Lease cars and lack of pension provision
Discussion
zarjaz1991 said:
It is literally dozens and dozens of pages written in financial institution jargon and printed in a tiny typeface. No sane person could understand a word of it.
So you haven't read it, as expected.zarjaz1991 said:
It might as well give the pension provider ownership of my grandmother! Indeed, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it does.
Given some of the other ludicrous claims you've made this doesn't surprise me. You're wrong again though.sidicks said:
zarjaz1991 said:
It is literally dozens and dozens of pages written in financial institution jargon and printed in a tiny typeface. No sane person could understand a word of it.
It might as well give the pension provider ownership of my grandmother! Indeed, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it does.
So you haven't read it then.It might as well give the pension provider ownership of my grandmother! Indeed, I wouldn't be at all surprised if it does.
sidicks said:
Stakeholder schemes have a maximum charge of 1.5% per annum for the first 10 years and 1% per annum thereafter, I think.
But these aren't the old stakeholder schemes are they? They, having been 'the big thing' for some years, are now outmoded and there are now 'workplace pensions' with completely different rules. Possibly. Or maybe they are exactly the same product with a new name. Who can actually tell? Certainly not your average worker, that's for sure.The whole thing is just a means to extract cash from ordinary workers and route it directly to the pension providers. For good measure they also steal from the employer as well so it's a double whammy. And in return - after forty or more years of this theft - you might get - NOTHING!
How and why is this a good idea?
zarjaz1991 said:
But these aren't the old stakeholder schemes are they? They, having been 'the big thing' for some years, are now outmoded and there are now 'workplace pensions' with completely different rules. Possibly. Or maybe they are exactly the same product with a new name. Who can actually tell? Certainly not your average worker, that's for sure.
Certainly not if they don't read the documentation or discuss with their employer!zarjaz1991 said:
The whole thing is just a means to extract cash from ordinary workers and route it directly to the pension providers. For good measure they also steal from the employer as well so it's a double whammy. And in return - after forty or more years of this theft - you might get - NOTHING!
How and why is this a good idea?
Repeating you nonsense about 'stealing' just emphasises your ignorance on this subject.How and why is this a good idea?
I wish you well.
zarjaz1991 said:
So you think diddling someone out of money because they didn't realise they'd agreed to it on page 37 out of 60 in the terms and and conditions is acceptable financial practice?
Just backs up what I'm saying - IT'S A SCAM!
You're just confirming my suspicions from page 1 - you haven't got a fJust backs up what I'm saying - IT'S A SCAM!
king clue what you are talking about.sidicks said:
Certainly not if they don't read the documentation or discuss with their employer!
The employer does not and can not provide financial advice, as I'm sure you are aware. They will simply refer you to - the pension provider themselves! Who I'm sure will be only too keen to point out all the potential pitfalls hidden in the dozens of pages of terms and conditions!Let's face it, if it boils down to hitting people with stuff they had no hope of understanding, on the basis that 'you should have read the terms and conditions', then we are firmly in scam territory here, aren't we? Ordinary workers cannot be expected to be financial experts, and cannot be expected to read and understand the complex jargon in those terms and conditions...but of course, the financial industry will explain it all to them...for a hefty fee!
Scam, scam, scam!
sidicks said:
You're just confirming my suspicions from page 1 - you haven't got a fking clue what you are talking about.
If you save in a pension plan for a year, and then you need to transfer it somewhere else because you lost your job, and it costs you the entire contents of the fund to transfer it (!) - in what way is that NOT 'diddling money'.king clue what you are talking about.zarjaz1991 said:
The employer does not and can not provide financial advice, as I'm sure you are aware. They will simply refer you to - the pension provider themselves! Who I'm sure will be only too keen to point out all the potential pitfalls hidden in the dozens of pages of terms and conditions!
It's not financial advice it's explaining the terms of the contract. HTH.zarjaz1991 said:
Let's face it, if it boils down to hitting people with stuff they had no hope of understanding, on the basis that 'you should have read the terms and conditions', then we are firmly in scam territory here, aren't we? Ordinary workers cannot be expected to be financial experts, and cannot be expected to read and understand the complex jargon in those terms and conditions...but of course, the financial industry will explain it all to them...for a hefty fee!
Scam, scam, scam!
I certainly don't expect you to understand as you think you know everything (when that couldn't be further from the truth) and aren't prepared to listen to anything.Scam, scam, scam!
Edited by sidicks on Sunday 19th February 23:00
zarjaz1991 said:
If you save in a pension plan for a year, and then you need to transfer it somewhere else because you lost your job, and it costs you the entire contents of the fund to transfer it (!) - in what way is that NOT 'diddling money'.
How much does it cost for someone to do the work required to transfer the pension could marked to the pensions value?Do you expect someone to do the work for you for free?
CarlosFandango11 said:
How much does it cost for someone to do the work required to transfer the pension could marked to the pensions value?
Do you expect someone to do the work for you for free?
If I am FORCED to join such a scheme - which is currently the case, except you can opt out (afterwards ! - you have to join and pay in first and then opt out and wait for the cash to repaid later - another scam I haven't touched upon) but it is widely expected the opt out will be removed once the scheme is fully operational - then yes I damn well do. They are already getting a hefty fee just for having the money in the first place! The money will need to grow extremely well just to stand still. I probably wouldn't object to a reasonable admin fee, but (in my fictitious example) £1400? They must've seen me coming.Do you expect someone to do the work for you for free?
This thread is increasingly convincing me of the merits of the 'shoebox under the bed' - or perhaps more realistically, a bog standard ISA. AT least they are (for the most part) not a scam and you are guaranteed at least the same physical sum of money back at the end.
zarjaz1991 said:
CarlosFandango11 said:
How much does it cost for someone to do the work required to transfer the pension could marked to the pensions value?
Do you expect someone to do the work for you for free?
If I am FORCED to join such a scheme - which is currently the case, except you can opt out (afterwards ! - you have to join and pay in first and then opt out and wait for the cash to repaid later - another scam I haven't touched upon) but it is widely expected the opt out will be removed once the scheme is fully operational - then yes I damn well do. They are already getting a hefty fee just for having the money in the first place! The money will need to grow extremely well just to stand still. I probably wouldn't object to a reasonable admin fee, but (in my fictitious example) £1400? They must've seen me coming.Do you expect someone to do the work for you for free?
This thread is increasingly convincing me of the merits of the 'shoebox under the bed' - or perhaps more realistically, a bog standard ISA. AT least they are (for the most part) not a scam and you are guaranteed at least the same physical sum of money back at the end.
sidicks said:
Why not?
How do you expect people to keep track of that?£1000 here, £2000 there...and you can bet at maturity those same T&Cs will have some nonsense about minimum values and if it's any less you get nothing....wouldn't be in the least bit surprising....
You also don't have much investment clout with a £1000 pension pot....
Oh and is there anything about 'if no payments are made for x years the entire value is surrendered'? I've seen crap like that in the past too.
This is the trouble...I don't trust these companies not to spring something like that on me.
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