Generator problem

[Saleen836]

I have bught myself a new generator to replace my old one written off in the accident I was involved in, this is what I bought... http://www.seddonplant.co.uk/generators/honda-gene...

All it has to power at work is a 110v mixing drill and a drywal sander and hoover (both 110v), it is powered by the same engine as my old generator (Honda EC2200). Both generators are 5.5hp and 2200w. My old generator powered the sander/hoover with no problems but the new one wont, if I plug just the hoover direct to the generator it trips the genny within 10secs, have borrowed a friends hoover which is identical and that also trips the genny within 10 seconds! Now, if I plug my mains transformer into the 240v socket on the genny and run the hoover through that it works perfectly, any ideas as to what is going on?

[eliot]

maybe you only get 1000w on 110v?

Edit - yes, only 1kw in 110v mode:
http://www.kelvinpowertools.com/honda-em2300-gener...

Edited by eliot on Friday 17th February 17:47

[MDMA .]

Would a 110v only not have been better for site work?

http://www.justgenerators.co.uk/stephill-2700hmsc-...

[finlo]

110v is no longer a requirement for site work.

[Saleen836]

eliot said:

maybe you only get 1000w on 110v?

Edit - yes, only 1kw in 110v mode:
http://www.kelvinpowertools.com/honda-em2300-gener...

Edited by eliot on Friday 17th February 17:47

That would explain it thanks, anyone want to buy a generator?

[eliot]

I think you have reasonable grounds to return it based on the fact that they dont make it clear that it's only 1kw in 110v
I had a good search round including reading the user manual and specs and couldn't see it. It was just that listing i posted mentioned it in the title only and I only found that because i was specifically trying to search based on my theory that the power output is half on 110v
Hondas are a reputable brand and i would expect them to make it clear - you normally expect the clone chinese ones to pull that stunt.

[Saleen836]

eliot said:

I think you have reasonable grounds to return it based on the fact that they dont make it clear that it's only 1kw in 110v
I had a good search round including reading the user manual and specs and couldn't see it. It was just that listing i posted mentioned it in the title only and I only found that because i was specifically trying to search based on my theory that the power output is half on 110v
Hondas are a reputable brand and i would expect them to make it clear - you normally expect the clone chinese ones to pull that stunt.

Thanks, the reason I bought this model is because it was the closest output to my previous one, having the same engine etc, the website I purchased it from says nothing about it being only 1kw on 110v, anything with more KW output is a huge outlay and simply overkill for my needs, it isn't the end of the world though as it will only be 2-4 hours, one maybe two days a week for the sander/hoover to be used so will plug in my transformer and as the finished houses on the site get powered up I will be plugging into the mains. I've paid for it out of my own pocket, as my insurance claim is still ongoing i don't know if they will replace my damaged genny or pay me for it.

[Saleen836]

I made the call yesterday to the company where I purchased the generator, explained the problem to the lady on the telephone and I guess she is an expert in all things magical, apparently as I am wanting to run something with a motor off the generator the output needs to be a minimum of 3 times the output of what I want to run!

I'm waiting for a call back from someone higher up the food chain!

[anonymous-user]

Saleen836 said:

I made the call yesterday to the company where I purchased the generator, explained the problem to the lady on the telephone and I guess she is an expert in all things magical, apparently as I am wanting to run something with a motor off the generator the output needs to be a minimum of 3 times the output of what I want to run!

I'm waiting for a call back from someone higher up the food chain!

Well I am not an electrical engineer, but there might be some merit in what she said - along the lines of startup current and motor inductance resulting in load spikes. The step-up transformer might help shield the genny from these things to a certain extent which is why it works when the transformer is placed between the hoover and the genny?

[eliot]

Skodasupercar said:

Well I am not an electrical engineer, but there might be some merit in what she said - along the lines of startup current and motor inductance resulting in load spikes. The step-up transformer might help shield the genny from these things to a certain extent which is why it works when the transformer is placed between the hoover and the genny?

Transformer is 240 to 110v. The assumption is that the 2.2kw rating is only on 240v

[guindilias]

I have a 3kW electric motor on a log splitter - starting current is 72A. Motors can take a lot to get going, particularly depending on their starting wiring configuration.

[eliot]

guindilias said:

I have a 3kW electric motor on a log splitter - starting current is 72A. Motors can take a lot to get going, particularly depending on their starting wiring configuration.

He's running a hoover and sander..

[guindilias]

Plenty of hoovers around the 2kW range - that would give you a far bigger starting current than the genny is rated for.

[Saleen836]

guindilias said:

Plenty of hoovers around the 2kW range - that would give you a far bigger starting current than the genny is rated for.

My drywall sander is 700w and my hoover is 1200w

[guindilias]

And you only have 1000w available at 110v - so the hoover could very easily trip the genny breaker. My best guess is that the inductance provided by the windings of the transformer is softening some of that peak starting current, hence why it works with the transformer but pops the breaker without.

[Jambo85]

guindilias said:

And you only have 1000w available at 110v - so the hoover could very easily trip the genny breaker. My best guess is that the inductance provided by the windings of the transformer is softening some of that peak starting current, hence why it works with the transformer but pops the breaker without.

You're over thinking it - the transformer is connected to the 220V supply which is rated at 2.2 kW or so.

[guindilias]

Ah, I am indeed... But you do still get a large starting current from some motors, it could be best to stick a meter on it?

[Saleen836]

guindilias said:

And you only have 1000w available at 110v - so the hoover could very easily trip the genny breaker. My best guess is that the inductance provided by the windings of the transformer is softening some of that peak starting current, hence why it works with the transformer but pops the breaker without.

Correct and this is the problem, I bought the generator in the belief it was 2.2kw output from either outlet not just the 240v outlet as discovered!

(starting amps on the hoover is 12 FYI)

[guindilias]

Also, chances are that is a "Surge" rating of 2300 - likely to be 2000w for full time use, or around that. Different genny or different hoover time?

[Saleen836]

guindilias said:

Also, chances are that is a "Surge" rating of 2300 - likely to be 2000w for full time use, or around that. Different genny or different hoover time?

2000w full time use is still 100w more than my sander/hover combined, if this generator was putting out the 2.2kw from both sockets there would be no problem, the fact I have to plug in a transformer when i shouldn't have to is the problem.