Children in Upper / First Class
Discussion
To be honest the Journey for you will be hell. You will not get to enjoy any of the benefits of upper class as you will be too focused on your kid.
All plane journeys are crap in the best of circumstances, just pay the lowest possible value and write the whole experience off.
But if it is free.....
All plane journeys are crap in the best of circumstances, just pay the lowest possible value and write the whole experience off.
But if it is free.....
The class of travel doesn't really matter.
However, please be one of the parents that actually acknowledges their kids and does try to entertain them / clam them down. - That's the very least.
What is not enjoyable are parents that get on a plane and let their kids scream all the way through the flight and come ill prepared to entertain / parent their kids whilst in the air.
However, please be one of the parents that actually acknowledges their kids and does try to entertain them / clam them down. - That's the very least.
What is not enjoyable are parents that get on a plane and let their kids scream all the way through the flight and come ill prepared to entertain / parent their kids whilst in the air.
Obviously a topic that divides opinions.
We have paid full fair for Premium Economy both ways thus far. The flight back is through the night so I think that is probably the one we would look to upgrade on. This isn't a vanity thing - I'm 6ft 6 and hate flying in the cheap seats as a result. With a baby to look after this will be worse hence why we've gone Premium and are looking to upgrade.
By then the baby will have flown probably 6+ times as the grandparents live in the South of France.
We are very considerate people generally and have had many flights ruined by children not being controlled by their parents, so we should be very conscious of not doing the same to other people.
As an aside, is the upgrade from PE to Upper Class even worth it on Virgin? Have flown Virgin Transatlantic in PE a few times but never Upper Class.
We have paid full fair for Premium Economy both ways thus far. The flight back is through the night so I think that is probably the one we would look to upgrade on. This isn't a vanity thing - I'm 6ft 6 and hate flying in the cheap seats as a result. With a baby to look after this will be worse hence why we've gone Premium and are looking to upgrade.
By then the baby will have flown probably 6+ times as the grandparents live in the South of France.
We are very considerate people generally and have had many flights ruined by children not being controlled by their parents, so we should be very conscious of not doing the same to other people.
As an aside, is the upgrade from PE to Upper Class even worth it on Virgin? Have flown Virgin Transatlantic in PE a few times but never Upper Class.
had ham said:
Crossflow Kid said:
Perhaps those taking 1 year olds on planes are the selfish ones? (We can sail round this one all day long
)
Just because it's pretty common doesn't make it any less selfish, nor acceptable.
Do not that assume that because lots of people do it every else must condone it.
)Just because it's pretty common doesn't make it any less selfish, nor acceptable.
Do not that assume that because lots of people do it every else must condone it.
What an utterly stupid post.What are they supposed to do? Not travel? Because some random on the net finds it 'selfish and unacceptable'?
It's public transport, available to anyone who pays the money.
People who don't especially like young children or find their presence intrusive for whatever reason (and please don't even begin to try and suggest the presence of a screaming baby isn't intrusive) is labelled as selfish and nasty when the basic truth of the matter is they're just expressing a preference.
"But they're just kids"....
Correct, but they are not my kids, I did not sign up to put up with other people's kids, I do not want to put up with other people's kids, I don't see why I should be expected to.
Last time I looked, that isn't illegal.
Saying "it's public transport available to anyone who pays" cuts both ways don't forget.
If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
And as for "What are they supposed to do?"...oh I dunno, wild stab in the dark here but just maybe they should recognise and accept that as new parents they're gonna have to make some tough calls, lower their expectations, make lots of sacrifices and admit that life as they knew it is over.
The parents who fail to do that are the selfish ones.
Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 10th September 20:05
Crossflow Kid said:
I did not sign up to put up with other people's kids, I do not want to put up with other people's kids, I don't see why I should be expected to.
That's life though isn't it? Edited by anonymous-user on Wednesday 10th September 20:05
If you choose life, you choose people and that includes all ages.
It's a totally ridiculous notion that kids should be excluded from aircraft.
desolate said:
It's a totally ridiculous notion that kids should be excluded from aircraft.
f
k me, we've gone from "No, I don't think it's a great idea to take a one year old on an airliner" to "Ban children from flying"p
s off to Mumsnet will you?swerni said:
If you don't like <it> tough, why are your rights any more important than anyone else's ?
They're not. No more so than anyone else's are over mine, hence my comment that if people are free to take kids on an aircraft, other people are equally free to disapprove if they are so inclined. If the parents don't like that, as you say so yourself.....tough.Not wanting or especially liking children, particularly those of total strangers, isn't a crime. Please understand that.
Crossflow Kid said:
desolate said:
It's a totally ridiculous notion that kids should be excluded from aircraft.
fk me, we've gone from "No, I don't think it's a great idea to take a one year old on an airliner" to "Ban children from flying"p
s off to Mumsnet will you?swerni said:
If you don't like <it> tough, why are your rights any more important than anyone else's ?
They're not. No more so than anyone else's are over mine, hence my comment that if people are free to take kids on an aircraft, other people are equally free to disapprove if they are so inclined. If the parents don't like that, as you say so yourself.....tough.Not wanting or especially liking children, particularly those of total strangers, isn't a crime. Please understand that.
Posters have suggested that kids shouldn't be allowed on planes, so that leap was made by someone else.
CBA with anything else
Crossflow Kid said:
This is typical of so many "kid" threads on any forum though, isn't it?
People who don't especially like young children or find their presence intrusive for whatever reason (and please don't even begin to try and suggest the presence of a screaming baby isn't intrusive) is labelled as selfish and nasty when the basic truth of the matter is they're just expressing a preference.
"But they're just kids"....
Correct, but they are not my kids, I did not sign up to put up with other people's kids, I do not want to put up with other people's kids, I don't see why I should be expected to.
Last time I looked, that isn't illegal.
Saying "it's public transport available to anyone who pays" cuts both ways don't forget.
If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
And as for "What are they supposed to do?"...oh I dunno, wild stab in the dark here but just maybe they should recognise and accept that as new parents they're gonna have to make some tough calls, lower their expectations, make lots of sacrifices and admit that life as they knew it is over.
The parents who fail to do that are the selfish ones.
I didn't think I would see a more ignorant post than your previous, but you've surpassed yourself. Having kids means your life is over??? Utterly ridiculous. I actually feel sorry for you - your outlook on life is rather sad.People who don't especially like young children or find their presence intrusive for whatever reason (and please don't even begin to try and suggest the presence of a screaming baby isn't intrusive) is labelled as selfish and nasty when the basic truth of the matter is they're just expressing a preference.
"But they're just kids"....
Correct, but they are not my kids, I did not sign up to put up with other people's kids, I do not want to put up with other people's kids, I don't see why I should be expected to.
Last time I looked, that isn't illegal.
Saying "it's public transport available to anyone who pays" cuts both ways don't forget.
If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
And as for "What are they supposed to do?"...oh I dunno, wild stab in the dark here but just maybe they should recognise and accept that as new parents they're gonna have to make some tough calls, lower their expectations, make lots of sacrifices and admit that life as they knew it is over.
The parents who fail to do that are the selfish ones.
Edited by Crossflow Kid on Wednesday 10th September 20:05
Zod said:
We've done it plenty of times, even with a baby, two year old and five year old. Don't worry about the moaners. Just do your best to keep the children interested or asleep. I just laugh when I get daggers looks from other passengers (very few do this).
What a lovely example to set to your children. Well done.NormalWisdom said:
I love aircraft, I love flying. My first ever flight was a Pan Am Boeing 707 from London to Copenhagen - I suffered excrutiating pain during descent - I was 13, heaven knows how it feels for a 1 year-old - I would not knowingly risk my offspring experiencing the same without being able to communicate how to combat it.
It hurts on descent as the pressure increases on the outside of the ear drum, whilst the pressure on the inside doesn't equalise usually due to a blocked eustacian tube with muscus. When babies cry, it opens the eustacian tubes up to equalise the pressure on the ear drum.When you flew, was it explained to you how to equalise your ear drums, from your post it seems not. In all walks of life, it's give and take.
Yes it bloody hurts, I know from personnel experience from my diving days.
interesting that no-one considers it selfish in relation to the child?
how is a 1 year old supposed to understand that's its trapped in confined space for 8 hours? can't freely move around, create whatever mess it feels like?
e.t.c let alone understand the issues with pressure changes of turbulence?
neither will it benefit from the experience at the other end of the journey as they are way too young to appreciate their surroundings or know what its all about
If I had kids I wouldn't be holidaying abroad period until such time as they were old enough to benefit from it, what on earth is the point?
how is a 1 year old supposed to understand that's its trapped in confined space for 8 hours? can't freely move around, create whatever mess it feels like?
e.t.c let alone understand the issues with pressure changes of turbulence?
neither will it benefit from the experience at the other end of the journey as they are way too young to appreciate their surroundings or know what its all about
If I had kids I wouldn't be holidaying abroad period until such time as they were old enough to benefit from it, what on earth is the point?
Crossflow Kid said:
Saying "it's public transport available to anyone who pays" cuts both ways don't forget.
If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
Uh-huh. So I suppose you think it's ok to disapprove of blacks, Jews or Irish on airliners too. If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
Crossflow Kid said:
And as for "What are they supposed to do?"...oh I dunno, wild stab in the dark here but just maybe they should recognise and accept that as new parents they're gonna have to make some tough calls, lower their expectations, make lots of sacrifices and admit that life as they knew it is over.
The parents who fail to do that are the selfish ones.
You come across as a very dull instrument. The parents who fail to do that are the selfish ones.
had ham said:
I've been flying long haul with all 3 of my kids since they were 9 months old or so - bottles at the right time (or boiled sweets when older) helped tremendously with the pressure issue, and we never really had problems. When resident in Asia and going between Singapore/London/San Fran we were fortunate to travel Business and that was always fine, but we were very conscientious about other passengers and their comfort.
We never had any issues with other travelers bar one journey Singapore~London that my wife had to make without me - but with the kids at 1.5yrs and 3yrs old. A lady fellow Business Class passenger kicked up a stink before take off when she realised that she was sat close to my wife and kids - apparently she was adamant it was unacceptable for kids to be in Business Class. She demanded a move to First due to the 'inconvenience'. SIA are brilliant with kids, especially in Business (lots of free Lego for daddy to play with) and they refused to move her up upwards - but did offer her a seat in economy which of course she refused.
The flight took off, the boys had something to eat, watched a cartoon or two, had their milk, and then slept pretty much all the way back to the UK (we used to tune their sleep patterns ahead of the flights to ensure they were ready to sleep). After landing, the lovely stewardess asked, somewhat more loudly than was strictly necessary, for the lady to apologise to my wife, which she did, albeit grudgingly.
In a nutshell, you pay for it, you have as much right to be in Business class as anyone else - and a little bit of planning ahead of the trip can make it a far more enjoyable journey for yourselves and your fellow passengers than it otherwise could be.
One upside is that my kids are now very comfortable flying - and at 16 and 18, the two oldest are now fine travelling alone, even on long haul.
Thankfully ,you seem like responsible caring ,well adjusted parents,unfortunately this is ruined by the baby dispensing people who fWe never had any issues with other travelers bar one journey Singapore~London that my wife had to make without me - but with the kids at 1.5yrs and 3yrs old. A lady fellow Business Class passenger kicked up a stink before take off when she realised that she was sat close to my wife and kids - apparently she was adamant it was unacceptable for kids to be in Business Class. She demanded a move to First due to the 'inconvenience'. SIA are brilliant with kids, especially in Business (lots of free Lego for daddy to play with) and they refused to move her up upwards - but did offer her a seat in economy which of course she refused.
The flight took off, the boys had something to eat, watched a cartoon or two, had their milk, and then slept pretty much all the way back to the UK (we used to tune their sleep patterns ahead of the flights to ensure they were ready to sleep). After landing, the lovely stewardess asked, somewhat more loudly than was strictly necessary, for the lady to apologise to my wife, which she did, albeit grudgingly.
In a nutshell, you pay for it, you have as much right to be in Business class as anyone else - and a little bit of planning ahead of the trip can make it a far more enjoyable journey for yourselves and your fellow passengers than it otherwise could be.
One upside is that my kids are now very comfortable flying - and at 16 and 18, the two oldest are now fine travelling alone, even on long haul.
k everything for everyone else.Selfish: lacking consideration for other people; concerned chiefly with one's own personal profit or pleasure.
Travelling with a child who will or is likely to cause significant annoyance to your passengers is selfish.
That said it is perfectly possible to travel with a child in a unselfish manner. It just requires a bit of diligence from the parents. E.g I'd suggest a long haul flight is not the best way to find out if your one year old tiny tot is a good flyer.
Regarding class of travel, shouldn't matter IMO.
Travelling with a child who will or is likely to cause significant annoyance to your passengers is selfish.
That said it is perfectly possible to travel with a child in a unselfish manner. It just requires a bit of diligence from the parents. E.g I'd suggest a long haul flight is not the best way to find out if your one year old tiny tot is a good flyer.
Regarding class of travel, shouldn't matter IMO.
Greg66 said:
Crossflow Kid said:
Saying "it's public transport available to anyone who pays" cuts both ways don't forget.
If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
Uh-huh. So I suppose you think it's ok to disapprove of blacks, Jews or Irish on airliners too. If parents are allowed to take a kid on an airliner other passengers are allowed to disapprove.
It's whether or not they choose to voice that disapproval, isn't it?
I don't like cats. Is that not allowed either?
had ham said:
I didn't think I would see a more ignorant post than your previous, but you've surpassed yourself. Having kids means your life is over??? Utterly ridiculous. I actually feel sorry for you - your outlook on life is rather sad.
Where did I say it meant life is over? I didn't. I just implied it meant life will be different. Please stop taking two plus two and making it five.
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