Mum gives me her house, how to deal with care costs later on
Discussion
walm said:
That's true but I still don't see anyone with a definitive answer to "can mum give me the house and avoid potential care costs?"
V6 seems to think there will be a definitive time limit by each council. Which seems VERY unlikely to me.
Others agree with the Age Concern advice which is that if you KNOW you will have care costs and dispose of the house, that's not on.
But what isn't clear is that in this case, where the care costs are simply POTENTIAL, and by no means a guaranteed cost, can the mum give the house away in good faith?
the issue seems to be how the parent lives subsequently , bearing in mind gifts with reservation etc. and/or if an further property is involved which is entirely seperate to any property the offspring owned previously involved ( that isn't an obvious granny annexe set up )V6 seems to think there will be a definitive time limit by each council. Which seems VERY unlikely to me.
Others agree with the Age Concern advice which is that if you KNOW you will have care costs and dispose of the house, that's not on.
But what isn't clear is that in this case, where the care costs are simply POTENTIAL, and by no means a guaranteed cost, can the mum give the house away in good faith?
I spent huge effort into finding out what the Social Services rules were, had insurance salesman and lawyers advising (chips off the same block IMHO). When it came to it the form simply wanted a yes/no answer as to wether any property had been owned in the previous 2 years. Then knowing the form name etc I back researched and found that there were variations in different areas ranging up to 5 years.
Funny the insurance and legal professions should have known all about this but must have just forgotten to mention it.
Funny the insurance and legal professions should have known all about this but must have just forgotten to mention it.
barryrs said:
How about a care annuity, obviously will impact on the age of the child's Porsche but spreads the risk.
See under 'insurance scams' in my last post. An annuity was one recommendation and the 'adviser' would have known only too well the best option but it wouldn't have earned him any commission.walm said:
But what isn't clear is that in this case, where the care costs are simply POTENTIAL, and by no means a guaranteed cost, can the mum give the house away in good faith?
Surely this has to be the case?The antithesis is that no parent ever hands down sizeable sums of cash/property lest they run foul of local council legislation.
Jockman said:
walm said:
But what isn't clear is that in this case, where the care costs are simply POTENTIAL, and by no means a guaranteed cost, can the mum give the house away in good faith?
Surely this has to be the case?The antithesis is that no parent ever hands down sizeable sums of cash/property lest they run foul of local council legislation.
I guess they CAN hand it down but still run the risk of a clawback.
Countdown said:
Radical suggestion - how about the kids caring for their own parents? Perhaps using the free money they're getting to make their parents' last few years a bit more comfortable?
This. Don't want my parents going into a care home unless its absolutely unavoidable.Is there any mileage in an equity release type scheme to fund provisions for the parents moving closer to the kids and the released money being used to pay for an accommodation build for them? Decent granny flat basically...
I did have a look but the equity release schemes are horribly expensive and severely penalise anything short term (i.e. less than a good few years).
This whole area is so fraught, complex and very difficult. They should assist people in making their own plans to fund alternatives to care homes as they actually hate funding care homes!
Ken Figenus said:
Countdown said:
Radical suggestion - how about the kids caring for their own parents? Perhaps using the free money they're getting to make their parents' last few years a bit more comfortable?
This. Don't want my parents going into a care home unless its absolutely unavoidable.Is there any mileage in an equity release type scheme to fund provisions for the parents moving closer to the kids and the released money being used to pay for an accommodation build for them? Decent granny flat basically...
I did have a look but the equity release schemes are horribly expensive and severely penalise anything short term (i.e. less than a good few years).
This whole area is so fraught, complex and very difficult. They should assist people in making their own plans to fund alternatives to care homes as they actually hate funding care homes!
Also it makes it worse if you don't live in the same country, the likelihood for myself and OH is that we will not be in the same country as either set of parents, what then? Move them to a country away from their ageing friends? Possibly to a country were they don't speak the main language?
Or do you suggest that both the OH and myself give up our careers and put our lives on hold to go back and look after the parents? I would go to the UK, OH to Finland... How does that work then?
Its a great shame when dealing with property and assets in these situations that advice is sought form people who like to 'dip into' the assets for their own ends be it by fees or commission, and this can skew the advice given. This is cynical I know but in an unrelated way the same happens with large buildings insurance claims when loss assessors become involved in addition to loss adjusters and other consultants - a claim is accepted by insurers and all and sundry try to get a % of the payout - in those circumstances we all end up paying in the long run with increased premiums etc. This is off topic but there you go.
Du1point8 said:
So you would uproot your folks when they need care and shift them away from a place they have lived for XX years to be closer to you? I have seem that to cause OAPs to go within themselves as they are not willing to adapt to a new area and just stay inside.
Also it makes it worse if you don't live in the same country, the likelihood for myself and OH is that we will not be in the same country as either set of parents, what then? Move them to a country away from their ageing friends? Possibly to a country were they don't speak the main language?
Or do you suggest that both the OH and myself give up our careers and put our lives on hold to go back and look after the parents? I would go to the UK, OH to Finland... How does that work then?
That wasn't really about you or any Suomi solutions! My Mum would be down to the big city like a shot FWIW! Then add the seeing grandkids every day bonus... Seems better than any care home solution to me?! If only we could convince Dad - he is less willing and totally along the unwilling to adapt lines you suggested. So back to square one and likely a care home solution Also it makes it worse if you don't live in the same country, the likelihood for myself and OH is that we will not be in the same country as either set of parents, what then? Move them to a country away from their ageing friends? Possibly to a country were they don't speak the main language?
Or do you suggest that both the OH and myself give up our careers and put our lives on hold to go back and look after the parents? I would go to the UK, OH to Finland... How does that work then?
Its the worse solution possible IMHO and ignores the spouses needs. But I digress...ali_kat said:
SunsetZed said:
Thanks, guess I best flag that up to the in-laws next time we see them.
That's just from memory & research.Always best to get proper advice (CAB will help)
Du1point8 said:
So you would uproot your folks when they need care and shift them away from a place they have lived for XX years to be closer to you? <snip>
Just on that bit, there's an element of uprooting anyway, when they have to move into a care home. The question is - would they prefer to be living with family, or with a group of people who are (at least initially) strangers?Re: having to put your lives on hold/give up careers etc, it's a fair point and each to his or her own. You could argue that giving up or putting your career on hold is mitigated somewhat by getting your parent's house. (I don't mean "You" btw).
Countdown said:
Du1point8 said:
So you would uproot your folks when they need care and shift them away from a place they have lived for XX years to be closer to you? <snip>
Just on that bit, there's an element of uprooting anyway, when they have to move into a care home. The question is - would they prefer to be living with family, or with a group of people who are (at least initially) strangers?Re: having to put your lives on hold/give up careers etc, it's a fair point and each to his or her own. You could argue that giving up or putting your career on hold is mitigated somewhat by getting your parent's house. (I don't mean "You" btw).
Du1point8 said:
If your parents house is worth anything maybe... Im from hull, it aint mitigated somewhat if they live for another ten years and I got their house (that 50% would go to my brother)... Thats below national average wage, etc... not sure what carers fess are, but the added disadvantage would be that the industry moves too fast we are both in, if Im out for any long period (same for OH) to get back in is near impossible.
I appreciate this is somewhat of a circular argument but - if the house isn't worth that much then why not sell it and use the proceeds to get them the best quality of care during their final years? Re: your brother getting 50% - why should he if he hasn't made any sacrifices in looking after them?
Countdown said:
Re: having to put your lives on hold/give up careers etc, it's a fair point and each to his or her own. You could argue that giving up or putting your career on hold is mitigated somewhat by getting your parent's house. (I don't mean "You" btw).
It's not just your career; which I explained to you the other day It's your WHOLE life.
It's just you, looking after an sick parent 24/7. There is no respite; no one is going to come & 'babysit' to give you a break.
You try & sleep when they sleep, but with one ear open to hear mobility and your nostrils open for smells.
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