Alternative to BTL. I've had enough

[sidicks]

Darranu said:

Hi,
I really don't know anything about pensions which isn't ideal.
I'm fortunate as I have 3 pensions, BAE, Bombardier and Railway and all of them are final salary so I'm not sure if they're that flexible.

I'm sure there's more tax efficient ways of owning the shop though as you say.

Thanks
D

If they are final salary schemes, you'd normally be advised to live this alone, except in particular circumstances.

Lucky you!

[Darranu]

sidicks said:

Isn't there a way you can get an agent to take away most of the admin with the tenants, which still allowing you to get involved in the maintenance (if you chose to do so), thus saving you money?

Edited by sidicks on Sunday 28th August 10:00

Yes definitely, my only concern is that if I pop down to carry out repairs I then have that physical contact with the tenant and I loose that layer of separation.

I think full management is the way forward and just take a step back and leave it alone.

On a side note, I've just been down to the flat and surprise surprise there's nothing wrong at all.
They'd just put the complaint in to the council as a way a painting a picture of squalor in the hope of been elevated up the council house waiting list.

I'm tempted to just issue them with a S21 but think that would just play into their hands s a few days of careful reflection is in order.

[DSLiverpool]

Op you can still do the repairs ! My mates a builder and a landlord, the tenants have no idea he is the landlord when he pops into do repairs, the agent handles everything passing work required into my mates company.

[sidicks]

Darranu said:

Yes definitely, my only concern is that if I pop down to carry out repairs I then have that physical contact with the tenant and I loose that layer of separation.

I think full management is the way forward and just take a step back and leave it alone.

As someone else has noted, a good managing agent should have access to decent tradesman for repairs and hopefully not charge excessive prices.

Darranu said:

On a side note, I've just been down to the flat and surprise surprise there's nothing wrong at all.
They'd just put the complaint in to the council as a way a painting a picture of squalor in the hope of been elevated up the council house waiting list.

I'm tempted to just issue them with a S21 but think that would just play into their hands s a few days of careful reflection is in order.

I guess this is one of those risks (however rare) that BTL investors need to be aware of (although some people think it's a 'very low risk' business...!

[Jockman]

sidicks said:

If they are final salary schemes, you'd normally be advised to live this alone, except in particular circumstances.

Lucky you!

Agree. Leave them alone. You cannot alter them without proper financial advice.

[Hoofy]

speedyguy said:

Darranu said:

The final straw was returning from holiday last night to find a letter from the council informing me that they've received a complaint from a tenant that parts of the flat were in disrepair, it's a lovely flay and far from in disrepair.

I've never received a complain from the tenants and when we last spoke 2 months ago whilst I was fitting new carpets for them (at my expense) everything was fine and they were grateful for the new carpets.

I spoke to them last night and they said they'd made the complaint as a way of getting further up the waiting list for a council house, oh deep joy.

If there was a named individual on the letter from the council i would be letting them know of your conversation with the tenant and their reasons for doing so whilst inviting them to view the property if possible to verify the non issue.
Whilst at the same time be looking for the next tenant as soon as you can get rid of the present asswipe.

I'd be nervous of ruining the tenant's plans because they might then ruin your house.

[jonah35]

Daran,

Look after the properties yourself. Its easy enough. BUT get a reliable handyman so when a tenant calls or texts you about a blocked drain, leaky tap etc just forward the text to your trusted handyman and you dont even have to move from the sofa. Get a receipt and its tax deductible.

Job jobbed.

[sidicks]

jonah35 said:

Daran,

Look after the properties yourself. Its easy enough. BUT get a reliable handyman so when a tenant calls or texts you about a blocked drain, leaky tap etc just forward the text to your trusted handyman and you dont even have to move from the sofa. Get a receipt and its tax deductible.

Job jobbed.

That's the opposite of what he's looking for!!

It's the dealing with the tents he's having the problems with - he's quite happy and capable of doing the handyman stuff himself.

[JulianPH]

Darranu said:

I'm sure this has been asked before for various reasons but what other investments are there that give >7% return?

Gross or net? I assume gross.

Darranu said:

A bit of background information on my situation:-
I've been a landlord for 15 years starting when I was 26, over that time I've saved up deposits and bought when I could afford another property, I now have 4 houses and a shop which includes a separate flat.

For the most part I've been happy, always had a good professional relationship with tenants and prided myself with the fact that I carry out repairs that are reported within a few days were possible.

You are almost there, don't give up!

Darranu said:

They would be all paid off by the time I'm 52 and if I'm honest I was looking forward to enjoying the benefits that would bring but I don't know if I can be arsed with this for another 11 years, life's to short as they say.

So back to the original question and apologies for the long post but what are the thoughts of PH, surely there's a better alternative but I just can't think what it is?

Thanks in advance,
Darran

Sometimes things do get hard/difficult. You have to stick with them though when you are so close to the conclusion. There is no 'magic' answer however. If you hit 52 with 5 mortgage free properties you have done extremely well and should celebrate!

If it was easy, everyone would do it...

My advice would be to stick with it and ride out the bad times. If you sell now you will regret it later.

[thebraketester]

Darranu said:

thebraketester said:

Do you rent them out privately or through and agent?

An agent might be a good idea as they deal with all the bulllst. Ok, it's gonna dent your initial return but should free you uo from the faff

Hi,

I manage them and carry out all the repair myself with the exception of gas, all boilers are on a British Gas maintenance contract which allows the tenant to call them direct with any issue's.

I've always avoided agents as we all know that any repairs incur their cut on top, as I do the repairs myself it seems like I'd be paying the 8% + vat and the end result would be the same, me popping down to fix.

If I wasn't so handy this wouldn't be an issue but I really don't like the idea of an agent charging me x plus their cut to fix a blocked drain for example when I know I could just do it myself instead.

That said I think it's the maintenance that's starting to drag me down a bit so maybe worth thinking about just stepping back a little.

I know what you mean about the upkeep, hard enough with one house..... how very un-PH of me. If I were you I would just do what it takes to keep the houses on as renters but minimise your effort. Its gonna cost you, but youll always come out on top

[markcoznottz]

Hoofy said:

speedyguy said:

Darranu said:

The final straw was returning from holiday last night to find a letter from the council informing me that they've received a complaint from a tenant that parts of the flat were in disrepair, it's a lovely flay and far from in disrepair.

I've never received a complain from the tenants and when we last spoke 2 months ago whilst I was fitting new carpets for them (at my expense) everything was fine and they were grateful for the new carpets.

I spoke to them last night and they said they'd made the complaint as a way of getting further up the waiting list for a council house, oh deep joy.

If there was a named individual on the letter from the council i would be letting them know of your conversation with the tenant and their reasons for doing so whilst inviting them to view the property if possible to verify the non issue.
Whilst at the same time be looking for the next tenant as soon as you can get rid of the present asswipe.

I'd be nervous of ruining the tenant's plans because they might then ruin your house.

Entitlement culture uk. I wonder if the can't pay bailiff programmes help, they might give some tenants ideas re not paying for six months and wait for the kick out etc.

[Darranu]

Guys,

Thank you for some genuine good advise, I rarely post on the forum but browse a lot.

From time to time I see threads degenerate into mindless tit for tat bickering / trolling. This on the other hand has helped me greatly in gaining some perspective.

I e-mailed the lady at the council dealing with the complaint yesterday detailing the situation and suggesting that we conduct a joint inspection with a view to resolving the matter, I'll call her tomorrow also but wanted the paper trail of an e-mail so that it couldn't be disputed that I'd tried to resolve things within the 14 days.

Regarding the tenants..... Whilst there yesterday I pointed out that I'd never reviewed the rent as they don't cause me too much hassle, in their quest to get higher up the Council housing waiting list this has now changed so it's rent review time. Hopefully they'll just leave after this.

If I issue a S21 and start eviction proceedings that will just play into their hands as that will genuinely increase their priority and the council may even suggest that they stop paying the rent as way of been evicted quicker thus reaching their end goal in a shorter period of time, this happened to me in the past, you couldn't make it up really could you.

When I've sat and thought about it, this is the only property that gives me grief, possibly as it's the cheapest to rent and is at the lower end of the market, although it does give the greatest yield.
I'm going to stick it on full management with a friends letting agency and stay on the sofa, as someone pointed out if I sell now I'm sure to regret it in the future.

Thanks again for taking the time to reply, you're all a credit to PH and gave me a much needed reality check

Cheers
Darran

[Hoofy]

Could you work with the tenant to help them to play the system? At least they will leave without trashing your place (windows, doors, walls kicked through).

[Darranu]

Hoofy said:

Could you work with the tenant to help them to play the system? At least they will leave without trashing your place (windows, doors, walls kicked through).

No, their not that bright and if I'm honest I can't be bothered to converse with them.
Rent review in a weeks time, if the next month's rents late then S21.

Next tenants will be on full managed via agent.

Cheers
D

[Hoofy]

Darranu said:

Hoofy said:

Could you work with the tenant to help them to play the system? At least they will leave without trashing your place (windows, doors, walls kicked through).

No, their not that bright and if I'm honest I can't be bothered to converse with them.
Rent review in a weeks time, if the next month's rents late then S21.

Next tenants will be on full managed via agent.

Cheers
D

Good luck.

[anonymous-user]

Good luck with it all.
Always keep the evidence trails especially when dealing with councils etc so you can remind them if/when they lose it.

[rfisher]

Slightly ot but how do you calculate the interest on a repayment mortgage for a btl?

Presumably this decreases as the capital gets paid down?

For tax relief purposes you need to provide hmrc with the correct figures in your annual tax return.

[audidoody]

You can only issue a S21 once the tenancy agreement is up. You can only issue a S8 if they are in breach of the TA. Late rent is not a reason. They have to be in arrears for a full month before you can even start a S8. You'll need professional help to do this as one wrong word or comma and the S8 is invalid.

[Darranu]

audidoody said:

You can only issue a S21 once the tenancy agreement is up. You can only issue a S8 if they are in breach of the TA. Late rent is not a reason. They have to be in arrears for a full month before you can even start a S8. You'll need professional help to do this as one wrong word or comma and the S8 is invalid.

Their on a periodic tenancy, S8 requires 2 months arrears if they pay monthly if I remember correctly.

[audidoody]

Possibly. But you have to keep meticulous records of their payments and arrears and the form has to be 100 per cent accurate or it will be thrown out of court. Judges don't like landlords.