Smart meters - what's the current thinking?
Discussion
DaveCWK said:
We have had regular TRIAD periods in work at peak late afternoon/evening times over this past Nov/Dec, where we are given 1 days notice & put on a penal electricity tariff which is 450 times higher per kWh than the normal rate.
Is there anything to suggest that this type of grid management will never be extended to domestic customers? I see it as inevitable & will resist the move to a smart meter for as long as possible.
That's how I see it, along with the lack of transparency with the future use of the meters when there "sold" to the public, they are pushing the savings but not the potential cost increases.Is there anything to suggest that this type of grid management will never be extended to domestic customers? I see it as inevitable & will resist the move to a smart meter for as long as possible.
kennydies said:
Our Gas meter is buried under a granite worktop and behind a kitchen cupboard. I don't see how they could even replace it without destroying a corner of our kitchen. What would they do in this case?
A not insignificant problem...a lot of the jobs fail for similar. Some suppliers are training fitters in carpentry and updating their insurance to cover this, others are adopting a more Stan Laurel approach and perhaps hoping, 'I couldn't get past the cupboard to change it' protects them from the 'all reasonable steps' clause referred to earlier.I'm sure some on here mistake my informed (I design this crap for a living) but neutral view to smart as being in opposition to which ever side of the fence they happen to sit (for some reason in extremis).
So here's a link from the FT on the emergence time of day charging from a small supplier for domestic customers, yes it will eventually happen.
https://www.ft.com/content/ac3b2788-d0eb-11e6-b06b...
Think of it like telematics insurance, if you don't want big brother watching, don't sign up
Excerpt from the ft for non-subscribers,
...The tariff is made possible by the introduction of smart meters that provide accurate real-time measurement of energy usage in contrast to old analogue meters that have to be read manually by a meter reader.
Other suppliers are expected to follow Green Energy’s lead as smart meters become more widespread and the rise of “plug-in” electric vehicles increases demand for cheap overnight rates.
Policymakers see time-of-use tariffs as an important part of efforts to make the electricity system more efficient and flexible as Britain phases out coal-fired power in favour of less reliable renewable energy...
...Customers signing up to Green Energy’s so-called Tide tariff will be charged 4.99p per kilowatt hour between 11pm and 6am, compared with 24.99p per kW/hr during the weeknight peak between 4pm and 7pm and 11.99p at all other times...
So here's a link from the FT on the emergence time of day charging from a small supplier for domestic customers, yes it will eventually happen.
https://www.ft.com/content/ac3b2788-d0eb-11e6-b06b...
Think of it like telematics insurance, if you don't want big brother watching, don't sign up
Excerpt from the ft for non-subscribers,
...The tariff is made possible by the introduction of smart meters that provide accurate real-time measurement of energy usage in contrast to old analogue meters that have to be read manually by a meter reader.
Other suppliers are expected to follow Green Energy’s lead as smart meters become more widespread and the rise of “plug-in” electric vehicles increases demand for cheap overnight rates.
Policymakers see time-of-use tariffs as an important part of efforts to make the electricity system more efficient and flexible as Britain phases out coal-fired power in favour of less reliable renewable energy...
...Customers signing up to Green Energy’s so-called Tide tariff will be charged 4.99p per kilowatt hour between 11pm and 6am, compared with 24.99p per kW/hr during the weeknight peak between 4pm and 7pm and 11.99p at all other times...
Edited by stewjohnst on Tuesday 3rd January 15:29
eliot said:
^ I wonder if they have a clause in that contract that says you have to use power outside the 4.99p rate.
I'm thinking along the lines of off-grid energy setup that you charge overnight.
Or buy an old water tower and create your own pumped storage system.
I was thinking the same, I wonder if enough people did it off peak may become the peak.I'm thinking along the lines of off-grid energy setup that you charge overnight.
Or buy an old water tower and create your own pumped storage system.
PRTVR said:
I was thinking the same, I wonder if enough people did it off peak may become the peak.
Rather comically they haven't even bothered to update their T&C's - as they only promise to read your meter every two years!http://www.greenenergyuk.com/Files/TermsAndConditi...
It's also not entirely clear if the have included vat in those published rates either, section 4.2 of the contract says vat is due, yet the main web sites makes no mention either way.
For those that don't know, Smart Energy GB, the body that is funding those rather puerile Gaz and Leccy adverts all over is funded (somewhat involuntarily - it's a regulation) by the suppliers. Despite SEGB spending the suppliers money (that they in turn get from you, dear peasant), they have limited say over how their money is spent by Smart energy GB.
No fear though, I'm sure we'd all agree this is an excellent use of funds...
(p.s. it all goes on your gas bill).
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9ZRQA3iVjT33UAUJ...
Anybody got some keyboard wipes?
Apologies, I haven't read the entire thread but one of my colleagues who's a bit weird anyway has been telling us this tale as to how someone turned up at his parents from the energy company and convinced them to have smart meters fitted. Fair enough but he's also convinced that these thing can cause problems to pace makers, your wifi, etc. and that the one at his parents house is making the understairs cupboard noticeably warm since its installation.
I understand they work on some sort of mesh network so I guess if none of the neighbours have them yet it could be communicating with other meters miles away? If so it could be turning up the power like a mobile phone does to maintain error free comms and would therefore be getting a bit hotter than usual?
I'd have also thought the average site for a leccy meter is less than favourable from an RF point of view, ours is in the middle of the house in the understairs cupboard so several walls to get through and I also have my wifi router in there. No smart meter yet but I think I'll resist until I'm sure the technology is mature?
Any truth in my colleagues paranoia?
I understand they work on some sort of mesh network so I guess if none of the neighbours have them yet it could be communicating with other meters miles away? If so it could be turning up the power like a mobile phone does to maintain error free comms and would therefore be getting a bit hotter than usual?
I'd have also thought the average site for a leccy meter is less than favourable from an RF point of view, ours is in the middle of the house in the understairs cupboard so several walls to get through and I also have my wifi router in there. No smart meter yet but I think I'll resist until I'm sure the technology is mature?
Any truth in my colleagues paranoia?
stewjohnst said:
For those that don't know, Smart Energy GB, the body that is funding those rather puerile Gaz and Leccy adverts all over is funded (somewhat involuntarily - it's a regulation) by the suppliers. Despite SEGB spending the suppliers money (that they in turn get from you, dear peasant), they have limited say over how their money is spent by Smart energy GB.
No fear though, I'm sure we'd all agree this is an excellent use of funds...
(p.s. it all goes on your gas bill).
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9ZRQA3iVjT33UAUJ...
Anybody got some keyboard wipes?
Yep, "By 2020, the full cost could well exceed £100 million" - for just the adverts.No fear though, I'm sure we'd all agree this is an excellent use of funds...
(p.s. it all goes on your gas bill).
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC9ZRQA3iVjT33UAUJ...
Anybody got some keyboard wipes?
https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2017...
The same site has numerous articles covering the whole smart meter debacle/cost/futility/incompetence if anyone wants to read the facts rather than propaganda.
My energy company are desperate for me to have a smart meter but more importantly the trial of different meters has not concluded so we're in the equivalent of VHS v BetaMax market supremacy challenge.
Not all smart meters are compatible with some energy companies so if you select now you may limit your opportunity to switch to a cheaper tarrif down the line.
When the Gov force me to have one then I'll comply but not until the very last minute as my 'Ferranti' model is working rather well. Plus I pass on my readings via their App ever month so I already get accurate billing
Not all smart meters are compatible with some energy companies so if you select now you may limit your opportunity to switch to a cheaper tarrif down the line.
When the Gov force me to have one then I'll comply but not until the very last minute as my 'Ferranti' model is working rather well. Plus I pass on my readings via their App ever month so I already get accurate billing
Edited by Zingari on Monday 9th January 18:56
I switched to EON in November and since then I've had two emails asking me to contact them for a smart meter fitting. I've ignored them. Then today, Barbara (with a beautiful voice) rang me to persuade me to have one. I said that our electricity meter was very hard to get to as it was behind some kitchen cupboards, and I would prefer not to have one. She said that was absolutely fine and she would cancel any further communication on the matter. So, if you get pestered, just tell them your meter is inaccessible.
RicksAlfas said:
I switched to EON in November and since then I've had two emails asking me to contact them for a smart meter fitting. I've ignored them. Then today, Barbara (with a beautiful voice) rang me to persuade me to have one. I said that our electricity meter was very hard to get to as it was behind some kitchen cupboards, and I would prefer not to have one. She said that was absolutely fine and she would cancel any further communication on the matter. So, if you get pestered, just tell them your meter is inaccessible.
I'll tell them my meter is behind Rick's kitchen units. That'll fox 'em.Zoon said:
ashleyman said:
BG have offered us a smart-meter on our current plan with the same cost per KW/Gas but with a day of the weekend where we get free electricity.
Very tempted to go for it.
The old bait and switch technique.Very tempted to go for it.
kennydies said:
Our Gas meter is buried under a granite worktop and behind a kitchen cupboard. I don't see how they could even replace it without destroying a corner of our kitchen. What would they do in this case?
Ask yourself 'What would they do if the existing gas meter became faulty and/or started to leak?' They'd either replace it or if they genuinely couldn't access it, they'd cut off the gas supply to make it safe. Maybe they won't do this straight away with smart meter replacements as they still have the option to leave it, but longer term it'll have to come out . Was the existing meter already in there and the kitchen built around it? I think that would make it your responsibility to provide reasonable access.
eliot said:
^ I wonder if they have a clause in that contract that says you have to use power outside the 4.99p rate.
I'm thinking along the lines of off-grid energy setup that you charge overnight.
Or buy an old water tower and create your own pumped storage system.
Sounds like a lot of effort to go to to try to save a few bob.I'm thinking along the lines of off-grid energy setup that you charge overnight.
Or buy an old water tower and create your own pumped storage system.
If you shift 5 units of electric from peak to cheap rate thats a daily saving of £1. If your system has 50% efficiency you'd save a couple of grand over ten years. Before any costs of installing/ maintaining the system.
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