Weed Killer- the daddy?

[Simpo Two]

Willy Nilly said:

While we don't expect most householders to be competent sprayer operators and sort of expect them to just chuck it on, there is only some much damage you can do with even 5 litres of neat Clinic Ace compared with the volumes we use when it's being poured into the sprayer 20 litres at a time.

True, but glyphosate is one of the most innocuous pesticides you can get - because we have little or no relevant biochemistry in common with the organisms it's designed to kill. That's the issue - an active ingredient has a specific mode of action which usually involves knackering a biochemical reaction. If our bodies use the same or similar reactions, that's when the problems start.

Personally I'm more than happy for Darwin to sort it out

[otolith]

I don't really care about someone Darwining himself with weapons grade agrichemicals, I'm more worried about said bellend getting it into local watercourses.

[Willy Nilly]

otolith said:

I don't really care about someone Darwining himself with weapons grade agrichemicals, I'm more worried about said bellend getting it into local watercourses.

This really. The pesticide has to hit the target and nothing else, and again, the potential for environmental damage by the householder is much smaller, even for the most powerfully built PHer, than 1 small sprayer load on a farm.

[jon-]

So, for the past few years I've been using Ammonium Sulphamate due to this thread to great my shingle and weedy soil out front.

It's always done the job, but hasn't lasted very long (2 months tops before weeds returning), and the coverage was expensive at around £10 per application (I don't have much land)

Tired of the cost, I ordered the Gallup glyphosate based killer. £30 instead of a tenner, but it'll do the area I have at least 5 times at a stupidly strong dose.

https://www.pitchcare.com/shop/professional-weed-k...

I'm pleased to report that for my use, it actually seems to be more effective than the ammonium sulphamate, probably just because I got a better coverage.

Moral is the biggest hammer isn't always the right tool for the job. Sometimes lots of smaller hammers are better.

[bobski1]

Got weeds within the grass. I did use a grass feed/weed killer combo at the start of summer but there seems to be even more sprouting.

I have pulled out as many as possible & am thinking to start digging them out & then filling the gaps with grass feed to see if that will help.

Anybody got any other tips?

[Douglas Arfempty]

jon- said:

So, for the past few years I've been using Ammonium Sulphamate due to this thread to great my shingle and weedy soil out front.

It's always done the job, but hasn't lasted very long (2 months tops before weeds returning), and the coverage was expensive at around £10 per application (I don't have much land)

Tired of the cost, I ordered the Gallup glyphosate based killer. £30 instead of a tenner, but it'll do the area I have at least 5 times at a stupidly strong dose.

https://www.pitchcare.com/shop/professional-weed-k...

I'm pleased to report that for my use, it actually seems to be more effective than the ammonium sulphamate, probably just because I got a better coverage.

Moral is the biggest hammer isn't always the right tool for the job. Sometimes lots of smaller hammers are better.

Just purchased some of this from Amazon for £25. Fingers crossed for a dry day now to apply it. I'll report back!

[jontysafe]

Another outlet:

http://www.totalweedcontrol.com/product/amenity-gl...

[philv]

Salt.

[steveo3002]

bobski1 said:

Got weeds within the grass. I did use a grass feed/weed killer combo at the start of summer but there seems to be even more sprouting.

I have pulled out as many as possible & am thinking to start digging them out & then filling the gaps with grass feed to see if that will help.

Anybody got any other tips?

i just go round every couple of weeks with a trigger spray , make sure you choose a lawn friendly one , will be an on going thing as you new ones from the wind blowing seeds etc

[Löyly]

Patience is the key with Glyphosate. Even using a proper spray bottle and home mixing, it can take a few days for the effects of the chemical to show because you're essentially starving the plant with it. However, I've taken out some considerable weeds with it. I like the bottles of stuff you mix yourself because they're terrific value for money compared to the premixed stuff.

However, the fastest acting Glyphosate weed killer I've used was a black bottle of Roundup or similar, designed for moss and weeds in stones and gravel. It was really 'soapy' out of the bottle and had that detergent quality that sticks to the leaves of whatever you're spraying, even something with a waxy leaf like ivy. The day after I had sprayed my garden with that, the weeds looked scorched. Their leaves were browned and blackened and they wilted and died very quickly!

[Roscco]

Find some kind of organophosphate and be done with it.

I've read vx is effective.

Wear a mask

[HappyMidget]

Rosate 36, v strong concentrate glyphosate https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B00CBX8BTG/ref=mp...

[Evoluzione]

Simpo Two said:

What do you want it to do? Total or selective, residual or non-residual?

Can you have a selective residual?
I want to kill moorland soft rush and nettles as they are growing together. Is it possible to kill both with one dose?
I cut down the rushes old brown growth and got rid of it so I could kill it via the new green growth of this year. Now I see nettles growing through too aswell as the new green rushes.
I can find a selective rush killer and also a selective nettle killer. Can they be mixed together so I spray it all in one go?

[Simpo Two]

Evoluzione said:

Simpo Two said:

What do you want it to do? Total or selective, residual or non-residual?

Can you have a selective residual?
I want to kill moorland soft rush and nettles as they are growing together. Is it possible to kill both with one dose?
I cut down the rushes old brown growth and got rid of it so I could kill it via the new green growth of this year. Now I see nettles growing through too aswell as the new green rushes.
I can find a selective rush killer and also a selective nettle killer. Can they be mixed together so I spray it all in one go?

Pave the fkers over

But there are three questions here.

1) AFAIK there are no selective residual herbicides.

2) A quick search for 'selective rush killer' shows that that the 'a.i.' (active ingredient) is something like MCPA, which is a boggo phenoxyacetic lawn weedkiller. So there's no magic going on here, the selectivity is broadleaved plants vs grasses due to leaf surface area. I found this which explains it all rather well: https://www.lovethegarden.com/uk-en/article/how-we...

3) No, because for the reasons above you're just mixing two of the same thing. You may as well just use one.

If you want to plant something else when the rushes and nettles are gone then use a total non-residual, eg our friend glyphosate. If you want to keep it clear of everything, use a total residual. However you may struggle to find that in the retail market as the old charger ATA (aminotriazole) was banned. Of course if you're going to go 'off piste' and buy drums of toxic farm hooch from eBay then all bets are on, but don't poison anyone because it's the agrochemical equivalent of installing your own gas boiler or taking down an asbestos roof.

The key to deciphering all the marketing waffle is to find the a.i. is in each product, then find out what it does/how it works.

Edited by Simpo Two on Wednesday 4th May 19:14

[Evoluzione]

Simpo Two said:

Evoluzione said:

Simpo Two said:

What do you want it to do? Total or selective, residual or non-residual?

Can you have a selective residual?
I want to kill moorland soft rush and nettles as they are growing together. Is it possible to kill both with one dose?
I cut down the rushes old brown growth and got rid of it so I could kill it via the new green growth of this year. Now I see nettles growing through too aswell as the new green rushes.
I can find a selective rush killer and also a selective nettle killer. Can they be mixed together so I spray it all in one go?

Pave the fkers over

But there are three questions here.

1) AFAIK there are no selective residual herbicides.

2) A quick search for 'selective rush killer' shows that that the 'a.i.' (active ingredient) is something like MCPA, which is a boggo phenoxyacetic lawn weedkiller. So there's no magic going on here, the selectivity is broadleaved plants vs grasses due to leaf surface area. I found this which explains it all rather well: https://www.lovethegarden.com/uk-en/article/how-we...

3) No, because for the reasons above you're just mixing two of the same thing. You may as well just use one.

If you want to plant something else when the rushes and nettles are gone then use a total non-residual, eg our friend glyphosate. If you want to keep it clear of everything, use a total residual. However you may struggle to find that in the retail market as the old charger ATA (aminotriazole) was banned. Of course if you're going to go 'off piste' and buy drums of toxic farm hooch from eBay then all bets are on, but don't poison anyone because it's the agrochemical equivalent of installing your own gas boiler or taking down an asbestos roof.

The key to deciphering all the marketing waffle is to find the a.i. is in each product, then find out what it does/how it works.

Thanks for taking the time, i'll follow up the leads. Sorry, I should have said I want the rushes and nettles gone, but the grass to grow. There is now the odd bit (of grass) coming through now I've cleared the heavy rush cover. The problem is maybe the rushes were stifling the nettles too hence them getting loose.

One bit of confusion though, you say there are different weedkillers for narrow or broad leaf, yet then say I can use the same for both?
I'll have a more in depth read tomorrow and maybe it'll become apparent.