Dogs on leads

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Discussion

HTP99

22,443 posts

139 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
Beni997 said:
This does my head in!

We have 3 big dogs, one is always on a lead because he is so naughty off it. One is on and off the lead as he is that old that he's deaf and just wonders off so it's easier to have him on the lead. The other is never on his lead as he's the youngest and is very well behaved off his lead so he needs a good run round.

He is a big powerful dog but loves attention and people and other dogs. So when he see's another dog/person he goes running over to just say hello and has never shown any aggression, but jesus christ some reactions we get is ridiculous. It's normally people with little dogs who start screaming when he comes over and pick their dog up and run away!!

He then thinks it's a game and chases them until i get to him or shout him and i get the he should be on a lead comment in an aggressive manner! Why i ask and the normal reply i get is that he's big and could do some damage!!!

If he was nasty do you think i would have him off the lead???

Some people are just brain dead
I have no issue with big dogs or any dogs for that matter bounding up to Barry; he is off lead and is fine with other dogs, no matter their size.

However I have issues with any dog, big or small, bounding up to Daisy, she is deaf, nervous of dogs that she doesn't know and sometime reacts, if a dog is on a lead then your dog shouldn't be allowed to just bound up to them, especially in my case when they are bounding up and I am frantically reeling her in, my actions should give the owner a bit of heads up that I don't want their dog near my dog.

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
^ Your wrong imo. The issue is that your dogs deaf, it's your problem. You can't expect everybody else to leash their dogs because of that. My dogs deaf, old and arthritic and when dogs bound up to him I welcome them and ensure nobody gets to boistrous. My dog enjoys the visit as long as it's not to energetic.

Why are you frantically reeling her in? That just conveys a sense of panic to everybody in the vicinity.

HTP99

22,443 posts

139 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
Boosted LS1 said:
^ Your wrong imo. The issue is that your dogs deaf, it's your problem. You can't expect everybody else to leash their dogs because of that. My dogs deaf, old and arthritic and when dogs bound up to him I welcome them and ensure nobody gets to boistrous. My dog enjoys the visit as long as it's not to energetic.
I'm not asking anyone to keep their dog on a lead, I am asking that they keep their dog away from my dog, if their dog starts bounding up to my dog, or any other dog on a lead then it should be trained well enough to be re-called.

You don't know why that dog is on a lead; it may have been attacked by another dog in its past and be nervous, it may be deaf and easily startled, it is not for you to decide that it is fine for your dog to approach it.



LordHaveMurci

12,034 posts

168 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
We have a Westie that for some reason hates Staffies & will get bolshy with them. As a result we put him back on the lead if we see a staffie approaching, you can imagine I was pretty annoyed the other day when some dappy teenage couple let their bloody staffie run over to us & I then had a snarling westie to deal with.

You could say it's our fault for having a less than perfect dog, if so then I guess we'll agree to differ.

FiF

43,960 posts

250 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
And the last few posts on this thread, ladles and jellyspoons, epitomises why this subject will always be a divided one.

It's also why, when ours is on his lead and someone lets theirs off lead come bouncing up, I just sort out whatever results and don't start haranguing the others, because they have no clue and just make out it's all your fault, never theirs, even partly theirs.

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
^ This is always going to be something that has to be addressed as and when it happens. Nobody's really 'wrong' it's just that people have different perceptions.

I've had some frightening brutes run across to my dog. Last year it was an american bulldog and I had to take hold of it's collar. I was shaking for a while after that one.


Prof Prolapse

16,160 posts

189 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
I think there's a lot of perspective here.

Not speaking of the OPs example, but big dogs can like rough play. I try keep my dog on the lead but occasionally he gets away and he frightens some folk. He remains utterly harmless, wagging his tail playfully, asking for the other dog to chase him, but some people don't see that. They just see 40kg of meat with teeth, harassing their beloved pet, with what they mistakenly believe is aggression.

I do apologise for an easy life, but in all honesty it does get tiring. I have a harmless dog on a lead just to satisfy the fears of less experienced dog owners.







FiF

43,960 posts

250 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
On the other hand, owners of what I shall call bomb proof dogs, for want of a better expression, often don't understand the stress and position of being the owner or handler of what I shall call a reactive dog, again for want of a better term.

Rather superciliously they regard the owner of the reactive dog as being a poor owner, when it can be that actually the other owner knows more about dog behaviour and training, and is working very hard to train said dog, than they do with their supposed bomb proof dog, and they blindly go on their way having, through their own ignorance, set back days and weeks of training and confidence building.

Kinderpup

10 posts

88 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
If i may venture an opinion, this is simply a case of good manners, for what ever reason if someone has their dog on the lead, the dog is on the lead. It's not for anyone else to comment, pass judgement or criticise, you do not know the circumstances, therefore out of courtesy no-one should allow their dog no matter what size to go bounding over. If you dog is well trained enough to leave on command and stay well away then fine, if however you have a dog that is just too excitable and wants to play, 30 seconds on the lead will get you past the problem and then they can come back off. Good Manners cost nothing, it won't harm a dog to be on the lead for 30 seconds and avoids problems like this.

Carrot

7,294 posts

201 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
I had an incident recently where walking my 6 month old cockapoo on a lead, a Doberman came bounding over. Owners were walking about 40 meters away.

The dog wasn't aggressive but was jumping up at me a lot, and mine was whining and hiding behind to get away. The owners (middle aged pair) just glanced over and kept walking.

I had to scoop mine up in the end and the owners did nothing until I basically shouted at them to call their f**king dog away. At that point middle aged man almost wearily called over as if it was some great imposition. Dog didn't respond so I had to walk the opposite direction carrying mine...

I guess I may be the miserable one... I am happy to speak to dog owners and let our dogs meet if its mutual, but I don't really want people's dogs or kids thrust in my face all the time... Hence I now walk the dog really early!

oddman

2,277 posts

251 months

Friday 6th January 2017
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I've never seen big dog/guard dog that can be controlled off lead. They're lovely dogs and I know most of them don't mean harm but the are fking scary to other walkers and dogs

The 'He only wants to play' BS doesn't cut it.

Mine stops on whistle and will recall 100% - because he has been bred and trained to cooperate and work with me.

We have had centuries of breeding dogs that are biddable. Very few people need a guard/carriage/fighting/ratting dog

Why in c21 people continue to choose dogs with stone age function/temperament is beyond me.

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
At the end of the day owners of smaller dogs or dogs with issues will always be worried about larger dogs 'in case they' have attack issues. If your leashed dog has a problem then you need to address it. You can't expect those with normal dogs that wish to say doggy hello's to address it for you if they're in a public place.

Sure, if things aren't going smoothly then I'd expect the owner of the larger dog to call it back or retrieve it but these owners only expect to meet relaxed dogs on their relaxing sociable walks. That's why they enjoy having a dog. I accept that plenty of dogs won't recall due to fkwit owners but these dogs are usually friendly and as such aren't a real threat.

If your dog can't mix, you or it are the problem. If your dogs old, handicapped etc then obviously be close to it, keep it on a flexi lead but you can't expect the world and it's dogs to revolve around you.

My dogs on his last legs but I don't get all stressed about other dogs approaching off leash. I meet 2 GSD's off a lead every day. They used to approach whilst barking loudly but it's just an occasional bark. Now, my dog likes them, they like him. Slack leads all round whilst we all socialise with eachother :-)

I've found that adjusting and relaxing to these things has been better for everybody whereas fixed confrontational views, strained leads etc stresses the dogs and owners alike and gets nowhere. You can't win, ever.

KrazyIvan

4,341 posts

174 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
oddman said:
I've never seen big dog/guard dog that can be controlled off lead. They're lovely dogs and I know most of them don't mean harm but the are fking scary to other walkers and dogs

The 'He only wants to play' BS doesn't cut it.

Mine stops on whistle and will recall 100% - because he has been bred and trained to cooperate and work with me.

We have had centuries of breeding dogs that are biddable. Very few people need a guard/carriage/fighting/ratting dog

Why in c21 people continue to choose dogs with stone age function/temperament is beyond me.
Maybe I am not following your logic but are saying that large old breed dogs are simply the wrong choice, in any situation as family pets?

I have only ever had large dogs (GSD's and Alaskan Malamute) Our GSD's have always been near perfect with regards to being off lead and recall (sorry no dog can be "100%"), our current Mal is not allowed of lead as she is easily distracted and can react very badly to poorly trained dogs. As is the only issue I have ever had when out walking, has ALWAYS been from people with "toy" dogs, as they don't seem to take training them seriously, usually believe the bks that only large dogs do damage.

As ever, its more often then not the owners of dogs that don't take ownership as seriously as they should that cause the problems, and in my experience they normally, but not souly, own small dogs.

zapbranny

28 posts

104 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
alfie2244 said:
Beni997 said:
This does my head in!

We have 3 big dogs, one is always on a lead because he is so naughty off it. One is on and off the lead as he is that old that he's deaf and just wonders off so it's easier to have him on the lead. The other is never on his lead as he's the youngest and is very well behaved off his lead so he needs a good run round.

He is a big powerful dog but loves attention and people and other dogs. So when he see's another dog/person he goes running over to just say hello and has never shown any aggression, but jesus christ some reactions we get is ridiculous. It's normally people with little dogs who start screaming when he comes over and pick their dog up and run away!!

He then thinks it's a game and chases them until i get to him or shout him and i get the he should be on a lead comment in an aggressive manner! Why i ask and the normal reply i get is that he's big and could do some damage!!!

If he was nasty do you think i would have him off the lead???

Some people are just brain dead
Very much mirrors my experiences with our big fella.............he is the kindest friendliest dog you could ever wish to meet but the extreme reactions of some, usually with little dogs, are beyond belief.

Ironically he has been attacked a couple of times yet stands there without a clue as to what to do..........by Rottweilers, Alsatians or other large dogs I hear you ask? Oh no Jack Russells and other assorted nasty terriers....go figure!

Swinging a small dog around your head does seem to get him excited though. biggrin

Slightly off topic but another thing that annoys me.......parents not allowing their children, under controlled conditions, to fuss or stroke my dogs despite my confirmation that they are 100% friendly and adore kids..................oh no he / she is frightened of dogs - what a shame.

The pair of you are appear to be clueless and your post epitomises everything that is wrong irresponsible dog owners.

If I've never met you or your dog before, how the hell am I supposed to know that either you are not a brain dead chav owner or the dog is not a liability. Case in point, walking with my 4 year old and 1 yr old in a pushchair public footpath, Large Mastiff charges up 30 m ahead of owner off the lead growling. I stepped in front of my daughter and the dog stopped short. I wasn't going to take a chance that it wanted to sniff my daughter, it could have maimed her for life. I told the owner in no uncertain terms that she should leash it, and it was lucky it pulled up or I would have killed it. I've seen so many idiots in public there is no way I'm going to trust anyone else's judgement when it comes to my family.

For reference you are wrong letting your dog off a lead to approach anyone and it is classed as being out of control see https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/controlling-y... for reference.

When is your dog 'under control'?

A dog is considered ‘under control’ if it is on a lead held by someone able to control the dog. For example, a large dog would not be under control if its lead was held by a child who would be unable to restrain the dog if it strained against the lead.

It isn't necessary for dogs to be leashed at all times. However, dogs must be kept on a lead in designated pedestrian zones and on land where livestock is present. Councils have bye-laws to indicate areas where leashing is required, such as in public parks.

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
Public park, public rules imo. It's down to common sense. There will always be big scary dogs and small bitey dogs. The owners are like that to. There will always be an element of uncertainty, mistrust and emotion. But on the park 'the majority' usually know which dogs are safe and which may be dodgy. I've met many a chav with his unleashed staffie. Never had a problem. I take a leap of faith, trust the owner and his dog if they're willing to walk out on a public park. Well adjusted dogs are always friendly. It's the unadjusted owners who cause problems especially if their dogs aren't able to socialise for some reason. I feel that the owner needs to adapt a bit more to help their dog if it's struggling, maybe nurture it at a slower pace.

I've had dogs at both ends of the spectrum so know how it feels as an owner of either type.


alfie2244

11,292 posts

187 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
zapbranny said:
alfie2244 said:
Beni997 said:
This does my head in!

We have 3 big dogs, one is always on a lead because he is so naughty off it. One is on and off the lead as he is that old that he's deaf and just wonders off so it's easier to have him on the lead. The other is never on his lead as he's the youngest and is very well behaved off his lead so he needs a good run round.

He is a big powerful dog but loves attention and people and other dogs. So when he see's another dog/person he goes running over to just say hello and has never shown any aggression, but jesus christ some reactions we get is ridiculous. It's normally people with little dogs who start screaming when he comes over and pick their dog up and run away!!

He then thinks it's a game and chases them until i get to him or shout him and i get the he should be on a lead comment in an aggressive manner! Why i ask and the normal reply i get is that he's big and could do some damage!!!

If he was nasty do you think i would have him off the lead???

Some people are just brain dead
Very much mirrors my experiences with our big fella.............he is the kindest friendliest dog you could ever wish to meet but the extreme reactions of some, usually with little dogs, are beyond belief.

Ironically he has been attacked a couple of times yet stands there without a clue as to what to do..........by Rottweilers, Alsatians or other large dogs I hear you ask? Oh no Jack Russells and other assorted nasty terriers....go figure!

Swinging a small dog around your head does seem to get him excited though. biggrin

Slightly off topic but another thing that annoys me.......parents not allowing their children, under controlled conditions, to fuss or stroke my dogs despite my confirmation that they are 100% friendly and adore kids..................oh no he / she is frightened of dogs - what a shame.

The pair of you are appear to be clueless and your post epitomises everything that is wrong irresponsible dog owners.

If I've never met you or your dog before, how the hell am I supposed to know that either you are not a brain dead chav owner or the dog is not a liability. Case in point, walking with my 4 year old and 1 yr old in a pushchair public footpath, Large Mastiff charges up 30 m ahead of owner off the lead growling. I stepped in front of my daughter and the dog stopped short. I wasn't going to take a chance that it wanted to sniff my daughter, it could have maimed her for life. I told the owner in no uncertain terms that she should leash it, and it was lucky it pulled up or I would have killed it. I've seen so many idiots in public there is no way I'm going to trust anyone else's judgement when it comes to my family.

For reference you are wrong letting your dog off a lead to approach anyone and it is classed as being out of control see https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/controlling-y... for reference.

When is your dog 'under control'?

A dog is considered ‘under control’ if it is on a lead held by someone able to control the dog. For example, a large dog would not be under control if its lead was held by a child who would be unable to restrain the dog if it strained against the lead.

It isn't necessary for dogs to be leashed at all times. However, dogs must be kept on a lead in designated pedestrian zones and on land where livestock is present. Councils have bye-laws to indicate areas where leashing is required, such as in public parks.
My dogs are never off lead in designated pedestrian zones or on land where livestock (or people)are present or where Councils have bye-laws to indicate areas where leashing is required, such as in public parks......public footpaths across fields, woodlands are a different thing entirely but they always go back on if / when we meet anybody with or without dogs until contact it is established agreed by all and sensible to do so.

The pic I posted showed my 4yr old grandaughter holding his lead....you / others may not be very bright but I can assure you I would not let her hold him if there was even a 1% chance he would go out of her control.

I have owned dogs for over 50 yrs and never had one start a fight, be aggressive towards people or other dogs and I take great exception to your statement "The pair of you are appear to be clueless and your post epitomises everything that is wrong irresponsible dog owners."

oddman

2,277 posts

251 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
KrazyIvan said:
Maybe I am not following your logic but are saying that large old breed dogs are simply the wrong choice, in any situation as family pets?
Yes for most c21 families. Why does anyone need a guard/sled/carriage dog?

KrazyIvan said:
I have only ever had large dogs (GSD's and Alaskan Malamute) Our GSD's have always been near perfect with regards to being off lead and recall (sorry no dog can be "100%")
Sorry - mine won't recall if I whistle when he is having a st

KrazyIvan said:
our current Mal is not allowed of lead as she is easily distracted and can react very badly to poorly trained dogs. As is the only issue I have ever had when out walking, has ALWAYS been from people with "toy" dogs, as they don't seem to take training them seriously, usually believe the bks that only large dogs do damage.
Agree toy dog owners seem to think they have free pass from training

KrazyIvan said:
Our current Mal is not allowed of lead as she is easily distracted and can react very badly to poorly trained dogs.
Sensible with a dog that has been bred for 1000 generations to pull sleds

KrazyIvan said:
As is the only issue I As ever, its more often then not the owners of dogs that don't take ownership as seriously as they should that cause the problems, and in my experience they normally, but not souly, own small dogs.
We live on a small island with limited social space not arctic tundra. I'm no fan of toy dogs but they are more suitable for most domestic situations than breeds that are not too far removed from their wolf forbears

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
Lets all get a pug then :-) and waddle it to the shops, lol.

The wolf forbears offer some very helpful traits, guarding, protection being one of them.

moorx

3,481 posts

113 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
oddman said:
Yes for most c21 families. Why does anyone need a guard/sled/carriage dog?
Why does anyone 'need' any dog?

We are all different and have different preferences in terms of breeds, perhaps we should leave it at that.

zapbranny

28 posts

104 months

Friday 6th January 2017
quotequote all
alfie2244 said:
zapbranny said:
alfie2244 said:
Beni997 said:
This does my head in!

We have 3 big dogs, one is always on a lead because he is so naughty off it. One is on and off the lead as he is that old that he's deaf and just wonders off so it's easier to have him on the lead. The other is never on his lead as he's the youngest and is very well behaved off his lead so he needs a good run round.

He is a big powerful dog but loves attention and people and other dogs. So when he see's another dog/person he goes running over to just say hello and has never shown any aggression, but jesus christ some reactions we get is ridiculous. It's normally people with little dogs who start screaming when he comes over and pick their dog up and run away!!

He then thinks it's a game and chases them until i get to him or shout him and i get the he should be on a lead comment in an aggressive manner! Why i ask and the normal reply i get is that he's big and could do some damage!!!

If he was nasty do you think i would have him off the lead???

Some people are just brain dead
Very much mirrors my experiences with our big fella.............he is the kindest friendliest dog you could ever wish to meet but the extreme reactions of some, usually with little dogs, are beyond belief.

Ironically he has been attacked a couple of times yet stands there without a clue as to what to do..........by Rottweilers, Alsatians or other large dogs I hear you ask? Oh no Jack Russells and other assorted nasty terriers....go figure!

Swinging a small dog around your head does seem to get him excited though. biggrin

Slightly off topic but another thing that annoys me.......parents not allowing their children, under controlled conditions, to fuss or stroke my dogs despite my confirmation that they are 100% friendly and adore kids..................oh no he / she is frightened of dogs - what a shame.

The pair of you are appear to be clueless and your post epitomises everything that is wrong irresponsible dog owners.

If I've never met you or your dog before, how the hell am I supposed to know that either you are not a brain dead chav owner or the dog is not a liability. Case in point, walking with my 4 year old and 1 yr old in a pushchair public footpath, Large Mastiff charges up 30 m ahead of owner off the lead growling. I stepped in front of my daughter and the dog stopped short. I wasn't going to take a chance that it wanted to sniff my daughter, it could have maimed her for life. I told the owner in no uncertain terms that she should leash it, and it was lucky it pulled up or I would have killed it. I've seen so many idiots in public there is no way I'm going to trust anyone else's judgement when it comes to my family.

For reference you are wrong letting your dog off a lead to approach anyone and it is classed as being out of control see https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/articles/controlling-y... for reference.

When is your dog 'under control'?

A dog is considered ‘under control’ if it is on a lead held by someone able to control the dog. For example, a large dog would not be under control if its lead was held by a child who would be unable to restrain the dog if it strained against the lead.

It isn't necessary for dogs to be leashed at all times. However, dogs must be kept on a lead in designated pedestrian zones and on land where livestock is present. Councils have bye-laws to indicate areas where leashing is required, such as in public parks.
My dogs are never off lead in designated pedestrian zones or on land where livestock (or people)are present or where Councils have bye-laws to indicate areas where leashing is required, such as in public parks......public footpaths across fields, woodlands are a different thing entirely but they always go back on if / when we meet anybody with or without dogs until contact it is established agreed by all and sensible to do so.

The pic I posted showed my 4yr old grandaughter holding his lead....you / others may not be very bright but I can assure you I would not let her hold him if there was even a 1% chance he would go out of her control.

I have owned dogs for over 50 yrs and never had one start a fight, be aggressive towards people or other dogs and I take great exception to your statement "The pair of you are appear to be clueless and your post epitomises everything that is wrong irresponsible dog owners.
If you are saying that you don't let your unleashed dog run up to people then you are excluded from my statement as an irresponsible dog owner.

The owners that do really grate on me.additionally If you have a bigger more powerful dog its just a statement of fact but if the dog Could do a lot more damage to my child before I could kill it hence it is a greater threat and why you need to leash it. iI've owned dogs in the past and witnessed and assisted after horrific dog attack which nearly killed the owner. It's just being sensible and not being an irresponsible dick. How many times have you heard stories in the paper after kids have been attacked by dogs, "he was always such a good boy", "he's never done that before". Dogs can be dangerous and need to be treated with respect.

As an analogy Have you ever been a pub and spotted the guy getting drunker and louder, and been aware that he is going to be spoiling to start trouble, you either leave or get the hits in first before you are on the receiving end. A loose large dog is this situation except much more difficult to read.