Heating system quote
Discussion
I've had a quote for a replacement heating system (I'm going to get more) and tbh I was a bit shocked by it, wondering if any resident ph plumbers can offer an opinion.
We have a four bed detached house with a traditional heating system:
- boiler in the kitchen
- hot water tank in a cupboard on the landing
- cold water tank in the loft
- total of 12 radiators about half of which are quite small
I want to get the loft space for storage and the landing space to extend our very small en-suite a little so wanted to go Combi however, the plumber has suggested this might not be sufficient and we'd be better with a system boiler and unvented tank. We have an odd spare cupboard for this above the stairs so this is fine.
Total work involved:
- remove old tanks and boiler and some pipework
- new gas feed from the meters around the outside of the house to the boiler location
- fit new system boiler
- fit new unvented tank and pipework
- fit 7 new radiators (standard modern double panel type, nothing fancy)
Total price: just over £11k including vat
By my reckoning there's no more than about £4k in parts considering that the vat is reclaimable on his costs? He reckons 1-2 weeks for the work.
Anyone have any thoughts please? Am I being unrealistic to think this is excessive? What would you expect such a job to typically cost?
We have a four bed detached house with a traditional heating system:
- boiler in the kitchen
- hot water tank in a cupboard on the landing
- cold water tank in the loft
- total of 12 radiators about half of which are quite small
I want to get the loft space for storage and the landing space to extend our very small en-suite a little so wanted to go Combi however, the plumber has suggested this might not be sufficient and we'd be better with a system boiler and unvented tank. We have an odd spare cupboard for this above the stairs so this is fine.
Total work involved:
- remove old tanks and boiler and some pipework
- new gas feed from the meters around the outside of the house to the boiler location
- fit new system boiler
- fit new unvented tank and pipework
- fit 7 new radiators (standard modern double panel type, nothing fancy)
Total price: just over £11k including vat
By my reckoning there's no more than about £4k in parts considering that the vat is reclaimable on his costs? He reckons 1-2 weeks for the work.
Anyone have any thoughts please? Am I being unrealistic to think this is excessive? What would you expect such a job to typically cost?
Hi,
We had the majority of our system replaced late 2016. 4 bed detached, with open vented boiler in kitchen, vented tank in airing cupboard and 2x large water, plus F/E tank in loft. We are only single bathroom, with a very shallow roof (so cant use the loft space for boiler or unvented cylinder, wanted the space in the garage etc etc though, so went the 'sensibly sized' WB Combi. Here is our very high level breakdown:
Removal and disposal of old boiler, flue (went all the way up through the house) tanks etc
Fit WB boiler and new flue out to the roof in airing cupboard
New gas supply pipe, run inside the house through existing boxing etc (im picky and dont like the pipes outside the house!)
Condensate pumped up into loft and into soil stack (again - me being picky and not wanting 32mm pipe on the outside of the house!)
Replace all radiators upstairs (x5) and x2 downstairs as they were old non-convector style rads
Run pipes into loft in preparation for new shower installation
Full power flush
Scale inhibitor
Magnaclean jobbie
Notes - I supplied the Nest thermostat, and the existing 10mm microbore piping was used - replacing this would have meant alot of making good afterwards and significant time/effort and materials lifting floors/chasing walls etc. That and copper seems to be a horrific price!
Total cost was circa £2700. (i cant remember exactly but it was around this)
The chap I use is WB Accredited, this with the extra bits (magnaclean etc) got me the 10 year warranty on the boiler. Im in Swindon.
If you are in the same area, I can PM you the details of who I used and another recommendation.
Cheers
Rob
We had the majority of our system replaced late 2016. 4 bed detached, with open vented boiler in kitchen, vented tank in airing cupboard and 2x large water, plus F/E tank in loft. We are only single bathroom, with a very shallow roof (so cant use the loft space for boiler or unvented cylinder, wanted the space in the garage etc etc though, so went the 'sensibly sized' WB Combi. Here is our very high level breakdown:
Removal and disposal of old boiler, flue (went all the way up through the house) tanks etc
Fit WB boiler and new flue out to the roof in airing cupboard
New gas supply pipe, run inside the house through existing boxing etc (im picky and dont like the pipes outside the house!)
Condensate pumped up into loft and into soil stack (again - me being picky and not wanting 32mm pipe on the outside of the house!)
Replace all radiators upstairs (x5) and x2 downstairs as they were old non-convector style rads
Run pipes into loft in preparation for new shower installation
Full power flush
Scale inhibitor
Magnaclean jobbie
Notes - I supplied the Nest thermostat, and the existing 10mm microbore piping was used - replacing this would have meant alot of making good afterwards and significant time/effort and materials lifting floors/chasing walls etc. That and copper seems to be a horrific price!
Total cost was circa £2700. (i cant remember exactly but it was around this)
The chap I use is WB Accredited, this with the extra bits (magnaclean etc) got me the 10 year warranty on the boiler. Im in Swindon.
If you are in the same area, I can PM you the details of who I used and another recommendation.
Cheers
Rob
Keep in mind though that there wasnt the cost of new cylinders etc, so the main cost was the Combi boiler. I have no idea on cost of the other parts that would be needed for a (un)vented system, but undoubtedly there will be more!
Also, have a quick look at the cost of 5x 15mm lengths of copper pipe at say B&Q - although they will be getting their trade prices, if your rads are going to be re-piped, it will add significant cost in just piping id have thought. It took our chap 3 days, half a day just for power flushing.
Unfortunately i dont think he will go that far, but definitely get alternative quotes.
To summarise, if it was going to be 10k ish for our boiler, I would have opted to maintain the existing boiler and in the event of it going for a major burton in the future, would have replaced as 'like for like' /cheaply as possible! Probably the wrong way to look at a heating system replacement, but given the reduction in gas consumption, we will likely get a ROI in about the 8 year mark - quite a difference for us, particularly as Mrs K seems to like to set the thermostat to what I call the 'Tropics' mode !
Only other note would be that there are bound to be lots of considerations and variations on each job, that only someone experienced in the trade will know - they can all add up to additional cost - you mentioned about the gas pipe inside, - it might be that the route required adds a certain amount of bends, which means that the pipe has to be up-sized, and therefore is too big to be notched into joists, therefore unable to route inside?
Overall, although our chap isnt necessarily the cheapest (yes surprisingly we did get a marginally cheaper quote) Im happy to pay extra for the job to be done well and exactly the way I wanted it. Gas is probably one of the few things in the house that legally I/we as untrained/uncertified folk couldn't effect a temporary repair on when it busts at 20:00 on a sunday evening - I think technically you cant even take the cover off a room sealed boiler. So having a tradesperson who is trusted and does a good job is worth the extra pennies!
Cheers
Rob
Also, have a quick look at the cost of 5x 15mm lengths of copper pipe at say B&Q - although they will be getting their trade prices, if your rads are going to be re-piped, it will add significant cost in just piping id have thought. It took our chap 3 days, half a day just for power flushing.
Unfortunately i dont think he will go that far, but definitely get alternative quotes.
To summarise, if it was going to be 10k ish for our boiler, I would have opted to maintain the existing boiler and in the event of it going for a major burton in the future, would have replaced as 'like for like' /cheaply as possible! Probably the wrong way to look at a heating system replacement, but given the reduction in gas consumption, we will likely get a ROI in about the 8 year mark - quite a difference for us, particularly as Mrs K seems to like to set the thermostat to what I call the 'Tropics' mode !
Only other note would be that there are bound to be lots of considerations and variations on each job, that only someone experienced in the trade will know - they can all add up to additional cost - you mentioned about the gas pipe inside, - it might be that the route required adds a certain amount of bends, which means that the pipe has to be up-sized, and therefore is too big to be notched into joists, therefore unable to route inside?
Overall, although our chap isnt necessarily the cheapest (yes surprisingly we did get a marginally cheaper quote) Im happy to pay extra for the job to be done well and exactly the way I wanted it. Gas is probably one of the few things in the house that legally I/we as untrained/uncertified folk couldn't effect a temporary repair on when it busts at 20:00 on a sunday evening - I think technically you cant even take the cover off a room sealed boiler. So having a tradesperson who is trusted and does a good job is worth the extra pennies!
Cheers
Rob
Both prices above seem extreme.
We had complete system replaced at daughters little house - got two quotes that were remarkably identical at £4K inc VAT. House already had an old Combi and they had to repipe (as it was a single pipe system in steel!) the upstairs and two downstairs rooms which where done in trunking. House has kitchen / dining extension and there was some uncertainty about how that had been done but it was fine and they were able to connect to it OK.
My gripe with it was they (2 guys) said it would take them 4 days, perhaps into 5. I was bit gobsmacked when they rang towards the end of day 2 to say they’d finished!
We had complete system replaced at daughters little house - got two quotes that were remarkably identical at £4K inc VAT. House already had an old Combi and they had to repipe (as it was a single pipe system in steel!) the upstairs and two downstairs rooms which where done in trunking. House has kitchen / dining extension and there was some uncertainty about how that had been done but it was fine and they were able to connect to it OK.
My gripe with it was they (2 guys) said it would take them 4 days, perhaps into 5. I was bit gobsmacked when they rang towards the end of day 2 to say they’d finished!
Combi boiler would be fine for that surely?
We have a Worcester 32cdi that feeds 13 rooms no problem at all, some rooms have 2 rads in them.
£2700 sounds very cheap though, that sounds more like the price to fit a boiler.
Also, he won't get his VAT back, well he will, but he will also pay it out on what he charges you for it.
We have a Worcester 32cdi that feeds 13 rooms no problem at all, some rooms have 2 rads in them.
£2700 sounds very cheap though, that sounds more like the price to fit a boiler.
Also, he won't get his VAT back, well he will, but he will also pay it out on what he charges you for it.
That sounds pricey. We had similar done but with oil and moving the boiler was £8k all in.
I would have thought a decent size combi would work, perhaps not if you use 2 showers at the same time.
Combi will be much less work and hence much cheaper.
Do you need it done in the middle of winter? Busy time for plumbers and a crap time to be without hot water / heating.
Get at least 3 quotes and ideally personal recommendations for the plumbers.
I would have thought a decent size combi would work, perhaps not if you use 2 showers at the same time.
Combi will be much less work and hence much cheaper.
Do you need it done in the middle of winter? Busy time for plumbers and a crap time to be without hot water / heating.
Get at least 3 quotes and ideally personal recommendations for the plumbers.
gizlaroc said:
Combi boiler would be fine for that surely?
We have a Worcester 32cdi that feeds 13 rooms no problem at all, some rooms have 2 rads in them.
I was thinking that as well - combis are rated for heating water, they're way over-rated for the heating requirements of all but the biggest of houses.We have a Worcester 32cdi that feeds 13 rooms no problem at all, some rooms have 2 rads in them.
The only downside I could think of is if the showers are combi powered and used by multiple people then the rads might cool down, which could cause mumblings on cold mornings. But I'd expect a fair amount of recovery even just between showers unless it was run continuously.
Both my daughters houses have combis with young families and say they work fine. One has a 4 bed house with a big bathtub and I know it fills that at a reasonable rate, and it's a good 60ft from the boiler. With young kids they do both miss the airing cupboard we have here though.
No mention of make, model and size of boiler and cylinder?
Could be a fair amount of work involved in changing to unvented - new 22mm cold supply, balanced cold supply to all outlets, secondary return on hot, discharge pipework.
Flooring will have to come up, is it carpet or laminate, chipboard or floorboards, rooms may be full of junk/furniture
Is there easy access, parking
Could be a fair amount of work involved in changing to unvented - new 22mm cold supply, balanced cold supply to all outlets, secondary return on hot, discharge pipework.
Flooring will have to come up, is it carpet or laminate, chipboard or floorboards, rooms may be full of junk/furniture
Is there easy access, parking
Boiler mentioned is not completely specific, simply viessman system boiler 30kw. No mention of the specific tank either, just 210 litre unvented tank.
Wood flooring downstairs mostly, carpet upstairs with (I think) chipboard floor panels underneath.
I have a feeling the gas supply from the meter to the boiler is in the concrete under the house?
No problem with parking on our drive.
Wood flooring downstairs mostly, carpet upstairs with (I think) chipboard floor panels underneath.
I have a feeling the gas supply from the meter to the boiler is in the concrete under the house?
No problem with parking on our drive.
Edited by skahigh on Sunday 28th January 15:06
Alucidnation said:
Combi boilers are good for a two bed semi and rentals.
And even then I still wouldn’t fit one.
Try a Vailant 938 and then say combis are not fit for purpose. And even then I still wouldn’t fit one.
Currently got these in 2 houses, one is a 4 bed 2 en-suites 1 bathroom property and you are never short of hot water at good pressure.
Biggest downside is no alternative hot water source when it eventually breaks down.
sounds massively overpriced to me
my dad had a new combo fitted in place of the old system which was the same as yours
his has 15/16 rooms to feed and has absolutely no problem at all, infarct he's just extended his house and its handled it all no problem whatsoever and paid 8k
and he hasn't skimped either new double radiators with some rooms having 2 in them
my dad had a new combo fitted in place of the old system which was the same as yours
his has 15/16 rooms to feed and has absolutely no problem at all, infarct he's just extended his house and its handled it all no problem whatsoever and paid 8k
and he hasn't skimped either new double radiators with some rooms having 2 in them
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