Central heating questions
Discussion
Chaps, questions about radiators, TRVs and general heating.
I am going to refine the heating system in my house. It’s a Victorian property, semi detached, in London. Currently runs a combination boiler that works fine. I have just had the loft converted and insulation is now decent, so my enormous heating bill should be a bit better. While on a roll, I thought that I would improve the functionality of the heating system as well.
- There are no TRVs – and with just two of us in the house, I would like to fit some, so that we are not heating the whole house when there are just two of us using a couple of rooms. Are simple mechanical TRVs fine? What options are there? How do the electronic ones draw operating power?
- While the system is drained for TRV fitment, how easy is it for me to flush the system (if necessary) and add the required inhibitor chemicals?
- I would like to fit a wifi thermostat, preferably zoned. I was thinking Salus it500. What is involved in terms of the plumbing? Frankly if this is a big hassle, I’ll just use the TRVs to regulate temperature and manually turn up the temperature when I want a room to warm up more.
- The radiators are the standard pressed steel type. There is a huge (and unnecessarily powerful) one in the hallway. Can I replace it with a smaller, rather more stylish cast iron job (the wall is stripped brick, so it would look rather nice), or is mixing different radiators in such a way not possible? This would be the rad with no TRV as it will be permanently on when heating on, and in the room where the main thermostat sits.
- Apart from a full water softener, are there any other ways to deal with London’s horribly hard water?
Any help/tips/resources would be much appreciated.
I am going to refine the heating system in my house. It’s a Victorian property, semi detached, in London. Currently runs a combination boiler that works fine. I have just had the loft converted and insulation is now decent, so my enormous heating bill should be a bit better. While on a roll, I thought that I would improve the functionality of the heating system as well.
- There are no TRVs – and with just two of us in the house, I would like to fit some, so that we are not heating the whole house when there are just two of us using a couple of rooms. Are simple mechanical TRVs fine? What options are there? How do the electronic ones draw operating power?
- While the system is drained for TRV fitment, how easy is it for me to flush the system (if necessary) and add the required inhibitor chemicals?
- I would like to fit a wifi thermostat, preferably zoned. I was thinking Salus it500. What is involved in terms of the plumbing? Frankly if this is a big hassle, I’ll just use the TRVs to regulate temperature and manually turn up the temperature when I want a room to warm up more.
- The radiators are the standard pressed steel type. There is a huge (and unnecessarily powerful) one in the hallway. Can I replace it with a smaller, rather more stylish cast iron job (the wall is stripped brick, so it would look rather nice), or is mixing different radiators in such a way not possible? This would be the rad with no TRV as it will be permanently on when heating on, and in the room where the main thermostat sits.
- Apart from a full water softener, are there any other ways to deal with London’s horribly hard water?
Any help/tips/resources would be much appreciated.
Have a look at http://www.evohome.info/ individual control over the trvs in each room, from the comfort of your armchair or phone. No more involved, plumbing wise, than fitting TRVs, but all the benefits of zoning.
Typically TRV's on all rads bar towel rails and the one tripping the thermostat out.
To zone a system normally requires zone valves wired with their room thermostat, typically a house would he zoned into floors.
This can also be done with wireless TRV's. The heads run of batteries. So these can be set to open and shut when ever needed and zoned that way.
In regards to flushing the system out, I'd add a cleaner into the system and let it circulate with the heating going for a while, then flush it out when you drain the system to fit the TRVs. Then add inhibitor upon refilling.
You can swap the rads to any style you fancy. Just make sure it's big enough to heat the area. Pipes probably would need altering, so best to do when drained at same time.
A full water softener is the best. The combi can have devices on the cold inlet to minimise the heat exchanger scaling up.
To zone a system normally requires zone valves wired with their room thermostat, typically a house would he zoned into floors.
This can also be done with wireless TRV's. The heads run of batteries. So these can be set to open and shut when ever needed and zoned that way.
In regards to flushing the system out, I'd add a cleaner into the system and let it circulate with the heating going for a while, then flush it out when you drain the system to fit the TRVs. Then add inhibitor upon refilling.
You can swap the rads to any style you fancy. Just make sure it's big enough to heat the area. Pipes probably would need altering, so best to do when drained at same time.
A full water softener is the best. The combi can have devices on the cold inlet to minimise the heat exchanger scaling up.
Very helpful, thank you.
The reality is that we live up in the loft conversion (or will do once it is finished) and I only want our bedroom heated just before we go to bed, and I want some communal rooms heated in the evening, but not guest bedrooms, spare bathrooms etc.
So having done soe research, Honeywell's Evo would do this but rather expensively.
I'm thinking a Salus/Nest, with independent electronic programmable TRVs thermostats in the rooms we live in. Thus, heating comes on but in the morning, just bedroom and one bathroom heat up (we leave straight for work - no breakfasting at home). Evening, heating comes on, but heats living room, kitchen, bathroom etc, but not bedroom until just before we go to bed.
So the overall heating is controlled by the wifi controller, and another layer of control is added by the e-TRVs. The bits for this would seem to cost about £300 all in, whereas Evohome looks to be about double that if not more.
Downside - this is not all fully controllable from an app. I don't really mind that though, as when we have guests we'll manually turn the heating on in their rooms/bathrooms with manual TRVs. Manual override on e-TRVs allows extra heating if we use one room at an unexpected time and need it heated (main heating can be controlled from the app to make sure it stays on longer etc).
I'll get an evohome quote too - if it's not much more expensive, it may be worth it.
To be honest, this will probably not pay for itself that soon - but I likethe idea of controllable heating, and it should lead to less energy wasteage. That said, Evohome allows you to very easily just heat one room instead of the whole house, from your controller, easily. Achievable the old fashioned way by turning off the TRVs in each room manually and then turning on the heating, of course...
I think I am beginning to understand how this all works?
The reality is that we live up in the loft conversion (or will do once it is finished) and I only want our bedroom heated just before we go to bed, and I want some communal rooms heated in the evening, but not guest bedrooms, spare bathrooms etc.
So having done soe research, Honeywell's Evo would do this but rather expensively.
I'm thinking a Salus/Nest, with independent electronic programmable TRVs thermostats in the rooms we live in. Thus, heating comes on but in the morning, just bedroom and one bathroom heat up (we leave straight for work - no breakfasting at home). Evening, heating comes on, but heats living room, kitchen, bathroom etc, but not bedroom until just before we go to bed.
So the overall heating is controlled by the wifi controller, and another layer of control is added by the e-TRVs. The bits for this would seem to cost about £300 all in, whereas Evohome looks to be about double that if not more.
Downside - this is not all fully controllable from an app. I don't really mind that though, as when we have guests we'll manually turn the heating on in their rooms/bathrooms with manual TRVs. Manual override on e-TRVs allows extra heating if we use one room at an unexpected time and need it heated (main heating can be controlled from the app to make sure it stays on longer etc).
I'll get an evohome quote too - if it's not much more expensive, it may be worth it.
To be honest, this will probably not pay for itself that soon - but I likethe idea of controllable heating, and it should lead to less energy wasteage. That said, Evohome allows you to very easily just heat one room instead of the whole house, from your controller, easily. Achievable the old fashioned way by turning off the TRVs in each room manually and then turning on the heating, of course...
I think I am beginning to understand how this all works?
Aftermarket zoning isn't all that easy to implement with valves as the pipes aren't always accessible.
Zoning with electronic TRV's is easiest but not all that cheap. Not something I've much hands on experience with to be honest. I fitted a load of Drayton TRV's to a house once as he needed the Drayton valve body to fit his electronic heads to.
Honeywell is a well regarded manufacturer, but it all comes down to cost.
People often use them to keep the heating from the bedrooms during the day and to let it come on in the evening just before you go to bed, while heating the living areas during the day instead.
Go for it.
Just to say, nice choice of cars. A Caterham man myself. Had a Defender, but sadly it's been gone a year or so, I'l get a new one in Oz. The Morgan is another classic English motor. Good choices.
Zoning with electronic TRV's is easiest but not all that cheap. Not something I've much hands on experience with to be honest. I fitted a load of Drayton TRV's to a house once as he needed the Drayton valve body to fit his electronic heads to.
Honeywell is a well regarded manufacturer, but it all comes down to cost.
People often use them to keep the heating from the bedrooms during the day and to let it come on in the evening just before you go to bed, while heating the living areas during the day instead.
Go for it.
Just to say, nice choice of cars. A Caterham man myself. Had a Defender, but sadly it's been gone a year or so, I'l get a new one in Oz. The Morgan is another classic English motor. Good choices.
Edited by Gingerbread Man on Tuesday 23 September 18:28
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