Property purchase question
Discussion
Just wondered if anyone might be able to offer some advice?
I purchased a property at auction back towards the end of November and because the standard 28 day completion period fell over the Christmas holidays it was sold with a date of the 22nd of Jan.
10% deposit paid and contracts signed and exchanged on the night.
The issue that i have is the vendors solicitor has made no contact with mine despite messages being left and emails being sent.
The completion date is now just a couple of days away and has no chance of completing on-time and whats going to start bothering me is that the property is a development opportunity that requires external funding that is sat in my account and will start costing me money.
That will have an obvious effect on my profit margin albeit relatively small.
Does anyone know if there is a way to put pressure on the vendors solicitor to pull his finger out?
He is responsible for 3 properties from the same deceased estate that all sold on the night and my understanding is that we are all in the same boat.
I purchased a property at auction back towards the end of November and because the standard 28 day completion period fell over the Christmas holidays it was sold with a date of the 22nd of Jan.
10% deposit paid and contracts signed and exchanged on the night.
The issue that i have is the vendors solicitor has made no contact with mine despite messages being left and emails being sent.
The completion date is now just a couple of days away and has no chance of completing on-time and whats going to start bothering me is that the property is a development opportunity that requires external funding that is sat in my account and will start costing me money.
That will have an obvious effect on my profit margin albeit relatively small.
Does anyone know if there is a way to put pressure on the vendors solicitor to pull his finger out?
He is responsible for 3 properties from the same deceased estate that all sold on the night and my understanding is that we are all in the same boat.
barryrs said:
Does anyone know if there is a way to put pressure on the vendors solicitor to pull his finger out?
He is responsible for 3 properties from the same deceased estate that all sold on the night and my understanding is that we are all in the same boat.
Is he avoiding the auctioneer, too?He is responsible for 3 properties from the same deceased estate that all sold on the night and my understanding is that we are all in the same boat.
How well did they sell against the guide/expectation? Is it possible that the deceased's family are thinking they could have done better and might be backing out?
As far as next steps go, I think I'd be happy to invest a day sat - with the other two buyers - in the solicitor's office reception until answers were forthcoming...
The auctioneer is of the belief that he is very busy generally and that the probate has been quite complex but agrees that this is no excuse for a late completion.
Guide price for all 3 was £380k and selling price was £412 so they (just 2 relatives so im lead to believe) should have been happy with the result.
I have also been told that the vendors are itching to complete so i asked the auctioneer to ask them to apply some pressure but i dont know that they will want to get involved.
Guide price for all 3 was £380k and selling price was £412 so they (just 2 relatives so im lead to believe) should have been happy with the result.
I have also been told that the vendors are itching to complete so i asked the auctioneer to ask them to apply some pressure but i dont know that they will want to get involved.
Daily phone calls from you, your solicitor (some of them realise that the device on their desk will connect to another solicitor if you push enough buttons, some don't), their client, and the auctioneer should start to see some action.
I'd also write a snotty letter to the senior partner if there was not any action.
Realisticly you've left it a little late and should have been jumping earlier. I'd be checking for penalties for late completion also, and be making sure that no-one is going to try and charge you even more.
I'd also write a snotty letter to the senior partner if there was not any action.
Realisticly you've left it a little late and should have been jumping earlier. I'd be checking for penalties for late completion also, and be making sure that no-one is going to try and charge you even more.
outnumbered said:
If contracts were exchanged and a deposit paid, isn't there some penalty the vendor would be obliged to pay if they don't complete on the due date ?
On an auction contracts are exchanged on the hammer drop.There's normally a (steep) penalty for buyer not completing on-time.
http://www.symondsandsampson.co.uk/Uploads/Files/e...
The contract is likely to have been formed based on the above as varied by any Special Conditions of Sale that will have been with the legal pack for the Property.
You do have options open to you from a legal point of view if they fail to complete but the practicalities may mean that a successful action could be a pyrrhic one.
I don’t buy the Probate story. That is an excuse, not a reason. If it is a reason then there are many more troubling things going on...
The contract is likely to have been formed based on the above as varied by any Special Conditions of Sale that will have been with the legal pack for the Property.
You do have options open to you from a legal point of view if they fail to complete but the practicalities may mean that a successful action could be a pyrrhic one.
I don’t buy the Probate story. That is an excuse, not a reason. If it is a reason then there are many more troubling things going on...
Seems some feet stomping in reception has had the desired effect.
It would appear that the grant of probate has been held up for some reason and i was told that they considered pulling 2 of the 3 properties from auction at the last minute due to this.
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
My solicitor should have these details today and will check that i wont fall foul at a later date.
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
It would appear that the grant of probate has been held up for some reason and i was told that they considered pulling 2 of the 3 properties from auction at the last minute due to this.
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
My solicitor should have these details today and will check that i wont fall foul at a later date.
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
barryrs said:
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
...
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
How kind of you. You're lending somebody a hundred-odd grand AND working on their house for them. Can you drop me a PM, please, because I've got a few jobs for you......
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
barryrs said:
Seems some feet stomping in reception has had the desired effect.
It would appear that the grant of probate has been held up for some reason and i was told that they considered pulling 2 of the 3 properties from auction at the last minute due to this.
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
My solicitor should have these details today and will check that i wont fall foul at a later date.
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
Has your solicitor advised you of the risks of doing this?It would appear that the grant of probate has been held up for some reason and i was told that they considered pulling 2 of the 3 properties from auction at the last minute due to this.
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
My solicitor should have these details today and will check that i wont fall foul at a later date.
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
barryrs said:
Seems some feet stomping in reception has had the desired effect.
It would appear that the grant of probate has been held up for some reason and i was told that they considered pulling 2 of the 3 properties from auction at the last minute due to this.
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
My solicitor should have these details today and will check that i wont fall foul at a later date.
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
Sounds like a keyholders undertaking.It would appear that the grant of probate has been held up for some reason and i was told that they considered pulling 2 of the 3 properties from auction at the last minute due to this.
The way forward has been agreed and we will pay the final balance due that will be held in the executors client account and in return we will be given full access to the property to undertake the renovation.
My solicitor should have these details today and will check that i wont fall foul at a later date.
The only thing left outstanding will be a formal completion date.
Make sure you check that it covers ALL of the works you intend, including anything structural as the basic drafts of these always (should) exclude this. The document your solicitor will get is likely to be a hybrid of the standard doc that is intended to be used to allow access to store chattels or lay carpets/paint walls/etc. Make sure it isn’t too restrictive for your purposes.
You also need to make sure that if you are spending money on the Property that you are comfortable with your potential loss if things go wrong.
That someone sent a property to auction without the Grant being available is twisting my melon here and leads me to say, again, never buy a property at auction without getting a solicitor to give the legal pack the once over first. Yes you are likely to pay £300-£400 (assuming average property auction property) for them to tell you if it is safe to bid, or what the issues are, or if you should ruin a mile and might well ‘lose’ the property in the room on the day but it is many, many times better than buying a pup.
Rude-boy said:
Sounds like a keyholders undertaking.
Make sure you check that it covers ALL of the works you intend, including anything structural as the basic drafts of these always (should) exclude this. The document your solicitor will get is likely to be a hybrid of the standard doc that is intended to be used to allow access to store chattels or lay carpets/paint walls/etc. Make sure it isn’t too restrictive for your purposes.
You also need to make sure that if you are spending money on the Property that you are comfortable with your potential loss if things go wrong.
That someone sent a property to auction without the Grant being available is twisting my melon here and leads me to say, again, never buy a property at auction without getting a solicitor to give the legal pack the once over first. Yes you are likely to pay £300-£400 (assuming average property auction property) for them to tell you if it is safe to bid, or what the issues are, or if you should ruin a mile and might well ‘lose’ the property in the room on the day but it is many, many times better than buying a pup.
Many thanks for the advise RB.Make sure you check that it covers ALL of the works you intend, including anything structural as the basic drafts of these always (should) exclude this. The document your solicitor will get is likely to be a hybrid of the standard doc that is intended to be used to allow access to store chattels or lay carpets/paint walls/etc. Make sure it isn’t too restrictive for your purposes.
You also need to make sure that if you are spending money on the Property that you are comfortable with your potential loss if things go wrong.
That someone sent a property to auction without the Grant being available is twisting my melon here and leads me to say, again, never buy a property at auction without getting a solicitor to give the legal pack the once over first. Yes you are likely to pay £300-£400 (assuming average property auction property) for them to tell you if it is safe to bid, or what the issues are, or if you should ruin a mile and might well ‘lose’ the property in the room on the day but it is many, many times better than buying a pup.
As said my solicitor has been informed of the proposal and I have asked him to comment on the risks attached.
Well this still hasn't gone through; circa 18 weeks and still counting.
I declined the key-holders undertaking as although im happy to risk my time im not happy to plough any more funds into it prior to ownership (only circa £1500 to date).
Frustrated doesn't come close
Im amazed that this situation has been allowed to happen and yet there appears to be nothing i can do. The only saving grace being that the market a crept up a little and it might be worth an additional £5k but we were hoping to have it on the market for the summer and thats not going to happen now.
I declined the key-holders undertaking as although im happy to risk my time im not happy to plough any more funds into it prior to ownership (only circa £1500 to date).
Frustrated doesn't come close
Im amazed that this situation has been allowed to happen and yet there appears to be nothing i can do. The only saving grace being that the market a crept up a little and it might be worth an additional £5k but we were hoping to have it on the market for the summer and thats not going to happen now.
At last!!!!
I have a letter confirming that completion is anticipated for the end of the month.
Coincidentally I had popped in to see the agent that same day and discovered that the buyers of one of the other properties from that same estate may be taking legal proceedings for interest costs incurred over that last 5 months and that the estate are pretty cheesed off as they would have got a fair bit more for all 3 if that had gone to auction recently.
Oh well got there in the end; timings not great though as im completing on a plot of land for a new build dwelling this week as well. Bloody typical.
I have a letter confirming that completion is anticipated for the end of the month.
Coincidentally I had popped in to see the agent that same day and discovered that the buyers of one of the other properties from that same estate may be taking legal proceedings for interest costs incurred over that last 5 months and that the estate are pretty cheesed off as they would have got a fair bit more for all 3 if that had gone to auction recently.
Oh well got there in the end; timings not great though as im completing on a plot of land for a new build dwelling this week as well. Bloody typical.
Well would you believe it im still waiting to complete.
Mutterings have come from the sellers solicitor that probate might be completed next month however that was also said back in April.
The contract was a standard agreement for sale by auction (incorporating the standard conditions of sale(Fifth edition)) and having a good read there are conditions relating to compensation for late completion.
7.2 Late completion
7.2.1
If there is default by either or both of the parties in performing their obligations under the
contract and completion is delayed, the party whose total period of default is the greater is
to pay compensation to the other party.
7.2.2
Compensation is calculated at the contract rate on an amount equal to the purchase price,
less (where the buyer is the paying party) any deposit paid, for the period by which the
paying party's default exceeds that of the receiving party, or, if shorter, the period between
completion date and actual completion.
7.2.3
Any claim for loss resulting from delayed completion is to be reduced by any
compensation paid under this contract.
With a completion date of 22nd of January we are now 27 weeks (182 days) past that date!!!!
I believe that we might be able to seek compensation in the form of the interest rate set by the law society currently at 4.5%; however im unsure what that can be applied to?
Our deposit of £10,700 (26 weeks @ 4.5% circa £250)
Total purchase of £107k (26 weeks @ 4.5% circa £2460)
Outstanding balance of £96,505.08 (26 weeks @ 4.5% circa £2120)
Total costs incurred to date are £2422 in funding that could have been deferred and circa £500 in lost income from the deposit investment.
I obviously dont want to go down the route of expensive litigation so im trying to come up with a reasonable figure with which to approach the sellers.
Mutterings have come from the sellers solicitor that probate might be completed next month however that was also said back in April.
The contract was a standard agreement for sale by auction (incorporating the standard conditions of sale(Fifth edition)) and having a good read there are conditions relating to compensation for late completion.
7.2 Late completion
7.2.1
If there is default by either or both of the parties in performing their obligations under the
contract and completion is delayed, the party whose total period of default is the greater is
to pay compensation to the other party.
7.2.2
Compensation is calculated at the contract rate on an amount equal to the purchase price,
less (where the buyer is the paying party) any deposit paid, for the period by which the
paying party's default exceeds that of the receiving party, or, if shorter, the period between
completion date and actual completion.
7.2.3
Any claim for loss resulting from delayed completion is to be reduced by any
compensation paid under this contract.
With a completion date of 22nd of January we are now 27 weeks (182 days) past that date!!!!
I believe that we might be able to seek compensation in the form of the interest rate set by the law society currently at 4.5%; however im unsure what that can be applied to?
Our deposit of £10,700 (26 weeks @ 4.5% circa £250)
Total purchase of £107k (26 weeks @ 4.5% circa £2460)
Outstanding balance of £96,505.08 (26 weeks @ 4.5% circa £2120)
Total costs incurred to date are £2422 in funding that could have been deferred and circa £500 in lost income from the deposit investment.
I obviously dont want to go down the route of expensive litigation so im trying to come up with a reasonable figure with which to approach the sellers.
Edited by barryrs on Wednesday 23 July 12:10
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