They'll just arrest the brown ones.

[Mothersruin]

BJG1 said:

Mothersruin said:

I couldn't give a st what anyone looks like. I do give a st about western civilisation being undermined by a Stone Age, sexist, homophobic, backward religion being given carte blanche by a bunch of hand wringing apologists who who shout loudest. I'm sick of it.

As I made very clear. I'm super happy for anyone to embrace our way of life and enjoy the wonderful life we've battled hard to achieve. Our rules though. If you'd prefer different rules, there's probably somewhere better for you. Thanks for coming, sorry it didn't work out.

Simple.

If that makes me a racist, then so be it. Probably only in your, and your likes, eyes. I'll cope with that.

What are you on about "our way of life"? Judging by your posts, I think it's probable I live about as different a lifestyle from you as your average Muslim does.

If you don't care what someone looks like why do you want to tell somebody on a beach they need to look different?

I now live a bog standard rural way of life. It's quiet, everyone is extremely nice to each other, there's zero friction. That said, the call to prayer is annoying, especially as they practice on a Tuesday evening and they're rubbish. Oddly were surrounded by different nationalities. Next door is a German chap, across the road is a French couple living next door to an Australian/Belgium couple and my Indian wife loves it.

This is after over 13 years of living and working in the Middle East and North Africa. I wholeheartedly apologies for disliking Islam a bit. But I've been up close and personal and it can be an extremely ugly thing. Like many religions I guess.

[Mothersruin]

Alpinestars said:

Mothersruin said:

Sports are logical. Where women and men can compete equally, they all ready do. That's a no brainer.

The rest are antiquated and shouldn't happen in a modern society but they'll die out in time.

I take it you're happy with gender segregation in today's British society?

Darts, snooker, pool etc etc. excuses excuses.

Happy? It doesn't bother me, and as long as it's not belittling women, I don't care.

The case in point, I suspect the woman dressed that way out of her own free will. Why does it bother you when a woman expresses her desire to dress a particular way?

Free will my arse. She'll have been waiting for her husband who'd have rocked up wearing a tiny pair of shorts asking for sun cream to be rubbed into his back.

[BJG1]

Mothersruin said:

I now live a bog standard rural way of life. It's quiet, everyone is extremely nice to each other, there's zero friction. That said, the call to prayer is annoying, especially as they practice on a Tuesday evening and they're rubbish. Oddly were surrounded by different nationalities. Next door is a German chap, across the road is a French couple living next door to an Australian/Belgium couple and my Indian wife loves it.

This is after over 13 years of living and working in the Middle East and North Africa. I wholeheartedly apologies for disliking Islam a bit. But I've been up close and personal and it can be an extremely ugly thing. Like many religions I guess.

I'm not a fan of islam (or any religion). You don't have to be to not want armed police making women undress

[Mothersruin]

BJG1 said:

Mothersruin said:

I now live a bog standard rural way of life. It's quiet, everyone is extremely nice to each other, there's zero friction. That said, the call to prayer is annoying, especially as they practice on a Tuesday evening and they're rubbish. Oddly were surrounded by different nationalities. Next door is a German chap, across the road is a French couple living next door to an Australian/Belgium couple and my Indian wife loves it.

This is after over 13 years of living and working in the Middle East and North Africa. I wholeheartedly apologies for disliking Islam a bit. But I've been up close and personal and it can be an extremely ugly thing. Like many religions I guess.

I'm not a fan of islam (or any religion). You don't have to be to not want armed police making women undress

You're not understanding anything are you.

As I said, she's purely the result of how the majority (so it seems, happy to be proved wrong) of French people are very scared and deeply distrustful of any indicator of Islam. Rightly or wrongly depending on our views, obviously.

What would you do if you were them? I hear you condemn but I don't hear your answers.

Btw, French Polic are armed. If it had been a ten year old being warned for littering, they'd still have been armed

[anonymous-user]

Mothersruin said:

desolate said:

Mothersruin said:

Anyone who arrives in a country and demands it's changed to suit them.

judging by your posts you believe that they shouldn't be able to go to a mosque?

I don't deny we need to address the issue of Radical Islam and related terrorism but I see muslims intergrated into society every day I leave the house

Are you happy with sex segregation in the UK?

I have zero issue with personal prayer, not my thing but I understand that some need it.

My son goes to a single sex school and my daughter was as a single sex school until last term and is now moving to a mixed school. There is sex segregation in other walks of life.

I am confirmed atheist.

[Alpinestars]

mothersruin said:

This is after over 13 years of living and working in the Middle East and North Africa. I wholeheartedly apologies for disliking Islam a bit. But I've been up close and personal and it can be an extremely ugly thing. Like many religions I guess.

Why didn't you embrace their way of life if your mantra is "when in Rome.."

[Mothersruin]

desolate said:

Mothersruin said:

desolate said:

Mothersruin said:

Anyone who arrives in a country and demands it's changed to suit them.

judging by your posts you believe that they shouldn't be able to go to a mosque?

I don't deny we need to address the issue of Radical Islam and related terrorism but I see muslims intergrated into society every day I leave the house

Are you happy with sex segregation in the UK?

I have zero issue with personal prayer, not my thing but I understand that some need it.

My son goes to a single sex school and my daughter was as a single sex school until last term and is now moving to a mixed school. There is sex segregation in other walks of life.

I am confirmed atheist.

There shouldn't be though, should there, today, 2016?

[Alpinestars]

Mothersruin said:

Free will my arse. She'll have been waiting for her husband who'd have rocked up wearing a tiny pair of shorts asking for sun cream to be rubbed into his back.

Evidence? Or is that your view of women?

[Alpinestars]

Mothersruin said:

There shouldn't be though, should there, today, 2016?

There you go imposing your world view on people who freely choose to so something different to you.

[Mothersruin]

Alpinestars said:

mothersruin said:

This is after over 13 years of living and working in the Middle East and North Africa. I wholeheartedly apologies for disliking Islam a bit. But I've been up close and personal and it can be an extremely ugly thing. Like many religions I guess.

Why didn't you embrace their way of life if your mantra is "when in Rome.."

I completely complied with their laws, respected their religion and culture and erred on the side of caution if I was unsure of anything. At no time did I even hint at them changing stuff for my benefit.

[Alpinestars]

Mothersruin said:

I completely complied with their laws, respected their religion and culture and erred on the side of caution if I was unsure of anything. At no time did I even hint at them changing stuff for my benefit.

Those companies/countries provided you a living and a career and your pay back is the hate you're showing. It's very sad, but you're not seeing the irony of the stance you're taking.

[Mothersruin]

Alpinestars said:

Mothersruin said:

Free will my arse. She'll have been waiting for her husband who'd have rocked up wearing a tiny pair of shorts asking for sun cream to be rubbed into his back.

Evidence? Or is that your view of women?

Just having seen it on a regular basis.

The saddest is seeing young girls suddenly be wrapped up when they hit puberty. They go from carefree to seemly having the weight of the world on their shoulders.

Just observation and my interpretation.

I only ever speak for myself with my comments. I don't claim to represent anyone else.