External condensate pipe freezing
Discussion
Came downstairs this morning to the buzzing of the (external) condensate pump which had most likely been running all night (-12 here) I'd say this is a hazard as there is no cut off for the pump & it was pretty hot....
I had to pull the outlet pipe off & direct into a bucket (the easy way) I need to speak to the installers about running a proper lagged pipe rather than the 8mm flexible clear pipe that comes with the pump. Boiler install is only a few weeks old.
Is the drain regs the same for Scotland ? As I'm sure mine may be routed down a rain water drain.
What’s the normal set up with a condensate pump/drain ?
I had to pull the outlet pipe off & direct into a bucket (the easy way) I need to speak to the installers about running a proper lagged pipe rather than the 8mm flexible clear pipe that comes with the pump. Boiler install is only a few weeks old.
Is the drain regs the same for Scotland ? As I'm sure mine may be routed down a rain water drain.
What’s the normal set up with a condensate pump/drain ?
The high acidity of the condensate means it can't be run to a soakaway. If you have a combined system then essentially it IS a foul drain so there's no problem.
It can be run to a purpose made small soakaway of it's own. This contains (and is surrounded by) limestone chippings to neutralise the condensate.
It can be run to a purpose made small soakaway of it's own. This contains (and is surrounded by) limestone chippings to neutralise the condensate.
Ferg said:
Which probably means they didn't check i.d.
This is what gets me, people tear into how s
t the bloke was that did their installation and yet no-one ever tries to get an installer who actually knows what he's doing!
I know this is an extreme test out there at the moment. But have you ever resorted to trace heating Ferg? Or does insulation always do the trick?This is what gets me, people tear into how s
t the bloke was that did their installation and yet no-one ever tries to get an installer who actually knows what he's doing!Just thinking some of the guys might be tempted to go belt and braces having spent hours in the cold!
Munter said:
Ferg said:
Which probably means they didn't check i.d.
This is what gets me, people tear into how st the bloke was that did their installation and yet no-one ever tries to get an installer who actually knows what he's doing!
I know this is an extreme test out there at the moment. But have you ever resorted to trace heating Ferg? Or does insulation always do the trick?This is what gets me, people tear into how s
t the bloke was that did their installation and yet no-one ever tries to get an installer who actually knows what he's doing!Just thinking some of the guys might be tempted to go belt and braces having spent hours in the cold!
FrankHovis said:
I chiselled the ice out of the gutter 
and then used a hairdryer. The pipe is only a couple of feet long and as soon as it started to warm, the ice started to slide out in one piece. I just had to keep breaking an inch at a time off as the gutter was in the way! It was lagged in the first place but I think its the gutter freezing which has caused the pipe to block and freeze. Its the first time its ever done it. It is bloody cold though.
Anyone attempting this, make sure you wear good gloves etc or chance of frostbite is very high.. and then used a hairdryer. The pipe is only a couple of feet long and as soon as it started to warm, the ice started to slide out in one piece. I just had to keep breaking an inch at a time off as the gutter was in the way! It was lagged in the first place but I think its the gutter freezing which has caused the pipe to block and freeze. Its the first time its ever done it. It is bloody cold though.Ferg said:
Proper insulation properly fitted is usually enough. To be honest I rarely fit condense drains externally. Once people know what a hideous monstrosity a lagged pipe is on the outside of their house I can usually explain the benefits of a better thought-out position.
We've got 22mm pipe on ours - it probably runs 6" horizontally out of the wall, then 90 degrees down and 6" more vertically into the drains hopper on a Northerly aspect wall. Froze tonight, and last night. Am I wasting my time pipe-lagging it? Do you think I need to increase it to 32mm?
After 4 kettles of water and a cold half hour in the dark I think I have just defrosted my external vent pipe thanks to the advice in here. My CH stopped working this evening and the boiler reset button was flashing. Wouldnt reset itself so...many thanks to this thread and PHers (and the installer who I spoke to briefly and mentioned something about the condensate pipe when I said the boiler is flashing EA at me, which prompted me to search condensate as a keyword on PH) this is my first house and I would have been at the mercy of waiting for the installer tomorrow without this advice here. I didnt even know what a condensate pipe was when I spoke to the plumber at 830pm.
Much appreciated PH! Hopefully I have sorted it!
Much appreciated PH! Hopefully I have sorted it!
You also need to make sure whatever pipe insulation you have or get, you have the thickest insulation possible.
Pipe insulation is based on BORE x WALL THICKNESS. So for example 15mm bore (copper pipe size) X 9mm Wall Thickness this would be classed as classed as 15 x 9.
The greater the wall thickness the less chance there is of freezing.
E.g. If you had a 15mm copper pipe under wooden floorboards in a house I would go for a wall thickness of 9mm as you will get a certain amount of thermal heat gain from the property. However, if the pipe is exposed to the elements or has limited thermal gain e.g. out side or in a loft space I would go for far greater wall thickness of 25mm.
These are the most common pipe insulation sizes, not all will be available in your local B&Q or wickes so you may have to go to a plumbers merchant
15 x 9
15 x 13
15 x 25
22 x 9
22 x 13
22 x 19
28 x 9
28 x 13
28 x 19
Pipe insulation is based on BORE x WALL THICKNESS. So for example 15mm bore (copper pipe size) X 9mm Wall Thickness this would be classed as classed as 15 x 9.
The greater the wall thickness the less chance there is of freezing.
E.g. If you had a 15mm copper pipe under wooden floorboards in a house I would go for a wall thickness of 9mm as you will get a certain amount of thermal heat gain from the property. However, if the pipe is exposed to the elements or has limited thermal gain e.g. out side or in a loft space I would go for far greater wall thickness of 25mm.
These are the most common pipe insulation sizes, not all will be available in your local B&Q or wickes so you may have to go to a plumbers merchant
15 x 9
15 x 13
15 x 25
22 x 9
22 x 13
22 x 19
28 x 9
28 x 13
28 x 19
Ferg said:
Munter said:
Ferg said:
Which probably means they didn't check i.d.
This is what gets me, people tear into how st the bloke was that did their installation and yet no-one ever tries to get an installer who actually knows what he's doing!
I know this is an extreme test out there at the moment. But have you ever resorted to trace heating Ferg? Or does insulation always do the trick?This is what gets me, people tear into how s
t the bloke was that did their installation and yet no-one ever tries to get an installer who actually knows what he's doing!Just thinking some of the guys might be tempted to go belt and braces having spent hours in the cold!
Think I'll stick with my old boiler, it's been perfect since the day it was installed.
lewes said:
I doubt its 32mm. I cant remember but I think Copper tube is measured by the ID and not the OD.
Copper tube comes in 15mm, 22, 28, 35, 42, 54 and 76mm.
Overflow is either 19mm or 21.5mm depending on the manufacturer.
If it is an exposed (ie external) run for the condensate it should be in 32mm waste to prevent freezing.Copper tube comes in 15mm, 22, 28, 35, 42, 54 and 76mm.
Overflow is either 19mm or 21.5mm depending on the manufacturer.
Thread resurrection as the temperature has plummeted. AGGGHHH my condensate pipes were fine in January (when everyone else was, it seems from the thread, having the problem, but now one of my two boilers is unhappy with condensate dripping from a poor joint on its condensate pipe. They empty into the roof gutter at about 7m above ground level, above a kitchen extension, so I can't access them without scaffolding. Nor can I see into the gutter... I left the boiler pipes un-lagged to ensure that the boiler room (in the eaves) didn't freeze, so I don't think it is the pipes inside the house, and they're only 2" long outside so I expect the problem is right at their tips or in the gutter.
Have switched off the boiler with the blocked pipe but 1) expect that the other will have the same problem soon and 2) one boiler won't heat the whole house so will have to disconnect the pipes - probably remove the traps is easiest and drain the condensate directly into bucket/s...anyone know how much will be produced? Like the how long is a piece of string question I suppose, depends on how much gas is burnt. I don't want it dripping into the bathroom below. Only way for a long term solution will be to feed the stuff into a foul drain beyond a lavatory trap inside the house I expect.
I'd have expected that the solutes in the condensate would be nasty enough to drop the freezing point below UK levels - it's only -3.5 here at the moment. Perhaps we're going to see more of this with global warming - my 1900 house isn't happy when we have sub zero temperatures for more than a few days - imagine what'll happen if the Gulf Stream stops - after all NY has a pretty bad winter climate and it is on the same latitude as Spain, we're on the latitude of various Canadian cities - the one closest to the coast that I could see has a daily mean temperature of - 4.2C for January.
Have switched off the boiler with the blocked pipe but 1) expect that the other will have the same problem soon and 2) one boiler won't heat the whole house so will have to disconnect the pipes - probably remove the traps is easiest and drain the condensate directly into bucket/s...anyone know how much will be produced? Like the how long is a piece of string question I suppose, depends on how much gas is burnt. I don't want it dripping into the bathroom below. Only way for a long term solution will be to feed the stuff into a foul drain beyond a lavatory trap inside the house I expect.
I'd have expected that the solutes in the condensate would be nasty enough to drop the freezing point below UK levels - it's only -3.5 here at the moment. Perhaps we're going to see more of this with global warming - my 1900 house isn't happy when we have sub zero temperatures for more than a few days - imagine what'll happen if the Gulf Stream stops - after all NY has a pretty bad winter climate and it is on the same latitude as Spain, we're on the latitude of various Canadian cities - the one closest to the coast that I could see has a daily mean temperature of - 4.2C for January.
Edited by nomisesor on Sunday 28th November 19:50
Hi All,
Just some quick advise needed please.
My condensate pipe has frozen again this year.......currently it is a white 22mm pipe that runs from the boiler in the loft through the eaves and out into the drain pipe.
To help prevent this from freezing every day am I best to upgrade the pipe to 32mm as it leaves the loft so that I have a 32mm pipe running through the eaves and to continue this outside as well? Also is it best to get it lagged outside and within the eaves?
Many Thanks - Jason
Just some quick advise needed please.
My condensate pipe has frozen again this year.......currently it is a white 22mm pipe that runs from the boiler in the loft through the eaves and out into the drain pipe.
To help prevent this from freezing every day am I best to upgrade the pipe to 32mm as it leaves the loft so that I have a 32mm pipe running through the eaves and to continue this outside as well? Also is it best to get it lagged outside and within the eaves?
Many Thanks - Jason
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