Why no fish threads?

[otolith]

If I had an Oscar, I would call it "Foxtrot".

[z4RRSchris99]

he is pretty clever,

knows what time he gets fed.
if you ignore him he spits rocks against the glass
he has worked out how to distatch the air stone from the glass and plays with that
loves ping pong balls
reckognises people

[Mr GrimNasty]

Real characters. I've always had a soft spot.

[Turn7]

I nearly went for an Oscar when I got my 6 footer, but I didnt like the idea of a single fish.

One for the future for me I think.

[lufbramatt]

Dr Mike Oxgreen said:

lufbramatt said:

Fish can cope with small amounts of ammonia, especially if you have soft water as the total ammonia in the tank will be mainly composed of ammonium (NH4+) which isn't toxic. What kills fish is the nitrite spike you get as the tank cycles, hence why often fish appear ok for a few weeks until the bacteria that convert ammonia to nitrite start multiplying. You then have to wait again for the second sort of bacteria, which convert the nitrite to nitrate to get stuck in. Nitrite is much more toxic to fish than ammonia.

Some of what you've written is correct, but some of it is significantly wrong.

Ammonium (NH4) most definitely is highly toxic to fish, just slightly less toxic than free ammonia. In practice, ammonia and ammonium will co-exist in dynamic equilibrium, and I believe test kits show the total of both.

Nitrite (NO2) is less toxic to fish than ammonium/ammonia, but is still very bad. Hardy fish can put up with low levels of nitrite for a while but they won't really be healthy.

Nitrate (NO3) is vastly less toxic than nitrite. Virtually all freshwater fish can put up with moderate levels of nitrate, although the lower the better. 40 ppm or below is generally good enough; 100 ppm is bad. The effect of nitrates is more long-term, and many fish can become acclimatised to higher levels but will always be healthier in lower levels.

Edited by Dr Mike Oxgreen on Thursday 30th October 15:23

Thanks for the correction. I fishless cycled my filters and over filter the tanks, so once that bit was sorted I stopped worrying about the technicalities :-) always do my water changes and never use any chemicals (ph adjusters etc.) and everything stays nice and healthy.

[Turn7]

Some of my Malawi Mbuna....

[Dr Mike Oxgreen]

lufbramatt said:

Thanks for the correction. I fishless cycled my filters and over filter the tanks, so once that bit was sorted I stopped worrying about the technicalities :-) always do my water changes and never use any chemicals (ph adjusters etc.) and everything stays nice and healthy.

Indeed, whenever I've done fishless cycling the whole nitrite spike thing happens so quickly. After 10 days of nothing happening, everything happens within 24-48 hours and the ammonia/ammonium and nitrite become undetectable.

I've been thinking about what you said about ammonium predominating in soft water, and I believe you're probably right on that. If my memory serves correctly, the dynamic equilibrium that I mentioned between ammonia and ammonium is strongly affected by the pH - which is likely to be acidic in soft water. Free ammonia, being an alkaline gas, is unlikely to exist in significant quantities in an acidic solution, so the dynamic equilibrium must be shifted substantially towards ammonium in soft water.

Perhaps that's why water quality is even more important in a marine tank, where the pH will definitely be alkaline and will therefore shift the equilibrium towards free ammonia, which is even more highly toxic than ammonium.

[otolith]

Yes, that's correct. Along with marine species tending to be less tolerant to begin with.

[Ki3r]

Bit of an update, I've now got a bigger tank. Still the same two fancies as before. Looking at getting a couple of others, unsure what to get, still not got a plec that I keep meaning to get. Has anyone got any suggestions?

Now got a 54 litre tank, much better than before .

[BarryP]

otolith said:

If I had an Oscar, I would call it "Foxtrot".

I used to keep Oscars before moving onto marines, we had a pair called "Holly" and "Wood"! Very intelligent and naughty, if you missed feeding them by about 15mins from their normal time they would bash the lid of the tank and dislodge it.

[extraT]

Ki3r said:

Bit of an update, I've now got a bigger tank. Still the same two fancies as before. Looking at getting a couple of others, unsure what to get, still not got a plec that I keep meaning to get. Has anyone got any suggestions?

Now got a 54 litre tank, much better than before .

slightly different suggestion, but I highly recommend African Dwarf Frogs (becareful that is actually what you buy!) stay small, around 2 Cms, live in water its whole life, and great for community tanks with lots of hideyholes. Can be fed on live worms from the LFS, which is great to watch it, and other fish eating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_dwarf_frog

[Ki3r]

extraT said:

slightly different suggestion, but I highly recommend African Dwarf Frogs (becareful that is actually what you buy!) stay small, around 2 Cms, live in water its whole life, and great for community tanks with lots of hideyholes. Can be fed on live worms from the LFS, which is great to watch it, and other fish eating.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/African_dwarf_frog

I was going to get a frog when I first got my tank, but the closest place I know is in Yeovil, which is a hour away and I think that's unfair.

How would they get on with my two fancys? I don't want to upset them or anything else I put in there.

[extraT]

Ki3r said:

I was going to get a frog when I first got my tank, but the closest place I know is in Yeovil, which is a hour away and I think that's unfair.

How would they get on with my two fancys? I don't want to upset them or anything else I put in there.

Its hard to say with Goldfish. The problem is Goldfish, while docile, poop a hell of a lot, and that poop in turn leads to high levels of ammonia. While I cannot recall the exact figure (I dont keep goldfish), I think you need something like a 75 liter tank (20 gallon tank) for ONE fish and then another 30 liters (8 or 9 gallons on top) for a second, plus a really really good filtration system. I would take a guess and say that a ADF wouldnt go well with TWO fancies, just because of the sheer volume of poop they produce would pollute the water to much, and well an ADF is small.

[Ki3r]

I'll give the frog a miss for now then. Maybe one in the future .

[Ki3r]

One of my fancys has got swimming bladder. Noticed it Sunday when I got home from work, stuck floating by the filter. Got ready to remove him from the tank and he started swimming.

Monday I did a bit of googling and did a water change (50% this time). Also got him a isolation tank (inside the tank still) so he doesn't end up floating near the filter. Popped to Pets at Home and they suggested something to pop into the tank (checked that it wouldn't hurt the other fish as well). He is still floating around (but still alive).

I've read that feeding him a single pea or two will help, does anyone know if this is true? Does anyone else have any ideas on what to do or is it just a case of waiting?

[m3jappa]

Here's mine around 1250l inc sump etc. pretty much all sps. I hate it, and love it

(It's not as blue as that in real life, I'm just the worst photographer of fish tanks in the world I think).