A++ LED downlighting - which ones?

A++ LED downlighting - which ones?

Author
Discussion

Alucidnation

16,810 posts

169 months

Tuesday 28th July 2015
quotequote all
LED dimming modules are approximately £10-15 and will fit most plates.

Alucidnation

16,810 posts

169 months

Tuesday 28th July 2015
quotequote all
Granted, not all plates (UK) will take modules but i would say 95% do.

However, yes i suspect yours will be different over there.

smile

red_slr

17,122 posts

188 months

Tuesday 28th July 2015
quotequote all
Buzz84 said:
red_slr said:
What is the cost of this conversion? We are moving into a new place and there are 35 GU10s, maybe a few more I missed.
If you already have the fittings installed and want to upgrade them to LED's then the LAP LED's that Screwfix are great, I have 5 in my kitchen and they are really good, and all the reviews on the screwfix website are positive. plus they are the right size to be a direct hassle free upgrade.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/lap-gu10-led-lamp-346lm-...
http://www.screwfix.com/p/lap-gu10-led-lamps-346lm...

http://www.screwfix.com/p/lap-gu10-led-lamp-250lm-...
Ah ok that looks like it will do the job for not much money thanks!

smn159

12,446 posts

216 months

Tuesday 28th July 2015
quotequote all
I recently put a dozen Ecoled ZEP1's from E36Guy into my kitchen and I'm hugely impressed with the quality of the units themselves and with the light that they put out.


RobinOakapple

2,802 posts

111 months

Tuesday 28th July 2015
quotequote all
smn159 said:
I recently put a dozen Ecoled ZEP1's from E36Guy into my kitchen and I'm hugely impressed with the quality of the units themselves and with the light that they put out.
I think everybody gets that they are good, the thing is, how much do they cost?

smn159

12,446 posts

216 months

Tuesday 28th July 2015
quotequote all
RobinOakapple said:
I think everybody gets that they are good, the thing is, how much do they cost?
Well a quick Google suggests < £30, but suggest that you give Guy a call

E36GUY

5,906 posts

217 months

Thursday 30th July 2015
quotequote all
smn159 said:
Well a quick Google suggests < £30, but suggest that you give Guy a call
Anything you find online will not accurately reflect PH rate. If you want a price please send me an email.

astroarcadia

1,710 posts

199 months

Thursday 30th July 2015
quotequote all
I did and had no reply.

Also contacted via website and heard nothing.

RobinOakapple

2,802 posts

111 months

Friday 31st July 2015
quotequote all
smn159 said:
RobinOakapple said:
I think everybody gets that they are good, the thing is, how much do they cost?
Well a quick Google suggests < £30, but suggest that you give Guy a call
Based on the recommendation above I bought the Screwfix ones. something like £18 for 5. Very, very impressed. Tried one in a bar of halogens, and if anything it's brighter, plus the spread is better.

RedLeicester

6,869 posts

244 months

Friday 31st July 2015
quotequote all
We have a ton of these - http://www.ledhut.co.uk/spot-lights/gu10-led-bulbs...

The Zep things were all well and good, but blimey they were expensive, plus the cost of ripping out dozens of perfectly serviceable GU10 downlighters and cutting all new holes was bonkers. We used the Ledhut bunch above, and ordered about 8 different bulbs, tried them out simultaneously and then settled on the one I linked above as the best compromise between brightness and power use.


E36GUY

5,906 posts

217 months

Monday 3rd August 2015
quotequote all
RedLeicester said:
We have a ton of these - http://www.ledhut.co.uk/spot-lights/gu10-led-bulbs...

The Zep things were all well and good, but blimey they were expensive, plus the cost of ripping out dozens of perfectly serviceable GU10 downlighters and cutting all new holes was bonkers. We used the Ledhut bunch above, and ordered about 8 different bulbs, tried them out simultaneously and then settled on the one I linked above as the best compromise between brightness and power use.
To be fair, you bought yours quite some time ago when they were still reasonably new and yes, expensive. They've come down significantly since.

G

anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 5th August 2015
quotequote all
Homebase TCP LED bulbs are great prices at the moment . Under £3 for candle bulbs or pairs of gu10.. Loads of shapes & sizes, ..

E36GUY

5,906 posts

217 months

Wednesday 5th August 2015
quotequote all
Jimboka said:
Homebase TCP LED bulbs are great prices at the moment . Under £3 for candle bulbs or pairs of gu10.. Loads of shapes & sizes, ..
250 lumens. Only half what you'll get from a 50W halogen. Just saying. Again.

anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 5th August 2015
quotequote all
E36GUY said:
Jimboka said:
Homebase TCP LED bulbs are great prices at the moment . Under £3 for candle bulbs or pairs of gu10.. Loads of shapes & sizes, ..
250 lumens. Only half what you'll get from a 50W halogen. Just saying. Again.
330 lumens, Good enough for my application thanks, cheap as chips @£2.97 for two ..

Oakey

27,523 posts

215 months

Wednesday 5th August 2015
quotequote all
We just recently moved into a new house that had 6 GU10s in the bathroom, 9 in the kitchen, 2 in the downstairs toilet, 3 outside and 2 in the over extractor hood. All about 50w each. I replaced all of them with the 346lumen LAP ones from screwfix and haven't been disappointed. I'm guessing the tech has come on a bit since Guy's post in 2011 as they don't have massive heatsinks nor do they run very hot?

E36GUY

5,906 posts

217 months

Wednesday 5th August 2015
quotequote all
350 lumen is equivalent to a 35W halogen so not a 50W replacement but if they are working for you then that's what matters.

Remember, to look at them directly, given the light source for LED is far more intense, they will appear brighter than comparing it by eye to a 50 halogen but it's deceiving. The lux level (the level of light at a given distance from source) is where you would see the differences.

350 lumen is a realistic expectation for a retrofit hence why yours are not particularly hot. More than that needed you really want to go for a proper down light. With the limited heat sink you have, that's running about at capacity. If you simply up the wattage then this is when the sink would get overpowered.

We tested a remaining nameless retrofit GU10 LED lamp recommended on PH which was claiming a frankly ludicrous 580 lumens from 9W. We fitted it to a lux meter at 500mm distance. When it came on it was 1900 lux which was a decent start but an hour later, it was too hot to touch and the lux had dropped to 600. Thus it had lost 70% of it's initial output as it heated up. Ultimately, that's going to lead to failure.

It's the heat generated by electricity entering the semi-conductor part of the LED that we are needing to keep out of the diode itself to ensure that remains cool. If you can't do that effectively the diode will die in time. Further, as with all LED lights, you have the driver involved. With a down light these are separate items of a size typically a little larger than a 10 pack of fags. In a retrofit, this has been compressed into a tiny little package to fit within the lamp cap. Transformers by nature generate a bit of heat themselves so if you've got a heat sink that's running hotter than ideal and that is all running up into a tiny driver that itself has no breathing space then again, this can lead to failure. Pretty much all the GU10 failures I have witnessed are down to the failure of this part.

That is why the retrofits have limitations. I've never said they are rubbish - just that they have limitations with regards to output and lifespan. It's also important to understand that at the cheaper end of the market you really will be getting lower grade (wide step macadam ellipse) LED diodes. Effectively this means a looser tolerance around a colour temperature. You may think you are getting 3000k but with a wide step LED, this could be +/- 2-300k either side of that desired mark. Therefore, if you have several lights running along a wall for example, the output colours will all be varying shades as you can see below.



Not that they wont be bright neccessarily but the colour consistency and CRI (Colour Rendering Index - how correct colours look under that light) will not be anywhere near as good as higher spec product. Retrofit lamps by Soraa for example - which are about the best on the market using LEDs of the grade that we do cost pretty much what a complete down light does!

If one's happy driving a Lada great but if you want a Mercedes with leather, Bose and Nav then it's going to cost you more. Our market is no different.




Edited by E36GUY on Thursday 6th August 10:23

Number 7

4,101 posts

261 months

Wednesday 12th August 2015
quotequote all
Much as I like the apparent build quality and the output of these ZEP lights, having had 2 of 8 ZEP 1s fail in 18 months is slightly concerning. Having said that, the first was swapped for a new unit no problem, although the second I'm still waiting to hear about. Guy, 2 lights were received back in your office on 4 August. Would you be able to find out what the status is please, as I've heard nothing. Many thanks.

silversurfer1

918 posts

135 months

Wednesday 12th August 2015
quotequote all

I spent 7.5k on ecoled products about 2 years ago and i have to say they have been perfect not even a failed driver

ss


E36GUY

5,906 posts

217 months

Thursday 13th August 2015
quotequote all
Number 7 said:
Much as I like the apparent build quality and the output of these ZEP lights, having had 2 of 8 ZEP 1s fail in 18 months is slightly concerning. Having said that, the first was swapped for a new unit no problem, although the second I'm still waiting to hear about. Guy, 2 lights were received back in your office on 4 August. Would you be able to find out what the status is please, as I've heard nothing. Many thanks.
You need to contact Layla at our office to put a chase on that as she administers any warranty requirements. Also - I don't know who to look up if I could as I do struggle to match PH names to real names!

Number 7

4,101 posts

261 months

Thursday 13th August 2015
quotequote all
E36GUY said:
You need to contact Layla at our office to put a chase on that as she administers any warranty requirements.
Tried that 3 days ago, which was a few days after the lights were returned (and copied in a.n. other) - no response. Will have to try again though...