European Union - Ramifications
Discussion
Simpo Two said:
I am amused to be assocated with a 'working clas protest vote'!
But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
Not only are you working class but also a racist, on benefits and over 55. But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
Oh and as Osborne said before the election you are also part of the super rich that will benefit from a Leave vote.
Go figure.
Jockman said:
Outside of the south East, where is unaffordable housing in any major way?
Just sorted out deposits on great first time homes for the kids. Detached at less than £200k.
There is masses of affordable housing that I can find.
If you are on 18k a year it takes a long time to get a deposit together if you are living in rented.Just sorted out deposits on great first time homes for the kids. Detached at less than £200k.
There is masses of affordable housing that I can find.
Even if you are a couple who both work.
Simpo Two said:
But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
If we were having a true revolution London and the South East would declare independence and remain in EU, letting the Midlands and North drift out into the mid-Atlantic on a leaky raft of their own creation... 
The turkeys really have voted for Christmas.
Simpo Two said:
I am amused to be assocated with a 'working clas protest vote'!
But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
Indeed. A better way to have done it would have been to crash houses prices in the South East by forcing jobs out to the regions and thus redressing the wealth and employment imbalance which is really at the heart of the discord. But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
As Ozzie says, the turkeys have voted for Christmas but it's up to everyone else to now rescue Christmas for them.
Jockman said:
Simpo Two said:
I am amused to be assocated with a 'working clas protest vote'!
But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
Not only are you working class but also a racist, on benefits and over 55. But yes, in an ironic twist, I associate more with Wolfie Smith than Brussels. 'Power to the People'? We have indeed had a quiet revolution.
Oh and as Osborne said before the election you are also part of the super rich that will benefit from a Leave vote.
Go figure.
Help me Jockers, help me.
Oh, and apparently you now need to add homophobic (according to one of the numerous other, whining, threads) to your first descriptor.
desolate said:
Jockman said:
Outside of the south East, where is unaffordable housing in any major way?
Just sorted out deposits on great first time homes for the kids. Detached at less than £200k.
There is masses of affordable housing that I can find.
If you are on 18k a year it takes a long time to get a deposit together if you are living in rented.Just sorted out deposits on great first time homes for the kids. Detached at less than £200k.
There is masses of affordable housing that I can find.
Even if you are a couple who both work.
1986 = 2.81
2015 = 7.49
Figures pulled from ONS charts:
http://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity...
https://www.gov.uk/government/statistical-data-set...
200k for a relatively modest home that just 15 years ago would have been what, 80k? And made easier by parents "sorting the deposit out". Surely the fact that you had to do this indicates that the property wasn't affordable? Unfortunately most young people are not in such a fortunate position, and trying to save up at least 10k whilst on a "normal" salary for a young person is not an easy feat, as evidenced by the amount of late 20-30 somethings still living with parents.
Fortunately, my wife and I are doing fine, but that doesn't stop me recognising the large amount of other people my age who are not.
Fortunately, my wife and I are doing fine, but that doesn't stop me recognising the large amount of other people my age who are not.
So we have had a referendum with a fairly decisive outcome.
Some dont like the outcome and as such are initiating steps for the possiblity of a second referendum.
Issue is that it seems to be being given consideration, why the air time if it wasnt.
The Country has made a decision through a democratic process but lets have another go because some dont like it..........ridiculous!!
Only in the UK
Some dont like the outcome and as such are initiating steps for the possiblity of a second referendum.
Issue is that it seems to be being given consideration, why the air time if it wasnt.
The Country has made a decision through a democratic process but lets have another go because some dont like it..........ridiculous!!
Only in the UK
rsbmw said:
200k for a relatively modest home that just 15 years ago would have been what, 80k? And made easier by parents "sorting the deposit out". Surely the fact that you had to do this indicates that the property wasn't affordable? Unfortunately most young people are not in such a fortunate position, and trying to save up at least 10k whilst on a "normal" salary for a young person is not an easy feat, as evidenced by the amount of late 20-30 somethings still living with parents.
Fortunately, my wife and I are doing fine, but that doesn't stop me recognising the large amount of other people my age who are not.
median Salary 27k median house price 160 -200k depending where you are outside London village ... not sustainable without a significant 'correction' to either pay or house prices ... Fortunately, my wife and I are doing fine, but that doesn't stop me recognising the large amount of other people my age who are not.
meanwhile the pensions who have seen their houses appreciate in value 100 times or move since the 70s say there is nothign to worry aobut ...
I was hoping this thread would be in this section with some nice debate from actual finance folk separate from the NPE section full of exaggerations and crap slinging, ah well. Anyone else quietly amused by the new armchair experts on the markets and currencies after a couple of headlines yesterday? You don't even need to look too far back - but if you want to see a real currency crap out search SNB 15 January 2015. While the stuff about how this is worse than 2008? Again go look at a GBP/USD chart. GBP/USD has been falling since 2014 anyway due to tapering/hiking outlook for the US vs Carney trashing the currency long before Brexit was even a word. More telling would be £/€, which while took a slap, is still not extortionate and the start of the decline was back last year when Carney flip flopped from being 'next to go' after the US to suddenly 'haven't the faintest when' so £ and € were diverging anyway. As for the £xx Bln wiped off the FTSE etc I suppose last August's antics were a non-event? Still not quite the panic selling of even the start of this year. The moves were admittedly exaggerated by market pricing in remain result just before, but still...
Don't get me wrong, I'm no Soros with decades of experience under my belt with balls of steel to make a big call on all this but the moves yesterday seemed relatively muted all things considered, perhaps even suspicious of CB intervention regardless of what Carney said. FTSE moves over the day not particularly surprising I suspect due to the institutional money piling out of banks/construction and then into defensive stuff as they have to be in the market. Going forward what will be telling is the central bank co-ordinated efforts - this is what will decide more than anything else what will happen to the currency and stock markets. The QE induced stock rally for the last few years was hardly based on fundamentals anyway as punters decided they may as well take a leap into the unknown in the markets rather than getting sod all anywhere else (see Porker prices). It will essentially be the political squabbling sideshow in Brussels vs the grownups in the CBs sorting out the economic ramifications. Will we head for recession by end of year? That will come down to lending concerns in the banks etc
As someone said earlier that EU may try to be punitive to prevent others leaving sums up age old politics vs economics and flawed assumption of rationality in economics vs irrationality of humans. The man on the street in Germany/France still wants to buy and sell goods and services from UK. The student still wants to do that year abroad as part of their degree. If the political powers that be choose to be punitive to keep member states in line the public will be livid. Who's the 'xenophobe' if Brussels says no more years abroad in Paris for you British students.
Anyway, the result is what it is, man up, look for opportunity and enjoy the ride. /rant
Don't get me wrong, I'm no Soros with decades of experience under my belt with balls of steel to make a big call on all this but the moves yesterday seemed relatively muted all things considered, perhaps even suspicious of CB intervention regardless of what Carney said. FTSE moves over the day not particularly surprising I suspect due to the institutional money piling out of banks/construction and then into defensive stuff as they have to be in the market. Going forward what will be telling is the central bank co-ordinated efforts - this is what will decide more than anything else what will happen to the currency and stock markets. The QE induced stock rally for the last few years was hardly based on fundamentals anyway as punters decided they may as well take a leap into the unknown in the markets rather than getting sod all anywhere else (see Porker prices). It will essentially be the political squabbling sideshow in Brussels vs the grownups in the CBs sorting out the economic ramifications. Will we head for recession by end of year? That will come down to lending concerns in the banks etc
As someone said earlier that EU may try to be punitive to prevent others leaving sums up age old politics vs economics and flawed assumption of rationality in economics vs irrationality of humans. The man on the street in Germany/France still wants to buy and sell goods and services from UK. The student still wants to do that year abroad as part of their degree. If the political powers that be choose to be punitive to keep member states in line the public will be livid. Who's the 'xenophobe' if Brussels says no more years abroad in Paris for you British students.
Anyway, the result is what it is, man up, look for opportunity and enjoy the ride. /rant
Ozzie Osmond said:
If we were having a true revolution London and the South East would declare independence and remain in EU, letting the Midlands and North drift out into the mid-Atlantic on a leaky raft of their own creation...
By the same logic though, Scotland and the North would have been Labour for all history whilst the south/southeast would have been Conservative from 1997 onwards.AMDBSTony said:
Only in the UK
Errrm, there isn't going to be a UK. The Scots will undoubtedly have another go at independence, and IMO succeed. They'll probably do it soon rather than wait 3-5 years for Westminster to sort itself out. They'll say they don't want to be dragged out of EU and then forced to re-apply."Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
I received an email today from HSBC that I thought a bit unnecessary,
"Dear Mothersruin,
Yesterday the UK voted to leave the EU. There has been a lot of debate in recent months on what the outcome of this Referendum will mean for the UK. Now we know the result we can start to provide you with information.
Commenting on today's result the Group Chairman of HSBC, Douglas Flint, said:
“We are today entering a new era for Britain and British business. The work to establish fresh terms of trade with our European and global partners will be complex and time consuming. We will be working tirelessly in the coming weeks and months to help our customers adjust to and prepare for the new environment.
As one of the largest, most stable, liquid and prudent financial institutions in the world, HSBC is well placed to support our customers and the markets as they deal with the challenges that will arise. Our commitment to British businesses, customers and staff in the UK remains undiminished.”
Further updates will be issued over the coming days and we will keep you informed about any changes which might impact you.
Yours sincerely
Becky Moffat
Head of Personal Banking"
"Dear Mothersruin,
Yesterday the UK voted to leave the EU. There has been a lot of debate in recent months on what the outcome of this Referendum will mean for the UK. Now we know the result we can start to provide you with information.
Commenting on today's result the Group Chairman of HSBC, Douglas Flint, said:
“We are today entering a new era for Britain and British business. The work to establish fresh terms of trade with our European and global partners will be complex and time consuming. We will be working tirelessly in the coming weeks and months to help our customers adjust to and prepare for the new environment.
As one of the largest, most stable, liquid and prudent financial institutions in the world, HSBC is well placed to support our customers and the markets as they deal with the challenges that will arise. Our commitment to British businesses, customers and staff in the UK remains undiminished.”
Further updates will be issued over the coming days and we will keep you informed about any changes which might impact you.
Yours sincerely
Becky Moffat
Head of Personal Banking"
Ozzie Osmond said:
Errrm, there isn't going to be a UK. The Scots will undoubtedly have another go at independence, and IMO succeed. They'll probably do it soon rather than wait 3-5 years for Westminster to sort itself out. They'll say they don't want to be dragged out of EU and then forced to re-apply.
"Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
The Scots won't eventually go for independence. If they do, good luck to them, they'll need it."Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
Ozzie Osmond said:
Errrm, there isn't going to be a UK. The Scots will undoubtedly have another go at independence, and IMO succeed. They'll probably do it soon rather than wait 3-5 years for Westminster to sort itself out. They'll say they don't want to be dragged out of EU and then forced to re-apply.
"Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
If they vote for independence from the UK before the UK exits, why won't they have to apply to join the EU? Won't they be considered a new country wanting to join the EU? "Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
Robertj21a said:
Ozzie Osmond said:
Errrm, there isn't going to be a UK. The Scots will undoubtedly have another go at independence, and IMO succeed. They'll probably do it soon rather than wait 3-5 years for Westminster to sort itself out. They'll say they don't want to be dragged out of EU and then forced to re-apply.
"Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
The Scots won't eventually go for independence. If they do, good luck to them, they'll need it."Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
From England and Wales' perspective as of last week, they would do well to be free of the cost of supporting Scotland in brutal terms. In reality, we are all better off moving forward together but if a politically significant element is going to prevent this or work against success then it sadly needs to be cut out.
The downside risk for Scotland joining the EU now that we are leaving is that their taxes and rules will be set by Getmany and we can just offer lower taxes and relocation grants and strip every bit of business out of Scotland at will and they will have no defence against it. The quickest way to bolster the far North of England will be to rip out business from Edinburgh and Glasgow, the two nearest foreign cities.
The same goes for all the other nearby EU members, we will be attacking their tax takes by enticing their businesses to operate divisions out of the more favourable UK.
We will actually be OK but only if we are absolute b
ds and ruthless about it. The whole of the EU is open for pillaging just as it has been for 1000 years. If we are to grow, they must shrink. It's as simple as that. There's no sharing and being poorer together. We've always been richer than nearly all of Europe and I doubt anyone will be interested in that changing. One of the reasons the EU wanted us in was because of our wealth but the other reason was to tame our aggressive tendencies, our outward looking and piratic business tendencies. If we are to prosper alone then just as at everyone point in history where we have stood on our own before then the only option is to be massive, disruptive a
holes. Again. And lest we forget, we are, underneath out charming veneer of civilisation, extremely proficient at international business and trade and about to lose the master who has been reining in that unpleasantness for 40 years.
DonkeyApple said:
The SNP will wait to see whether the UK or the EU will give them the largest handouts. Right now they are better in the UK as we don't know whether the EU without Britain will have the money to keep outlyer states in free cash but they won't rush to make the call until it is all more clear.
From England and Wales' perspective as of last week, they would do well to be free of the cost of supporting Scotland in brutal terms. In reality, we are all better off moving forward together but if a politically significant element is going to prevent this or work against success then it sadly needs to be cut out.
The downside risk for Scotland joining the EU now that we are leaving is that their taxes and rules will be set by Getmany and we can just offer lower taxes and relocation grants and strip every bit of business out of Scotland at will and they will have no defence against it. The quickest way to bolster the far North of England will be to rip out business from Edinburgh and Glasgow, the two nearest foreign cities.
The same goes for all the other nearby EU members, we will be attacking their tax takes by enticing their businesses to operate divisions out of the more favourable UK.
We will actually be OK but only if we are absolute bds and ruthless about it. The whole of the EU is open for pillaging just as it has been for 1000 years. If we are to grow, they must shrink. It's as simple as that. There's no sharing and being poorer together. We've always been richer than nearly all of Europe and I doubt anyone will be interested in that changing.
One of the reasons the EU wanted us in was because of our wealth but the other reason was to tame our aggressive tendencies, our outward looking and piratic business tendencies. If we are to prosper alone then just as at everyone point in history where we have stood on our own before then the only option is to be massive, disruptive aholes. Again.
And lest we forget, we are, underneath out charming veneer of civilisation, extremely proficient at international business and trade and about to lose the master who has been reining in that unpleasantness for 40 years.
Well said this man, and the previous post earlier. The irony of course is that the disenfranchised 'protest' voters that meet the uneducated/racist etc stereotype that voted leave will still be whinging when they're no better off by whatever measure they fancy, while the educated/london-centric whatever stereotype of the remain voters will still come out better off.From England and Wales' perspective as of last week, they would do well to be free of the cost of supporting Scotland in brutal terms. In reality, we are all better off moving forward together but if a politically significant element is going to prevent this or work against success then it sadly needs to be cut out.
The downside risk for Scotland joining the EU now that we are leaving is that their taxes and rules will be set by Getmany and we can just offer lower taxes and relocation grants and strip every bit of business out of Scotland at will and they will have no defence against it. The quickest way to bolster the far North of England will be to rip out business from Edinburgh and Glasgow, the two nearest foreign cities.
The same goes for all the other nearby EU members, we will be attacking their tax takes by enticing their businesses to operate divisions out of the more favourable UK.
We will actually be OK but only if we are absolute b
ds and ruthless about it. The whole of the EU is open for pillaging just as it has been for 1000 years. If we are to grow, they must shrink. It's as simple as that. There's no sharing and being poorer together. We've always been richer than nearly all of Europe and I doubt anyone will be interested in that changing. One of the reasons the EU wanted us in was because of our wealth but the other reason was to tame our aggressive tendencies, our outward looking and piratic business tendencies. If we are to prosper alone then just as at everyone point in history where we have stood on our own before then the only option is to be massive, disruptive a
holes. Again. And lest we forget, we are, underneath out charming veneer of civilisation, extremely proficient at international business and trade and about to lose the master who has been reining in that unpleasantness for 40 years.
Do feel sorry for Scotland though... buy into the UK's please stay chat and give them the benefit of doubt 2 years ago, then when the EU says the same the English go... nahhhh. Spain won't let Scotland in I suspect and they have their own political game to play with Catalonia
DonkeyApple said:
Robertj21a said:
Ozzie Osmond said:
Errrm, there isn't going to be a UK. The Scots will undoubtedly have another go at independence, and IMO succeed. They'll probably do it soon rather than wait 3-5 years for Westminster to sort itself out. They'll say they don't want to be dragged out of EU and then forced to re-apply.
"Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
The Scots won't eventually go for independence. If they do, good luck to them, they'll need it."Neverendum" sums it all up nicely.
From England and Wales' perspective as of last week, they would do well to be free of the cost of supporting Scotland in brutal terms. In reality, we are all better off moving forward together but if a politically significant element is going to prevent this or work against success then it sadly needs to be cut out.
The downside risk for Scotland joining the EU now that we are leaving is that their taxes and rules will be set by Getmany and we can just offer lower taxes and relocation grants and strip every bit of business out of Scotland at will and they will have no defence against it. The quickest way to bolster the far North of England will be to rip out business from Edinburgh and Glasgow, the two nearest foreign cities.
The same goes for all the other nearby EU members, we will be attacking their tax takes by enticing their businesses to operate divisions out of the more favourable UK.
We will actually be OK but only if we are absolute b
ds and ruthless about it. The whole of the EU is open for pillaging just as it has been for 1000 years. If we are to grow, they must shrink. It's as simple as that. There's no sharing and being poorer together. We've always been richer than nearly all of Europe and I doubt anyone will be interested in that changing. One of the reasons the EU wanted us in was because of our wealth but the other reason was to tame our aggressive tendencies, our outward looking and piratic business tendencies. If we are to prosper alone then just as at everyone point in history where we have stood on our own before then the only option is to be massive, disruptive a
holes. Again. And lest we forget, we are, underneath out charming veneer of civilisation, extremely proficient at international business and trade and about to lose the master who has been reining in that unpleasantness for 40 years.
k us hard. Despite being a remainer, if we are to be out we have to absolutely clinical and ruthless in how we market UK Plc and examine our approach to taxation, administration and macro economic policy. It's s shame it has to be this way and I resent being made to do this by a majority topped up to over 50 percent by protest voters who never thought this would happen (plus a few piss ridden bigots) but let's deal with it and crack on. Still a s
t outcome imho though. I don't think the EU will want another millstone around their neck, which Scotland would be I think; it's not going to be much of a contributor, that's for sure.
The only reason there will be anyone listening to Sturgeon in Brussels is to wind up the rUK and disrupt the process as much as possible.
Once that's achieved they'll tell her to fk off.
The only reason there will be anyone listening to Sturgeon in Brussels is to wind up the rUK and disrupt the process as much as possible.
Once that's achieved they'll tell her to f
k off.Gassing Station | Finance | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff