Meanwhile, In Syria
Discussion
discusdave said:
Art0ir said:
discusdave said:
off topic a little but I've been wondering about this..
how come that the Israelis are more afraid of Iran and it's benevolent Shia Islam then it has of the the Saudi Wahabi/Takfiri.
How come that the so called ISIS and the other 31 flavors of jihadist's from the ME are attacking only secular independent Arab and Muslim countries, not under the control of Washington?
Shouldn't the principal enemy of Saudi Arabia and all those so called radical "Islamist" be the state of Israel?
Shouldn't their main objective be the liberation of Palestine from Israeli occupation?
Yet we have a Saudi regime declaring openly, that it would open it's airspace for the Israeli Air Force, to bomb and destroy another Muslim country, namely Iran??
Don't you find that to be very odd and absolutely bizarre policy, for someone that proclaims it self to be the protector and the cradle of Islam?
The power plays, backstabbing, low key support and general fhow come that the Israelis are more afraid of Iran and it's benevolent Shia Islam then it has of the the Saudi Wahabi/Takfiri.
How come that the so called ISIS and the other 31 flavors of jihadist's from the ME are attacking only secular independent Arab and Muslim countries, not under the control of Washington?
Shouldn't the principal enemy of Saudi Arabia and all those so called radical "Islamist" be the state of Israel?
Shouldn't their main objective be the liberation of Palestine from Israeli occupation?
Yet we have a Saudi regime declaring openly, that it would open it's airspace for the Israeli Air Force, to bomb and destroy another Muslim country, namely Iran??
Don't you find that to be very odd and absolutely bizarre policy, for someone that proclaims it self to be the protector and the cradle of Islam?
kery in the M.E. is nigh incomprehensible.They spent 1700 years butchering each other when it was mostly about what material your head touched when praying. Throw a Jewish state into the mix and the results are what we see.
Wahhabism in particular (KSA's state religion after Mohammad ibn Abd-al-Wahhab and the House of Saud made a pact in the middle of the desert in the 18th century) sees Shia muslims as enemy number 1. Worse than even Christians or Jews.
The aim is to eliminate Shia Islam, them move onto the other Judeo-Christian religions.
Follow the massacres ISIS and "moderate" rebel forces have carried out the past few years in their back yards, mostly other Islamic sects.
Forget North Korea, Russia, Cuba, China... The Kingdom of Saudi Arabia is the greatest threat to Western civilisation we face.
everyday is a school day..
https://www.amazon.com/Kingdom-Arabia-House-Saud/d...
QuantumTokoloshi said:
cheers 
i don't think ill go for the audio recording ... £969.99
ill try the kindle
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=157_1481526772
Well after watching that - my observation.
I am currently watching Sky news. The usual garbage....Goebbels would be proud.
Look at the comments section of the Independent in the link posted earlier.
Look at Clinton spending far more than trump on traditional media exposure and trump focusing his efforts on line....
I don´t really understand. Apart from some morons, no one believes anything these large media organisations puts out anymore as it is continuously exposed as selected truths at best and sometimes lies.
Yet they seem to have their heads in the sand running along with their 20th century way of controlling the message. And seem to be in complete denial that the 21st Century online instant information age is upon us. They seem to be playing in to Mr ruthless Putins hands, it is almost like he has to do nothing and just let western media and their backers dig their own hole.
Well after watching that - my observation.
I am currently watching Sky news. The usual garbage....Goebbels would be proud.
Look at the comments section of the Independent in the link posted earlier.
Look at Clinton spending far more than trump on traditional media exposure and trump focusing his efforts on line....
I don´t really understand. Apart from some morons, no one believes anything these large media organisations puts out anymore as it is continuously exposed as selected truths at best and sometimes lies.
Yet they seem to have their heads in the sand running along with their 20th century way of controlling the message. And seem to be in complete denial that the 21st Century online instant information age is upon us. They seem to be playing in to Mr ruthless Putins hands, it is almost like he has to do nothing and just let western media and their backers dig their own hole.
The Don of Croy said:
Well, we do have access to the Syrian Human Rights Watch. They'll tell us what's what.
Syria is on the wane - the big media (BBC) are hot for Yemen now.
No, no. It is the "Syrian Observatory for Human Rights." Sounds much more official. Syria is on the wane - the big media (BBC) are hot for Yemen now.
The vaunted observatory himself in his living room office in London:
Scoobman said:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=157_1481526772
Well after watching that - my observation.
I am currently watching Sky news. The usual garbage....Goebbels would be proud.
Look at the comments section of the Independent in the link posted earlier.
Look at Clinton spending far more than trump on traditional media exposure and trump focusing his efforts on line....
I don´t really understand. Apart from some morons, no one believes anything these large media organisations puts out anymore as it is continuously exposed as selected truths at best and sometimes lies.
Yet they seem to have their heads in the sand running along with their 20th century way of controlling the message. And seem to be in complete denial that the 21st Century online instant information age is upon us. They seem to be playing in to Mr ruthless Putins hands, it is almost like he has to do nothing and just let western media and their backers dig their own hole.
She is clearly a Russian/Syrian agent, propagating Russian Assad lies about Aleppo. The brave freedom fighters and moderate Islamist fundamentalists are saving lives by killing kafirs and promoting good democratic governance by chopping off heads, burning kafirs alive and killing children. The West should be supporting these freedom fighters and imposing a no fly zone to prevent the bombings of these selfless men, yearning for Islamic sharia freedom.Well after watching that - my observation.
I am currently watching Sky news. The usual garbage....Goebbels would be proud.
Look at the comments section of the Independent in the link posted earlier.
Look at Clinton spending far more than trump on traditional media exposure and trump focusing his efforts on line....
I don´t really understand. Apart from some morons, no one believes anything these large media organisations puts out anymore as it is continuously exposed as selected truths at best and sometimes lies.
Yet they seem to have their heads in the sand running along with their 20th century way of controlling the message. And seem to be in complete denial that the 21st Century online instant information age is upon us. They seem to be playing in to Mr ruthless Putins hands, it is almost like he has to do nothing and just let western media and their backers dig their own hole.
The evil terrorists in Mosul however, are the scourge of the Middle East and should be bombed into oblivion, civilian losses are a price worth paying to destroy this cancer. This "death cult" uses despicable terror tactics to enslave the population, chopping off heads, burning people alive and killing children. The West should be ruthless in the extermination of this abomination.
A typically balanced news story to be found at any good BBC, Sky news outlet near you.
Goebbels was an amateur, Edward Bernays, along with Freud, were the professionals.
Edited by QuantumTokoloshi on Tuesday 13th December 09:57
Scoobman said:
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=157_1481526772
Well after watching that - my observation.
I am currently watching Sky news. The usual garbage....Goebbels would be proud.
Look at the comments section of the Independent in the link posted earlier.
Look at Clinton spending far more than trump on traditional media exposure and trump focusing his efforts on line....
I don´t really understand. Apart from some morons, no one believes anything these large media organisations puts out anymore as it is continuously exposed as selected truths at best and sometimes lies.
Yet they seem to have their heads in the sand running along with their 20th century way of controlling the message. And seem to be in complete denial that the 21st Century online instant information age is upon us. They seem to be playing in to Mr ruthless Putins hands, it is almost like he has to do nothing and just let western media and their backers dig their own hole.
A very interesting watch. But, who is she? Is she properly independent? She does seem to appear on RT a lot. These are genuine questions, not pointed. For what it's worth, I do agree with her analysis. Well after watching that - my observation.
I am currently watching Sky news. The usual garbage....Goebbels would be proud.
Look at the comments section of the Independent in the link posted earlier.
Look at Clinton spending far more than trump on traditional media exposure and trump focusing his efforts on line....
I don´t really understand. Apart from some morons, no one believes anything these large media organisations puts out anymore as it is continuously exposed as selected truths at best and sometimes lies.
Yet they seem to have their heads in the sand running along with their 20th century way of controlling the message. And seem to be in complete denial that the 21st Century online instant information age is upon us. They seem to be playing in to Mr ruthless Putins hands, it is almost like he has to do nothing and just let western media and their backers dig their own hole.
Good point. Is anyone truly independent. I might try and have a dig about to see if I can turn up anything on her.
The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
Scoobman said:
Good point. Is anyone truly independent. I might try and have a dig about to see if I can turn up anything on her.
The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
With RT it's easy to understand and see that they have their own biases and agendas and 'process' their output accordingly.The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
However, with the likes of just about every mainstream Western source we are so conditioned to accept their highly biased output as truth that it is a lot more difficult to actually figure out when they are being truthful and when (most of the time to be honest) it's little more than propaganda designed to shape and manipulate public opinion. The baseline is so far off the truth that its unreal and they have been doing it for decades.
As for the 'fake news' thing which has suddenly materialised as an issue, it's telling that there were laws in the works in the USA prior to the Washington Post introducing it as a 'story' and making it into a talking point. The typical MO of the establishment - figure out what you want to do, then work out a way to get it past the public by getting your tame media contacts to put it out there framed how you want it framed.
It's pretty clear that there is a lot of concern amongst the powers that be that they are losing control of the narrative and that their media manipulation isn't working. Hence, they want to shut down alternate media who the public are now starting to trust more than the stooges in the mainstream.
Lucas Ayde said:
Scoobman said:
Good point. Is anyone truly independent. I might try and have a dig about to see if I can turn up anything on her.
The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
With RT it's easy to understand and see that they have their own biases and agendas and 'process' their output accordingly.The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
However, with the likes of just about every mainstream Western source we are so conditioned to accept their highly biased output as truth that it is a lot more difficult to actually figure out when they are being truthful and when (most of the time to be honest) it's little more than propaganda designed to shape and manipulate public opinion. The baseline is so far off the truth that its unreal and they have been doing it for decades.
As for the 'fake news' thing which has suddenly materialised as an issue, it's telling that there were laws in the works in the USA prior to the Washington Post introducing it as a 'story' and making it into a talking point. The typical MO of the establishment - figure out what you want to do, then work out a way to get it past the public by getting your tame media contacts to put it out there framed how you want it framed.
It's pretty clear that there is a lot of concern amongst the powers that be that they are losing control of the narrative and that their media manipulation isn't working. Hence, they want to shut down alternate media who the public are now starting to trust more than the stooges in the mainstream.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-12-10/senate-qu...
Does the fact that the major news outlets in the west put out propaganda make what RT, SANA, Press TV propagate any more truthful?
It's far easier and somewhat safer for journalists to embed with the regime as compared to 'any' of the opposition groups thereby giving further legitimacy to the regime.
BTW, someone mentioned Iran a while back. From http://www.presstv.com/ Seems the nuclear program's back on the table. Obama must be thinking cutting back on the sanctions and releasing all the $M's from their bank accounts around the world together with allowing them to sell oil was a bit of a mistake.
Phil
It's far easier and somewhat safer for journalists to embed with the regime as compared to 'any' of the opposition groups thereby giving further legitimacy to the regime.
BTW, someone mentioned Iran a while back. From http://www.presstv.com/ Seems the nuclear program's back on the table. Obama must be thinking cutting back on the sanctions and releasing all the $M's from their bank accounts around the world together with allowing them to sell oil was a bit of a mistake.
Phil
Just in case there's a keyboard warrior that either forgot or does not know how the Syrian conflict started back in 2011 here's a brilliant article IMO, explaining all;
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/the-graf...
Phil
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/the-graf...
Phil
Scoobman said:
Good point. Is anyone truly independent. I might try and have a dig about to see if I can turn up anything on her.
The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
Well put, on both Zerohedge and RT. Zerohedge had excellent coverage of the Erdogan family links to ISIS oil sales, but you really have to sift through bilge to find the interesting articles, the comments section can be generously described as eccentric.The weird thing is, is the the main media outlets with their losing credibility came up with the concept of fake news online. When they are in actual fact providing most of the fake news and the ´´fake news´´ sites on line are providing the real news.
So the Official news is the fake news and the Fake News is the real news. What a strange old world.
However on line. Sites like Zero Hedge have good stuff on but you get the impression it is compiled by one paranoid mother in bunker surrounded by tins of beans. So it is about sifting out the conspiracy theory from the fact, which is usually obvious...but sometimes easier said than done.
As an aside -
I have mixed feelings about RT. As on one hand its agenda is to undermine the west and it really digs down into stories that do not appear in western media. And therefore it often provides the most accurate information on what is actually happening in the west. However you have to watch it with two big provisos. It is Putin´s propaganda service so treat with caution and two it is totally hypocritical when taking a moral high ground, as we all know about Putin´s ruthless repression of the media and the like in his own back yard.
RT is the Putin broadcast media, likewise Al Jazeera for Qatar etc. But listening to a different perspective and views gives a more balanced perspective than the singular BBC "balanced" content or Sky et al. It does mean you have to make the effort to do this. Online content and alternative new sources, independent journalists and commentators, like Ray Mc Govern, Scott Ritter, John Pilger or Nassim Taleb and discussion forums like this and military, geopolitical forums are much more informative.
Transmitter Man said:
Just in case there's a keyboard warrior that either forgot or does not know how the Syrian conflict started back in 2011 here's a brilliant article IMO, explaining all;
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/the-graf...
Phil
There are many stories to this tragedy.http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/the-graf...
Phil
http://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/article/syria-civil-w...
http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/aleppo-falls-t...
johnxjsc1985 said:
other than a talking shop what good is the UN to the people of Allepo when Russia has used its Veto 6 times to block them being helped.
Vetoes from the permanent members are nothing new, here's a list of the US ones for example:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vetos_exerci...
Some interesting ones in there. Most recent one vetoed was:
"Condemns Nusra and proposes a ceasefire between the moderate forces and the government in Aleppo.[9][13][69]"
... and the UK and France joined them in vetoing that one.
Lucas Ayde said:
Vetoes from the permanent members are nothing new, here's a list of the US ones for example:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vetos_exerci...
Some interesting ones in there. Most recent one vetoed was:
"Condemns Nusra and proposes a ceasefire between the moderate forces and the government in Aleppo.[9][13][69]"
... and the UK and France joined them in vetoing that one.
Diplomacy is now useless when two parties with apposing views on everything just play games with the "VETO".https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_vetos_exerci...
Some interesting ones in there. Most recent one vetoed was:
"Condemns Nusra and proposes a ceasefire between the moderate forces and the government in Aleppo.[9][13][69]"
... and the UK and France joined them in vetoing that one.
The UN needs changing and the Veto needs to go.
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