2015 Lawn thread
Discussion
Rick101 said:
Because the general advice was cut it often and take minimal off??
Ground is fairly hard so will fork it again.
Soil very dry on one side and drains and sits on the other. Not ideal.
I don't understand why Popeye's being so negative. What you've achieved with that lawn in a few short weeks is pretty impressive. It will take time to thicken - much longer than it has had so far, so the fact that there are still some thin patches shouldn't discourage you.Ground is fairly hard so will fork it again.
Soil very dry on one side and drains and sits on the other. Not ideal.
You are right that it's far better to mow "little and often", although if you mow at a longer height then the grass will grow slightly slower, so you don't need to mow so often. I'm currently mowing every other day and as short as my rotary mower will go, but that's an extreme regime designed to disadvantage the horrible coarse weed grasses that I'm infested with, and it's making parts of my lawn look slightly tired (mainly the areas with the worst Yorkshire Fog, so I believe it's working). You probably don't need to mow as often as that, but I'd still strongly recommend mowing at least once a week.
Get some seed down on those thin patches - in fact, the whole lawn - before the hot weather (!) sets in, and water it daily until the seedling grass is established. And fork, as others have said - especially the soggy bits. You'll have it looking nice by the summer.
+1 to Dr Mike's points. With the good growing conditions, plus having fertilised, twice weekly to every other day mowing isn't unusual. I'm mowing at least every two days at the moment and that's with a fairly long (for a cylinder mower) 2" cut. The rule is to take no more than a third of the grass height off so the shorter the grass the more frequently you have to mow to keep within that third.
I wouldn't worry about dealing with the drainage issues beyond forking now that we're well into May. Come the autumn then you can look at hollow tining and top dressing to get some sand and compost into the soil to improve its structure.
I wouldn't worry about dealing with the drainage issues beyond forking now that we're well into May. Come the autumn then you can look at hollow tining and top dressing to get some sand and compost into the soil to improve its structure.
Dr Mike Oxgreen said:
I don't understand why Popeye's being so negative.
Pragmatic.The OP wants some green stuff. IMO he's flogging a dead horse if he thinks he'll turn that round in the next few weeks. By Autumn the summer will be over and he'll have the same problems next year. If he wants a decent lawn this summer he should think about re-turfing now.
jagnet said:
+1 to Dr Mike's points. With the good growing conditions, plus having fertilised, twice weekly to every other day mowing isn't unusual. I'm mowing at least every two days at the moment and that's with a fairly long (for a cylinder mower) 2" cut. The rule is to take no more than a third of the grass height off so the shorter the grass the more frequently you have to mow to keep within that third.
I must have poor eyesight. When I look at the recent pictures of the lawn it appears to me the grass has simply been pushed over and the mowing isn't working. How's the OP going to follow your (btw - what 'good growing conditions'?? -I'm impressed with your optimism though 
) cutting regime? Can we add some realism to the thread please?popeyewhite said:
I must have poor eyesight. When I look at the recent pictures of the lawn it appears to me the grass has simply been pushed over and the mowing isn't working. How's the OP going to follow your (btw - what 'good growing conditions'?? -I'm impressed with your optimism though ) cutting regime? Can we add some realism to the thread please?
There's a little laying down of grass in places but nothing that can't be resolved by light raking and a high cut.) cutting regime? Can we add some realism to the thread please?Maybe conditions are different elsewhere in the country, but down here in Surrey the grass has been growing quickly. I'm not suggesting that he follows my cutting regime, but it's an indication that cutting every few days isn't necessarily OTT.
Yes, he could turf for instant greening, but really that grass isn't nearly bad enough to give up on imho. I've brought lawns back from far worse a state without the need for turf. We're still only half way through May. If he over seeds now, there'll be plenty of young grasses showing by the end of the month, come the end of June it'll be a looking much thicker ready for the summer and infinitely better than what was there a few weeks ago.
In the autumn he can really get to grips with aeration, drainage and soil structure, which is a better time to be doing it than spring anyway (unless you're laying turf).
By next summer you won't be able to tell the difference between turfing and nurturing.
I've nothing against turfing it - it's the only way to go if you want instant results - but there's something very satisfying about nurturing a lawn back to health.
Looking good Popeye!
I've nearly finished phase 1 of my "the bloke I bought this house off really neglected the grass" plan.
So far, I've managed to knack about 90% of the rosette weeds via 4 in 1 and a later bout of liquid. The moss (wasn't that much, but patchy) has been killed and overseeded which has grown nicely so far.
Next step, I need to make it uniformly green (I obviously wasn't accurate enough with the 4 in 1 hand application), and finish off the coarse grasses (1 down, 2 to go)..
Question for the forum - can I apply fertiliser again now, 6 weeks after 4 in 1? If so, I'll do it criss cross this time to avoid pactches...
I've nearly finished phase 1 of my "the bloke I bought this house off really neglected the grass" plan.
So far, I've managed to knack about 90% of the rosette weeds via 4 in 1 and a later bout of liquid. The moss (wasn't that much, but patchy) has been killed and overseeded which has grown nicely so far.
Next step, I need to make it uniformly green (I obviously wasn't accurate enough with the 4 in 1 hand application), and finish off the coarse grasses (1 down, 2 to go)..
Question for the forum - can I apply fertiliser again now, 6 weeks after 4 in 1? If so, I'll do it criss cross this time to avoid pactches...
Some Gump said:
Question for the forum - can I apply fertiliser again now, 6 weeks after 4 in 1? If so, I'll do it criss cross this time to avoid pactches...
That shouldn't be a problem, but stick to using just a fertiliser rather than reapply a combined product. Those new grasses will still be delicate and busy developing their root systems so I'd think about using a more balanced fertiliser rather than a very high nitrogen one, and water in well.Perhaps consider a slow release fertiliser instead, or applying a quick release one at a slightly lesser rate on this occasion.
Front lawn is getting better
3 weeks ago
And today
Still a little patchy in places but the seed is growing all be it slowly. All thanks to this thread, it was more daisies moss and dandelions than grass. Like the corner of my neighbours
lawn you can see in the shot.
There are still a couple of daisies and a bit of very thick leafed grass but I have never had a lawn looking this good.
The wife thinks I'm mad as I have spent hours with the spring rake and watering can but I have enjoyed every minute of it.
3 weeks ago
And today
Still a little patchy in places but the seed is growing all be it slowly. All thanks to this thread, it was more daisies moss and dandelions than grass. Like the corner of my neighbours
lawn you can see in the shot.
There are still a couple of daisies and a bit of very thick leafed grass but I have never had a lawn looking this good.
The wife thinks I'm mad as I have spent hours with the spring rake and watering can but I have enjoyed every minute of it.
Some Gump said:
thanks Jag. I was planning on straight fertiliser not a combined - don't want to risk scorching. Do you have a recommended slow release / less mentally potent fertiliser I can google?
Lawnsmith do a nice 25-4-10 3 month slow release granular fertiliser: http://www.lawnsmith.co.uk/prod/lawn-fertiliser-pr...They also do a high nitrogen soluble feed that can be used together with the slow release ones if you find that the grass could do with a bit more greening later on: http://www.lawnsmith.co.uk/prod/lawn-fertiliser-pr.... If we don't get too dry a summer but plenty of warm days then you may find this useful, by which time the new seed will be better established.
That's looking much healthier. Indeed, Nobby, that's a fine job you've done there! 
I've got two main coarse grasses: Yorkshire Fog, and a tougher stalky grass that has slightly purplish stalks. I'm mowing every other day, raking up the worst bits first to make it stand up a bit, and mowing as low as my rotary mower will go. Occasionally slashing some areas with a Stanley knife. This is leaving me with rather thin patches where it does look like the stalky stuff is going brown and dying, so I'm overseeding - but germination is slow, even in my sunny areas. So at the moment my lawn frankly isn't looking all that great.
This weekend I'm planning to try ferrous sulphate for the first time as a green-up. Don't know why I've never used it before; perhaps because I don't have cause to use it as a moss treatment.
Some Gump said:
and finish off the coarse grasses
What is your plan of attack? Always interested to hear how other people are tackling their weed grass problem! I've got two main coarse grasses: Yorkshire Fog, and a tougher stalky grass that has slightly purplish stalks. I'm mowing every other day, raking up the worst bits first to make it stand up a bit, and mowing as low as my rotary mower will go. Occasionally slashing some areas with a Stanley knife. This is leaving me with rather thin patches where it does look like the stalky stuff is going brown and dying, so I'm overseeding - but germination is slow, even in my sunny areas. So at the moment my lawn frankly isn't looking all that great.
This weekend I'm planning to try ferrous sulphate for the first time as a green-up. Don't know why I've never used it before; perhaps because I don't have cause to use it as a moss treatment.
Dr Mike Oxgreen said:
What is your plan of attack? Always interested to hear how other people are tackling their weed grass problem!
Now there lies the problem, I have no idea. Part of me would like to get rid of it but there is only a small amount here and there but now it looks nice I don't want to make a mess of it again. I Think I may just let it be over the summer and have at it again in the autumn.
Now I just have a fight with my kids so they don't walk on the lawn
come on its got stripes of it FFS why would you walk on it 
Thankfully I'm not really that precious about it but I am very proud of how it's looking. Normally anything green I touch just dies
Well, I had 3 patches. 2 of the purply ones you describe about 3 ft by 1, and 1 of a green one that may / may not be yorkshire fog (I'm no expert), which was much smaller.
I had at all 3 with a butter knife to slash them up a bit, mowed, and overseeded. The green one admitted defeat quite quickly, and the replacement seed is doing well. The purply one has laughed in my face, and if anything got bigger.
I'm not sure what the next stage is, but the purply patch is on the same side of the garden as the bamboo that's currently making me want to jump off a bridge. It's quite possible that the various grasses are all in cahoots and are using psychological warfare to wear me down. Purply grass is being naive though - I'm planning on making a border near the wall, and when that day comes, the purple grass will find itself in the wheelie bin, having been ousted by my allies from the southern front..
I had at all 3 with a butter knife to slash them up a bit, mowed, and overseeded. The green one admitted defeat quite quickly, and the replacement seed is doing well. The purply one has laughed in my face, and if anything got bigger.
I'm not sure what the next stage is, but the purply patch is on the same side of the garden as the bamboo that's currently making me want to jump off a bridge. It's quite possible that the various grasses are all in cahoots and are using psychological warfare to wear me down. Purply grass is being naive though - I'm planning on making a border near the wall, and when that day comes, the purple grass will find itself in the wheelie bin, having been ousted by my allies from the southern front..
In the last couple of days I've been doing some Googling, and I now think I might be wrong with my identification of Yorkshire Fog in my lawn.
Almost everything fits: it's got broad leaves (up to 5-6mm across), 'rolled' stalks, paler colour (sometimes slightly blue), velvety texture, and the leaves are physically quite delicate and easily torn.
But one thing has been nagging me, and it doesn't fit: my problem with this type of grass always seems to disappear after autumn scarifying and during the winter, but comes back with a vengeance in mid-spring. I don't know why it hasn't occurred to me before that this points to it being an ANNUAL grass, not a perennial like Yorkshire Fog. It seems I might have been wrong for several years.
Browsing some Google images over the weekend, I now realise that there is at least one species of annual crabgrass that looks very similar to my coarse 'velvety' grass. Further reading reveals that crabgrass doesn't really like shade, and indeed the shadier parts of my lawn are not really affected by this weed grass.
So I'm now thinking that my 'Yorkshire Fog' isn't - it might actually be a hairy form of crabgrass instead.
If that's the case, then mowing close might not be the best strategy. Instead, I need to be using a pre-emergent herbicide at the right time in spring, when the soil begins to warm up.
But I can't find such a product on the UK market. Can you get a pre-emergent herbicide for lawns in this country? Scotts make one, but it only seems to be marketed in the US. You can buy it from amazon.co.uk here, albeit with a hefty postage rate, which makes me think it's actually coming from the US!
The other thing I've read is that crabgrass responds very well to baking soda, which blackens it very rapidly. I might try this on an inconspicuous patch to see whether it damages the other grasses.
I actually think I've got two different types of crabgrass: the velvety one that looks like a closely-mown form of Yorkshire Fog, and a smoother one that has tough, purplish stalks.
Any other advice on how to combat crabgrass, assuming that is what I've got?
Almost everything fits: it's got broad leaves (up to 5-6mm across), 'rolled' stalks, paler colour (sometimes slightly blue), velvety texture, and the leaves are physically quite delicate and easily torn.
But one thing has been nagging me, and it doesn't fit: my problem with this type of grass always seems to disappear after autumn scarifying and during the winter, but comes back with a vengeance in mid-spring. I don't know why it hasn't occurred to me before that this points to it being an ANNUAL grass, not a perennial like Yorkshire Fog. It seems I might have been wrong for several years.
Browsing some Google images over the weekend, I now realise that there is at least one species of annual crabgrass that looks very similar to my coarse 'velvety' grass. Further reading reveals that crabgrass doesn't really like shade, and indeed the shadier parts of my lawn are not really affected by this weed grass.
So I'm now thinking that my 'Yorkshire Fog' isn't - it might actually be a hairy form of crabgrass instead.
If that's the case, then mowing close might not be the best strategy. Instead, I need to be using a pre-emergent herbicide at the right time in spring, when the soil begins to warm up.
But I can't find such a product on the UK market. Can you get a pre-emergent herbicide for lawns in this country? Scotts make one, but it only seems to be marketed in the US. You can buy it from amazon.co.uk here, albeit with a hefty postage rate, which makes me think it's actually coming from the US!
The other thing I've read is that crabgrass responds very well to baking soda, which blackens it very rapidly. I might try this on an inconspicuous patch to see whether it damages the other grasses.
I actually think I've got two different types of crabgrass: the velvety one that looks like a closely-mown form of Yorkshire Fog, and a smoother one that has tough, purplish stalks.
Any other advice on how to combat crabgrass, assuming that is what I've got?
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