No Charges over G20 man's death

[grumbledoak]

Dr Phibes said:

But how many times did the office ask him to move on, any rational person would think Coppers in full riot gear behind me asking to move on and there are riots in the capital, best just do as they ask.

(Smirks at 'office')

Try being arsey with the CRS (French riot police). You'd get a thorough kicking, and there wouldn't be any video evidence.

[Dr Phibes]

grumbledoak said:

Dr Phibes said:

But how many times did the officer ask him to move on, any rational person would think Coppers in full riot gear behind me asking to move on and there are riots in the capital, best just do as they ask.

(Smirks at 'office')

Try being arsey with the CRS (French riot police). You'd get a thorough kicking, and there wouldn't be any video evidence.

Amended my mistake, too true on the above in fact that would be the case for most Euro police forces.

Edited by Dr Phibes on Thursday 22 July 19:30

[Lost soul]

Trax said:

How much evidence do they need? It seemed quiet clear he was assaulted by someone in a yellow jacket, whilst walking away with his hands in his pockets, he dies shortly after. WTF?

It is just unbeleivable

[ZR1cliff]

musclecarmad said:

I agree. I don't think the guy should have been sauntering along in the middle of a protest who knows what he could have been up to.

It's not as if the copper beat him over the head ten times.

I say good on the police for once - people should have more respect and he should have got out of the way.

Have you really had any experiences with riot police? I think not. On the few occasions I have, they are really up for it. Call it adrenaline or mob security, some have real difficulty in seperating where the real threat is and go in swinging at anyone. Sometimes they are like a legalised mob.

Perhaps Mr Tomlinson had seen the same thing and was just walking home after a drink after work when riot old bill gave him a dig - because he didn't jump when they said "jump"?

One thing concerns me is, the third post mortem backed up the second pm in that Mr Tomlinson was struck by a blunt instrument that contributed towards his death. If this is the case then why haven't the police opened up a murder investigation?

[BruceV8]

Dr Phibes said:

grumbledoak said:

Dr Phibes said:

But how many times did the officer ask him to move on, any rational person would think Coppers in full riot gear behind me asking to move on and there are riots in the capital, best just do as they ask.

(Smirks at 'office')

Try being arsey with the CRS (French riot police). You'd get a thorough kicking, and there wouldn't be any video evidence.

Amended my mistake, too true on the above in fact that would be the case for most Euro police forces.

Edited by Dr Phibes on Thursday 22 July 19:30

They're welcome to it. We have a completely different legal and policing tradition in this country. In general, the police in the UK don't go around shoving people over - even if they are sauntering a little too cockily. One day it might be you that gets the thorough kicking for being insufficiently servile to the police if we go down the Euro route.

[ExChrispy Porker]

odyssey2200 said:

But they hot a guy who was already under investigation to do the post mortem. Why would you do that in such a public case? Perhaps to cause confusion & cast enough doubt to get the case dropped?

Who do you mean by 'they'?
The pathologist is appointed by the coroner. Are you claiming some kind of conspiracy involving the coroner

[Tsippy]

Musclecarmad: Maybe the police should therefore question why they have lost respect in this country and perhaps look at the differences between themselves and the police in the USA?

Edited by Tsippy on Thursday 22 July 19:49

[grumbledoak]

BruceV8 said:

They're welcome to it.

I wasn't suggesting we adopt continental policies. Merely pointing out that our own Police, even the Riot Police, are pretty well behaved. Tomlinson was not treated that badly in the circumstances, and the officer couldn't have known he had health issues. Unless there is evidence we've not been shown, the outcome so far is ok, and his death just unfortunate.

[BruceV8]

grumbledoak said:

BruceV8 said:

They're welcome to it.

I wasn't suggesting we adopt continental policies. Merely pointing out that our own Police, even the Riot Police, are pretty well behaved. Tomlinson was not treated that badly in the circumstances, and the officer couldn't have known he had health issues. Unless there is evidence we've not been shown, the outcome so far is ok, and his death just unfortunate.

I agree that his death was unfortunate, and the police officer had no way of knowing about any pre-existing medical conditions. But I'd also agree with ZR1Cliff's assessment of police (or anyone else in that position) on public order duties. They can get fired up and lamp people who didn't need to be lamped - and I think thats what happened here. I also think that is being treated badly enough. I expect more from our police.

[Hungry Freak]

This was police brutality, pure and simple. I mean, if it was a couple of chavs that pushed him over it would be wrong and everyone would say so, but because it's the police people accept it.

Protesters are overwhelmingly calm and decent folk. How hard would it be for shills to make protests violent? And who would gain from it?

Edited by Hungry Freak on Thursday 22 July 20:07

[grumbledoak]

Hungry Freak said:

This was police brutality, pure and simple. Protesters are overwhelmingly calm and decent folk. How hard would it be for shills to make protests violent? And who would gain from it?

Fool. Go protest in France, or Spain, or Italy.

[Hungry Freak]

grumbledoak said:

Hungry Freak said:

This was police brutality, pure and simple. Protesters are overwhelmingly calm and decent folk. How hard would it be for shills to make protests violent? And who would gain from it?

Fool. Go protest in France, or Spain, or Italy.

Just because conditions are a bit better here still doesn't make it right.

[paddyhasneeds]

I remembered an article from The Mail at the time, which I managed to find:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1168850/...

[tybo]

musclecarmad said:

i think if a copper said jump you should bloody well jump. Look at when you are in spain or america the respect people have for the police - no one dare even look at them otherwise they get a kicking. That's how it should be. Law and order and respect.

Edited by musclecarmad on Thursday 22 July 19:42

That's called 'Fear', not "respect".

Would you really like to live in fear of the police?

[paddyhasneeds]

musclecarmad said:

go to dubai and mess with the police, or usa, or most of europe, or russia etc - you would get fked up.

That's the whole point here. The guy wasn't "messing" with the Police by any stretch of the imagination.

[Hungry Freak]

tybo said:

musclecarmad said:

i think if a copper said jump you should bloody well jump. Look at when you are in spain or america the respect people have for the police - no one dare even look at them otherwise they get a kicking. That's how it should be. Law and order and respect.

Edited by musclecarmad on Thursday 22 July 19:42

That's called 'Fear', not "respect".

Would you really like to live in fear of the police?

When people fear the state, there is tyranny.

[tybo]

musclecarmad said:

tybo said:

musclecarmad said:

i think if a copper said jump you should bloody well jump. Look at when you are in spain or america the respect people have for the police - no one dare even look at them otherwise they get a kicking. That's how it should be. Law and order and respect.

Edited by musclecarmad on Thursday 22 July 19:42

That's called 'Fear', not "respect".

Would you really like to live in fear of the police?

good point but i'd really like people to respect the police and if a police man tells you to shut up and button it then you should do so.

I honestly think this country is too soft

So, you'd prefer if people were not even allowed to hold an opinion?

[ZR1cliff]

musclecarmad said:

and yes, i think if a copper said jump you should bloody well jump. Look at when you are in spain or america the respect people have for the police - no one dare even look at them otherwise they get a kicking. That's how it should be. Law and order and respect. If you mess about with a cop, they should mess about with you.

That is if you are initially causing a grievance and threatening the OB. The fact is he had nothing to do with the riots and was going about his normal daily business in an area he worked and lived in.

I don't share the same view, if a copper told me to jump while going about my business I'd be more likely to tell him to get lost in no uncertain terms. Just because they don a uniform of the law it gives them no legal right to order people around as they please.

[Dixie68]

HardToLove said:

Dixie68 said:

Corsair7 said:

Dixie68 said:

Hasn't this already been done to death, if you'll excuse the unintentional pun.

How? The decision has only just been made.

THAT decision has only just been made, the discussions on PH have been wide ranging.

Oh well if its been discussed here thats settled then... Tosser,this was someone's Father you complete asswipe

Oh get a life Wendy. Where did I say it was right for him to be dead?

[XG332]

poo at Paul's said:

No charges are brought when a (female) copper beats up another (female) copper

Was this one caught on video. The police could sell that and make loads.