Investment.

Author
Discussion

iiyama

Original Poster:

2,201 posts

200 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
quotequote all
Anyone ever invested in wine? If so how did it go and what sort of capital did you put into it? Did you use a broker? If so any recommendations?


Or is it a case of ignore and walk away?!!

sidicks

25,218 posts

220 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
quotequote all
iiyama said:
Anyone ever invested in wine? If so how did it go and what sort of capital did you put into it? Did you use a broker? If so any recommendations?
Or is it a case of ignore and walk away?!!
Certain (rare) wine has historically performed well, but it's a very specialist area (and can be very volatile - linked to the economy!) and one I'd only recommend for fun and to provide diversification from mainstream assets, rather than a priority investment choice.

I use Lay & Wheeler, where they make recommendations based on the types of wine I've indicated I prefer. With their monthly plan, you have a certain amount of credit (based on your monthly payment) and I just let my balance build up until I see something I like.

Obviously L&W will store wines for you (at a cost) until they are ready for drinking.

Personally, I don't see this as 'investing, for me it is about simply buying and storing high quality wine which might appreciate over the long term. However, to date, I've chosen to consume most of the wine when it has reached its recommended drinking time, although I have sold a few cases (not for massive profits), when they were ready for drinking but when I already had enough wine at home.



Edited by sidicks on Sunday 18th September 11:44

Jockman

17,912 posts

159 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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If you are interested, read up on Robert Parker and Jancis Robinson - both influential wine critics and the former can make or break a vintage just by the comments he publishes.

Not sure if the Chinese are still buying all the bordeaux vintages but this has driven up prices / returns over the years.

I have an Algerian importer who got hold of a case of Domaine de Marcoux Vieilles Vignes 2005 for me and it rose in value sharply on Liv-ex but I just drink it.

Storage and provenance are key.

Ozzie Osmond

21,189 posts

245 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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sidicks said:
I've chosen to consume most of the wine....
Jockman said:
I just drink it....
Class! smile

JulianPH

9,912 posts

113 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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No. But I have invested in art. Made massive profits that have never been taken.

I think the same could be said about wine. Once you get used to having it you never want to be without it...

NRS

22,080 posts

200 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
quotequote all
iiyama said:
Anyone ever invested in wine? If so how did it go and what sort of capital did you put into it? Did you use a broker? If so any recommendations?


Or is it a case of ignore and walk away?!!
Not wine, but whisky. More a case of buying nice stuff and if it goes up in value enough I will sell it. If I see something obvious then I will go for it. It can be pretty easy to break even/ make a bit of money if you know what you are doing. However I'm not sure about the time used versus reward - for me it's not an issue since I enjoy reading about it anyway, but if it was purely for investment then not sure it would be something quite as good.

AndrewCrown

2,280 posts

113 months

Sunday 18th September 2016
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Iiyama

Yes....and it doesn't attract capital gains tax....

As well as the other professional suggestions, may I suggest Berry Brothers & Rudd.

A

sideways sid

1,371 posts

214 months

Monday 19th September 2016
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I would rather invest in things that I have a better understanding of, and spend the profits on wine to drink!

However, I keep meaning to buy 10 cases of something nice on BBR, then sell 9 of them if they increase in value by 11%, so that I can drink the last one for free!

smile

Simpo Two

85,150 posts

264 months

Monday 19th September 2016
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sidicks said:
Personally, I don't see this as 'investing...I've chosen to consume most of the wine...
hehe

Paper loss, liquid gain!

sidicks

25,218 posts

220 months

Monday 19th September 2016
quotequote all
Simpo Two said:
hehe

Paper loss, liquid gain!
All joking aside, most of the wines I've purchased since I started investing (10 years ago) have yet to reach their best for drinking, so to date I've actually only taken 3 or 4 cases or half cases out of the 'investment celler'.

As more of it matures, more of it will be sold to reinvest in new wines, rather than consumed!

Simpo Two

85,150 posts

264 months

Monday 19th September 2016
quotequote all
sidicks said:
As more of it matures, more of it will be sold to reinvest in new wines, rather than consumed!
This means you will die with a full wine cellar, which seems a frightful waste.

sidicks

25,218 posts

220 months

Monday 19th September 2016
quotequote all
Simpo Two said:
This means you will die with a full wine cellar, which seems a frightful waste.
It will be a great funeral / wake though!

Ginge R

4,761 posts

218 months

Monday 26th September 2016
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iiyama said:
Anyone ever invested in wine? If so how did it go and what sort of capital did you put into it? Did you use a broker? If so any recommendations?


Or is it a case of ignore and walk away?!!
This was published on Saturday, offered without prejudice!

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/news/article-38...

DonkeyApple

54,932 posts

168 months

Monday 26th September 2016
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Ginge R said:
iiyama said:
Anyone ever invested in wine? If so how did it go and what sort of capital did you put into it? Did you use a broker? If so any recommendations?


Or is it a case of ignore and walk away?!!
This was published on Saturday, offered without prejudice!

http://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/news/article-38...
All interesting markets but:

Most woodland is worthless and can take decades to sell on to the next scalp. The yielding woodland is normally traded well before it gets anywhere near the retail market.

Horses: mostly traded through syndicates and they are usually sucker schemes where the syndicate members are just financing the syndicate manager's hobby. Much the same as some of the bad shoots.

Shotguns: not seeing that market at all. The permanent threat of lead shot being banned or the banning of various types of shooting has put a lid on classic shotguns. Far too high risk to sit on £10-£50k assets that could be rendered worthless by needing to be rebarrelled for steel shot.

Wine: only way to make genuine returns is to run a band wagon model and buy whatever is being punted to new money by the houses. Exit is via auctions and it's important to note that the returns that define the index are from the sales of large lots and that small retail lots not only have higher entry prices but much lower exit ones meaning returns are far lower than touted. Building and selling collections is the best way forward. The newest money always wants to start their collection with a bang so you build portfolios to be sold to them.

Ginge R

4,761 posts

218 months

Tuesday 27th September 2016
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How could we. We overlooked registration plates, duh.


Simpo Two

85,150 posts

264 months

Tuesday 27th September 2016
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How about some 'art photography'?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/art/8884829/Why...

Is it real or is it Emperor's Clothes?