Meanwhile, In Syria

[QuantumTokoloshi]

Zod said:

fblm said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Zod said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Did the USA not tacitly support another terrorist group in the recent past? The one which blew up Canary wharf, Manchester and Brighton? I guess they were also moderates.

Evidence? Something credible would be nice.

Google + NORAID / friends of Sinn Fein.

He's right Zod. Our good friends the Americans openly funneled millions to PIRA.

I did ask for credible evidence. I'm very aware of NORAID. If he has credible evidence of any US Government link to NORAID, I'd love to see it.

Read my comment carefully, specifically the tacit support part.

[anonymous-user]

Zod said:

fblm said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Zod said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Did the USA not tacitly support another terrorist group in the recent past? The one which blew up Canary wharf, Manchester and Brighton? I guess they were also moderates.

Evidence? Something credible would be nice.

Google + NORAID / friends of Sinn Fein.

He's right Zod. Our good friends the Americans openly funneled millions to PIRA.

I did ask for credible evidence. I'm very aware of NORAID. If he has credible evidence of any US Government link to NORAID, I'd love to see it.

If you're very aware of NORAID then you'll know it operated openly, the purpose and scale of its fundraising known by everyone; the US could have shut it down overnight but didn't. That is tacit support. 'Credible evidence' of their inaction other than the inaction its self? Can't help you there but if you like; try sending $ overseas to a terror group they don't 'endorse' and see how far you get. In the US, support for the IRA ran deep. Heard of Peter King? 2 years ago he was Chairman of the Homeland Security Committee. Even the Irish government described him an avowed supporter of the IRA! http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/artic...

Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 1st October 17:50

[AreOut]

Transmitter Man said:

Putin's strategy is to help ASSdolf defeat the MODERATES leaving only ASSdolf and the universally recognized TERRORISTS of AQ & ISH*T. He is counting on the USA/EU and international community to decide that ASSdolf is a better alternative than AQ and ISH*T and will join the Russia-ASSdolf-Iran axis in defeating TERRORISM in Syria.

Phil

what a pathetic post

you spout the same st for years here like a broken record, you don't feel bored like at all?

[Zod]

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Zod said:

fblm said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Zod said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Did the USA not tacitly support another terrorist group in the recent past? The one which blew up Canary wharf, Manchester and Brighton? I guess they were also moderates.

Evidence? Something credible would be nice.

Google + NORAID / friends of Sinn Fein.

He's right Zod. Our good friends the Americans openly funneled millions to PIRA.

I did ask for credible evidence. I'm very aware of NORAID. If he has credible evidence of any US Government link to NORAID, I'd love to see it.

Read my comment carefully, specifically the tacit support part.

This is getting tedious: credible evidence, please.

[Zod]

fblm said:

Zod said:

fblm said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Zod said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Did the USA not tacitly support another terrorist group in the recent past? The one which blew up Canary wharf, Manchester and Brighton? I guess they were also moderates.

Evidence? Something credible would be nice.

Google + NORAID / friends of Sinn Fein.

He's right Zod. Our good friends the Americans openly funneled millions to PIRA.

I did ask for credible evidence. I'm very aware of NORAID. If he has credible evidence of any US Government link to NORAID, I'd love to see it.

If you're very aware of NORAID then you'll know it operated openly, the purpose and scale of its fundraising known by everyone; the US could have shut it down overnight but didn't. That is tacit support. 'Credible evidence' of their inaction other than the inaction its self? Can't help you there but if you like; try sending $ overseas to a terror group they don't 'endorse' and see how far you get. In the US, support for the IRA ran deep. Heard of Peter King? 2 years ago he was Chairman of the Homeland Security Committee. Even the Irish government described him an avowed supporter of the IRA! http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/artic...

Edited by fblm on Thursday 1st October 17:50

It's difficult to shut down a network like that without solid evidence. The US government never supported NORAID, tacitly or otherwise. That certain corrupt lawmakers did so does not mean that the government or state did.

[anonymous-user]

Asterix said:

It's messy in the UK already.

No it's not. Pretty close to the top of the pile, compared to the rest.

[Asterix]

Jimboka said:

Asterix said:

It's messy in the UK already.

No it's not. Pretty close to the top of the pile, compared to the rest.

British Soldiers beheaded on the capital's streets?

Not messy at all.

[anonymous-user]

Asterix said:

Jimboka said:

Asterix said:

It's messy in the UK already.

No it's not. Pretty close to the top of the pile, compared to the rest.

British Soldiers beheaded on the capital's streets?

Not messy at all.

1 I recall. The inadequate cretins that did it are banged up.
Funny how half the world would come here given half the chance, must be so wonderful and unmessy where those poor sods come from..

[anonymous-user]

Zod said:

t's difficult to shut down a network like that without solid evidence.

Oh the irony. Have you heard of the war on terror?

[Burwood]

What is tedious is the usual slagging the U.S. Perfect they aren't but happy they are around.

[Stevanos]

Can people not stick to the facts a little more here. FML



There is one big cluster fk and yes the UK did not help matters, can we just agree that whilst accepting we thought there was a glimmer of hope on the horizon of these basket case countries sorting themselves out!



Let us discuss what is next shall we?

[anonymous-user]

Burwood said:

What is tedious is the usual slagging the U.S. Perfect they aren't but happy they are around.

Confused I am, if Confucius or Yoda you are.

[Transmitter Man]

AreOut said:

what a pathetic post

you spout the same st for years here like a broken record, you don't feel bored like at all?

Areout,

Would you like a small wager with any winnings going to charity of your choice.

I'll give you 5:1 odds.

Phil

[MikeT66]

fblm said:

Zod said:

fblm said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Zod said:

QuantumTokoloshi said:

Did the USA not tacitly support another terrorist group in the recent past? The one which blew up Canary wharf, Manchester and Brighton? I guess they were also moderates.

Evidence? Something credible would be nice.

Google + NORAID / friends of Sinn Fein.

He's right Zod. Our good friends the Americans openly funneled millions to PIRA.

I did ask for credible evidence. I'm very aware of NORAID. If he has credible evidence of any US Government link to NORAID, I'd love to see it.

If you're very aware of NORAID then you'll know it operated openly, the purpose and scale of its fundraising known by everyone; the US could have shut it down overnight but didn't. That is tacit support. 'Credible evidence' of their inaction other than the inaction its self? Can't help you there but if you like; try sending $ overseas to a terror group they don't 'endorse' and see how far you get. In the US, support for the IRA ran deep. Heard of Peter King? 2 years ago he was Chairman of the Homeland Security Committee. Even the Irish government described him an avowed supporter of the IRA! http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/artic...

Edited by fblm on Thursday 1st October 17:50

I'd agree with Quantum and fblm myself. The US government never actively sought out stopping the IRA fundraising in America - until 9/11. The attack on the World Trade Centre was the death-knell for IRA fundraising - suddenly the US had to be seen to be doing something once terrorism arrived on it's own shores.

Back on track, personally I'm fking fed up with our meddling in the Middle East. Yes, Assad's regime isn't perfect, but like Gaddafi and Hussein they are a necessary evil, and to paraphrase Monty Python, they are perhaps the only ones who can keep and semblance of law and order in places like that. What I really despise is the West's duplicity in their relationships with these regimes - one minute they are the enemy, the next our friends, then suddenly we want rid. FFS, leave it alone - it's not our place to decide on the future of other countries and their governments - imagine if Saudi Arabia decided they wanted 'regime change' in the UK and started steps to make it happen - no wonder no-one trusts us.

[QuantumTokoloshi]

Stevanos said:

Can people not stick to the facts a little more here. FML



There is one big cluster fk and yes the UK did not help matters, can we just agree that whilst accepting we thought there was a glimmer of hope on the horizon of these basket case countries sorting themselves out!



Let us discuss what is next shall we?

The worry is if the USA and Saudi / Qatar proceed to escalate this with Russia, they did not like being told, get out by the Russian and Syrian government. He has played nice with Turkey though, by not targeting the kurdish fighters.

The irony of Saudi complaining about civilian casualties is almost a tragic comedy, considering the wholesale slaughter in Yemen.

This is no longer a proxy war, so an escalation or accident, false flag can have dire consequences. I am wondering what Israel will now do, as they have been quiet of late.

Russia has just scuppered the US and Turkish plan for a no flyzone over Syria, which would have led to the collapse of Assad.

This move by Putin either puts Assad back in power over most of Syria or it leads to a hot escalation with USA, France, possibly Israel, UK and Turkey on one side, and Iran, China. Russia, Hezbollah and Assad on the other.

Putin has gambled big here.

I did like the Lavarov comment, "if it looks like a terrorist, walks like a terrorist and acts like a terrorist, it is a terrorist and will be targeted." This narrative that is being spun of " good crazies" which includes Al Nusra / AL Qaeda vs "Bad crazies" is being shown for the rubbish it is.

Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 2nd October 11:33

[FredClogs]

There is a Storyville documentary film on the BBC Iplayer at the moment following a Syrian family over the lat 5 years, it's very good.

[coetzeeh]

QuantumTokoloshi said:

The worry is if the USA and Saudi / Qatar proceed to escalate this with Russia, they did not like being told, get out by the Russian and Syrian government. He has played nice with Turkey though, by not targeting the kurdish fighters.

The irony of Saudi complaining about civilian casualties is almost a tragic comedy, considering the wholesale slaughter in Yemen.

This is no longer a proxy war, so an escalation or accident, false flag can have dire consequences. I am wondering what Israel will now do, as they have been quiet of late.

Russia has just scuppered the US and Turkish plan for a no fly
zone over Syria, which would have led to the collapse of Assad.

This move by Putin either puts Assad back in power over most of Syria or it leads to a hot escalation with USA, France, possibly Israel, UK and Turkey on one side, and Iran, China. Russia, Hezbollah and Assad on the other.

Putin has gambled big here.

I did like the Lavarov comment, if it looks like a terrorist, walks like a terrorist and acts like a terrorist, it is a terrorist and will be targeted. This narrative that is being spun of " good crazies" which includes Al Nusra / AL Qaeda vs "Bad crazies" is being shown for the rubbish it is.

Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 2nd October 07:07

I laughed when I saw Lavarov make the statement on TV. Refreshingly to the point.
In short, if you are in Syria and against Assad your rectum is toast.

[QuantumTokoloshi]

A quick list of the major terrorist groups, excluding the Kurdish groups, opposing Assad. Which of this list is the mythical only slightly crazy "moderate" fundamental Islamists vs the totally crazy "death cult" fundamentalist Islamists.


- Islamic State of Iraq and Levant (ISIS)
- The Islamic Front
- The Islamic Liberation Front
- Jaysh al-Islam
- Harakat al-Islamiyya
- Tajammu Ansar al-Islam (Gathering of the Supporters of Islam)
- Liwa al-Tawhid (Battalion of Monotheism)
- Liwa al-Haqq (Battalion of Truth)
- Al-Nusra (al-Qaeda offshoot) (Seem these are the new good guys, looking at the media spin)
- Yarmouk Martyrs' Brigade
- Martyrs of Syria Brigade
- Free Syrian Army (Partial to a "Daesh" of Sharia law and an atrocity or two)

This list makes me think of the People's Front of Judea vs the Judean People's Front. I am not sure the argument of good guy terrorists vs bad guy terrorists, will hold much water for long in the Syrian context.

Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 2nd October 13:10

[MikeT66]

QuantumTokoloshi said:

A quick list of the major terrorist groups, excluding the Kurdish groups, opposing Assad. Which of this list is the mythical only slightly crazy "moderate" fundamental Islamists vs the totally crazy "death cult" fundamentalist Islamists.


- Islamic State of Iraq and Levant (ISIS)
- The Islamic Front
- The Islamic Liberation Front
- Jaysh al-Islam
- Harakat al-Islamiyya
- Tajammu Ansar al-Islam (Gathering of the Supporters of Islam)
- Liwa al-Tawhid (Battalion of Monotheism)
- Liwa al-Haqq (Battalion of Truth)
- Al-Nusra (al-Qaeda offshoot) (Seem these are the new good guys, looking at the media spin)
- Yarmouk Martyrs' Brigade
- Martyrs of Syria Brigade
- Free Syrian Army (Partial to a "Daesh" of Sharia law and an atrocity or two)

This list makes me think of the People's Front of Judea vs the Judean People's Front. I am not sure the argument of good guy terrorists vs bad guy terrorists, will hold much water for long in the Syrian context.

Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Friday 2nd October 13:10

Were it not for the serious potential consequences and life-shattering events for those civilians unfortunately involved, it would be getting to Pythonesque levels of hilarity in the sheer absurdity of it all.

[zygalski]

So what I learnt today from SKY, BBC etc.
Russian bombs; bad nasty things, lacking accuracy & causing indiscriminate deaths in unimaginably terrible ways.
I suppose our (NATO) air strikes tickle our enemies to death, causing almost no 'collateral' civillian damage.