wood flooring in a flat.
Discussion
The leasehold states that no wood allowed and so always had carpet down, OH is sensitive to dust and carpets are terrible at sucking up dust so much so that vacuums don't get it all.
The leasehold says no wood, but this was created 30+ years ago when sound would easily travel through it, now we have decent underlay that I can get that reduces noise by unto 25 decibels. So logic would state that wood should be possible now and cause no issues.
However what would be the issues of just doing it and not saying anything, I plan on keeping the property for many years to come and renting out when I don't want to live in London anymore.
I would normally talk to freeholder but last time I did that it cost £400 just to ask for permission to extend the lease, Im reluctant to pay the management company that kind of sum again to actually get a no answer.
So is the worst that could happen be that when I sell it it needs re-carpetting?
What would you do?
The leasehold says no wood, but this was created 30+ years ago when sound would easily travel through it, now we have decent underlay that I can get that reduces noise by unto 25 decibels. So logic would state that wood should be possible now and cause no issues.
However what would be the issues of just doing it and not saying anything, I plan on keeping the property for many years to come and renting out when I don't want to live in London anymore.
I would normally talk to freeholder but last time I did that it cost £400 just to ask for permission to extend the lease, Im reluctant to pay the management company that kind of sum again to actually get a no answer.
So is the worst that could happen be that when I sell it it needs re-carpetting?
What would you do?
Breaking the rules can only end badly. . .is there not an alternative, mega hoover or similar that could solve the dust intolerance problem for you ?
My neighbour upstairs has laminate in her kitchen, and we have had words about it ! To be fair to her she usually wears slippers but I can still hear every footstep. When her daughter arrives, I literally have to go out as it is almost like she is knocking on the front door, she knows she is creating noise but carries on. Fortunately she only comes over to her mum once a week to a fortnight, but it truly tests my resolve !
My neighbour upstairs has laminate in her kitchen, and we have had words about it ! To be fair to her she usually wears slippers but I can still hear every footstep. When her daughter arrives, I literally have to go out as it is almost like she is knocking on the front door, she knows she is creating noise but carries on. Fortunately she only comes over to her mum once a week to a fortnight, but it truly tests my resolve !
we have no underlay at the moment, so why is just a carpet less noisy than something like this:
http://www.soundreduction.co.uk/Products/Soundproo...
with wood floor, we only wear shoes when leaving the property... never inside and neither do guests, so not sure how it would be any worse.
http://www.soundreduction.co.uk/Products/Soundproo...
with wood floor, we only wear shoes when leaving the property... never inside and neither do guests, so not sure how it would be any worse.
Don't know what sort of flat you live in. Take our 2 year old-Barratts produced flat in Woking as an example. People above us recently moved out, but for 2 years we listened to everything thanks to them laying wood or laminate. I think the woman of the flat walked about on her heels and it was pretty frustrating being woken up nightly listening to them playing basketball.... I lie, they weren't playing basketball it was them rutting each other. I remember one bank holiday being woken up 4 times with her moaning like a pig and the noise from the bed. I installed a fan and it runs every night to drown out noise.
They have moved out, someone else has moved in and we've not heard anything since. Dont know if they laid carpet or what.
Guy below us has complained about us more than once because we have laid amtico - insulated and bought from Barratts. Its more than likely someone else in the block...
We can also hear and feel vibrations and footsteps from across the hallway as there are people that have laid laminate there as well. unfortunately the sound travels in the block. I can sometimes hear a couple from what I assume is about 4 floors below absolutely going hell for leather in the bedroom. I think I am doing something wrong.... but i digress.
What I am trying to say is.... Don't be a cu*t. Lay carpet and be courteous unless you have an open plan kitchen and living room where grease will get everywhere then carpet probably isnt the best idea.
They have moved out, someone else has moved in and we've not heard anything since. Dont know if they laid carpet or what.
Guy below us has complained about us more than once because we have laid amtico - insulated and bought from Barratts. Its more than likely someone else in the block...
We can also hear and feel vibrations and footsteps from across the hallway as there are people that have laid laminate there as well. unfortunately the sound travels in the block. I can sometimes hear a couple from what I assume is about 4 floors below absolutely going hell for leather in the bedroom. I think I am doing something wrong.... but i digress.
What I am trying to say is.... Don't be a cu*t. Lay carpet and be courteous unless you have an open plan kitchen and living room where grease will get everywhere then carpet probably isnt the best idea.
essayer said:
What is the wording of the clause? Does it mandate carpet, or are other non wood options permitted, like Karndean?
Leasehold state in the third schedule before referred to.5. The floors of the Flat except the bathrooms cellars kitchens shall be completely covered with carpet.
It also states no window boxes, everyone has them.
Leasehold was created in 1983
I was on both ends of this when I lived in flats in London.
Regardless of what you do the noise will be worse. There are two kinds of noise where this is concerned...airborne noise i.e. the sound of music etc and impact noise i.e. the sound of footsteps across a wooden floor. Even if you put down underlay the latter is very hard to stop because the wooden floor needs to be totally isolated from the building....i.e. if the wooden floor is touching the wall/skirting etc then the noise will be transmitted via walls etc. Wooden floors are also much worse for airborne noise.
If you put it down it is almost certainly your neighbour will complain because it will impact them almost regardless of what you do.
In the last place we lived in London the upstairs neighbour asked if she could put down wooden floors. I said yes as a neighbour and a co-freeholder (it was share of freehold) on the strict understanding that it made no impact on us. She put it down...contractor did a s
t job so I complained politely...neighbour ignored polite complaint. Over the course of the next six months she ignored two or three other polite requests. So I sent a rather sterner one. That was ignored too. So I gave up and called an EGM as director and 50% shareholder of the freehold company.
Long story short we ended up having a professional sound company in...they said the floors were outside building regulations (which are pretty lax btw). So she pulled the floor up and had new insulation put down specced by said experts. Floor was still in breach so she had to pull the floor up.
Massive falling out with neighbours...cost me a couple of thousand pounds and probably cost my neighbour £10k and she still had carpets down.
If you put it down and are in breach of your lease (which you will be however loosely it's worded)...you can be made to pull it up again.
Regardless of what you do the noise will be worse. There are two kinds of noise where this is concerned...airborne noise i.e. the sound of music etc and impact noise i.e. the sound of footsteps across a wooden floor. Even if you put down underlay the latter is very hard to stop because the wooden floor needs to be totally isolated from the building....i.e. if the wooden floor is touching the wall/skirting etc then the noise will be transmitted via walls etc. Wooden floors are also much worse for airborne noise.
If you put it down it is almost certainly your neighbour will complain because it will impact them almost regardless of what you do.
In the last place we lived in London the upstairs neighbour asked if she could put down wooden floors. I said yes as a neighbour and a co-freeholder (it was share of freehold) on the strict understanding that it made no impact on us. She put it down...contractor did a s
t job so I complained politely...neighbour ignored polite complaint. Over the course of the next six months she ignored two or three other polite requests. So I sent a rather sterner one. That was ignored too. So I gave up and called an EGM as director and 50% shareholder of the freehold company.Long story short we ended up having a professional sound company in...they said the floors were outside building regulations (which are pretty lax btw). So she pulled the floor up and had new insulation put down specced by said experts. Floor was still in breach so she had to pull the floor up.
Massive falling out with neighbours...cost me a couple of thousand pounds and probably cost my neighbour £10k and she still had carpets down.
If you put it down and are in breach of your lease (which you will be however loosely it's worded)...you can be made to pull it up again.
Oh I understand all that, Im trying to find a way to put it down to do both:
1. Limit the noise properly so downstairs can't tell the difference
2. Get rid of the dust issues that are effecting my OH, she doesnt like to be pill popping every day due to dust.
I get that I will eventually need to pull it up, again I can cover that cost and its fine, just at the moment the dust is getting to the OH even with a lot of cleaning.
1. Limit the noise properly so downstairs can't tell the difference
2. Get rid of the dust issues that are effecting my OH, she doesnt like to be pill popping every day due to dust.
I get that I will eventually need to pull it up, again I can cover that cost and its fine, just at the moment the dust is getting to the OH even with a lot of cleaning.
nitrodave said:
Buy the missus some antihistamines.
Wood flooring wont change things, it just causes dust to gather around skirting and build up under furniture. It may make things worse as it has nowhere to get trapped.
I agree. Dust is produced constantly due to humans and their activities. Carpets help keep it at floor level until it can be hoovered. We have recent experience of this having gone from carpet to Karndean (no neighbours). Dust on a hard surface gets swirled up again as people walk across it.Wood flooring wont change things, it just causes dust to gather around skirting and build up under furniture. It may make things worse as it has nowhere to get trapped.
Du1point8 said:
Oh I understand all that, Im trying to find a way to put it down to do both:
1. Limit the noise properly so downstairs can't tell the difference
Honestly unless the building is purposely built for it you will have to spend a fortune....this is the kind of thing you need to do1. Limit the noise properly so downstairs can't tell the difference
That's not a cheap solution....to do that in a standard size London 1 bed flat you're talking a fortune. Proper five figure spend. And unless you do that it will impact your neighbours and your contractor won't guarantee the result either. All you need is a sloppy piece of work somewhere with the floor making contact with the wall/joist and you have a nightmare on your hands.
Du1point8 said:
I do wonder as I stripped the floor in the lounge 7 years ago to bare wood floor and the downstairs neighbours have never complained.
Maybe Im a quiet owner who makes no noise.
Or maybe they are the sort of people who put up with noise rather than risk it getting worse by your reacting badly to a complaint.Maybe Im a quiet owner who makes no noise.
RobinOakapple said:
Du1point8 said:
I do wonder as I stripped the floor in the lounge 7 years ago to bare wood floor and the downstairs neighbours have never complained.
Maybe Im a quiet owner who makes no noise.
Or maybe they are the sort of people who put up with noise rather than risk it getting worse by your reacting badly to a complaint.Maybe Im a quiet owner who makes no noise.
Gassing Station | Homes, Gardens and DIY | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff