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Shuvi McTupya

17,868 posts

133 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
erdnase said:
Pretty soon I reckon everything will have those small RFID tags on them. We'll just fill our trollies and walk through an archway which will scan and total everything. Even the things some people have in their pockets.
The problem here would be in supermarkets that sell clothing. If you buy a pair of trousers on one day, and wear them to go shopping the next day, would you get charged again?


Road2Ruin

2,873 posts

102 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
carreauchompeur said:
I'm not surprised. A couple of weeks ago the rather posh lady next to my checkout was having problems with the self-checkout. Indignant until an employee came over and said "Yes madam, the problem you're having there is that you have pressed 2 bananas, when actually there are four in your bag.

I made sure that my sniggering was sufficiently unsubtle to ensure she won't be tempted into further fruity heists on my manor.
How did that happen? I thought bananas were weighed due to the unique size of each one! The machine can't of known how many bananas she had.

erdnase

1,963 posts

87 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Shuvi McTupya said:
erdnase said:
Pretty soon I reckon everything will have those small RFID tags on them. We'll just fill our trollies and walk through an archway which will scan and total everything. Even the things some people have in their pockets.
The problem here would be in supermarkets that sell clothing. If you buy a pair of trousers on one day, and wear them to go shopping the next day, would you get charged again?
Hah, I'd hope not. AFAIK, RFID tags have a unique identifier, so those trousers you buy on the Monday might have a tag ID of xxx37364bf7. I'd hope that after the supermarket charges you on the Monday, if it detects those trousers walking through the scanner on a Tuesday, it'll remember!

RFID isn't like barcodes where every 750g box of Cornflakes has the same barcode. They'll be unique (I hope!).

It makes for an interesting scenario though. People with RFID tags in their clothing can be tracked. Tesco will know how long you kept those trousers you bought from them - when you wear them (summer? winter?), if you like to mix and match your trousers with a competitors items, if you're doing your shopping in your "work" clothes, as well as other insidious data-mining techniques.

I'll be all up for removing RFID tags from anything I buy, and I'm far from a conspiracy nut. There's crackpot websites out there where people are convinced RFID is the biblical "mark of the beast", as the bible says something about not being able to buy or sell or trade without this "mark".


JonnyFive

27,690 posts

75 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Surely you could just scan one thing and put two things on the scale? Thats the way I've always thought people could do it.. The machine would only register one weight added to the total. I really can't believe they've weighed every item and know if what you've put in there isn't right..

Cotty

27,697 posts

170 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Discusting behaviour
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erdnase

1,963 posts

87 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Road2Ruin said:
How did that happen? I thought bananas were weighed due to the unique size of each one! The machine can't of known how many bananas she had.
I've wondered this too, and concluded there must be a margin for error.

IE, a banana is programmed to weigh 100g - 150g. Two bananas should therefore weigh between 200-300g. If someone claims to have put 2 bananas through but the increase in weight is >300g, we get the old "unexpected item in bagging area" thing.

Items that are consistant in weight (say, a jar of Pesto sauce) might be programmed in as 200-210g, a much smaller margin, since they are usually more consistant in weight.

Just my speculation! Never actually seen behind the scenes in these things.

philthy

4,568 posts

126 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Jasandjules said:
I guess that shows just how horrible this country has become then.

I am glad I live in an area where people sell eggs and fruit and such out by the roadside and you just take what you want and leave the cash in the box.
Me too. Recently got some eggs from there, and didn't have the correct change, so left 20p more than they cost (£1.80). Bumped into the guy that runs by chance a week or two later, and made some passing comment about having the right money on me this time. He laughed, and said not to worry, take it off this time. He told me that he has some customers, who don't have the money on them, and drop it in on their way past the following day. He wasn't worried, as it all works itself out in the end.
Thank god for honesty and decent people. I can't understand why anyone would live their lives any other way?

Condi

3,819 posts

57 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
I did a couple of projects and essays on RFID for my degree, and its coming; more so for larger items to begin with in, technology and the like. Supply chains use huge amounts of RFID to track things from case size, down to individual items. The US DOD are one of the biggest users, after they realised quite how much stuff went missing en route to Afghanistan. Technology has got to a level now where they can load a pallet onto a truck, and remotely monitor not only the truck, but also the load on it from a command center in the US. A squaddie in his field base can look and see what is coming to them (ie; how many meals, rounds of ammunition, spare parts etc) and see exactly where the truck is at that moment in time. Clever stuff.

erdnase

1,963 posts

87 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Jasandjules said:
I guess that shows just how horrible this country has become then.
I'm not sure. The fact that it's newsworthy and discussion worthy says to me that it's not the norm.

As a society, we have many problems, but I'm sure that by almost any measure, society is becoming more honest and co-operative.

Take the video in SP&L recently of the guy hitting that girl. That was a repulsive video and made me feel uneasy watching it. To me, that says society is working. Not long ago, violence like that was much more common and less shocking to the average citizen. Social media and the internet has done a good job of distilling the very worst of society into 20 second youtube clips - and if society *doesn't* get shocked by that, there's something wrong.

TL;DR Don't give up on society yet. We've many flaws, but overall I'm sure life is getting better for everyone. Don't let an active minority taint your opinion of the vast, vast honest majority.

jesta1865

2,721 posts

95 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Condi said:
I did a couple of projects and essays on RFID for my degree, and its coming; more so for larger items to begin with in, technology and the like. Supply chains use huge amounts of RFID to track things from case size, down to individual items. The US DOD are one of the biggest users, after they realised quite how much stuff went missing en route to Afghanistan. Technology has got to a level now where they can load a pallet onto a truck, and remotely monitor not only the truck, but also the load on it from a command center in the US. A squaddie in his field base can look and see what is coming to them (ie; how many meals, rounds of ammunition, spare parts etc) and see exactly where the truck is at that moment in time. Clever stuff.
it is very clever stuff, until some knobhead gets the order on the system wrong and you get the wrong size ammo, and 45,000 toilet seats. smile



Snowboy

8,027 posts

37 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Meh.
All that shows is that the people that use that fairly unknown website steal from shops.


DeadMeat_UK

3,058 posts

168 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Jasandjules said:
I guess that shows just how horrible this country has become then.

I am glad I live in an area where people sell eggs and fruit and such out by the roadside and you just take what you want and leave the cash in the box.
I think it's different. That is stealing from an individual.
The self service thing is stealing from big corporate a.k.a. "The Man". Same perception as having a few pens and pads from the office stationery cupboard at home.

Not condoning, just a view.

Eric Mc

77,108 posts

151 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
I wonder how often the supermarkets steal from their customers by failing to adjust barcodes and offer codes correctly. I've just got back from a shopping trip where the self-serve checkout tried to diddle us out of £2.00.

Snowboy

8,027 posts

37 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
One is an accident, one is theft.

I’m sure a lot of people have got their shopping home and found that something hadn’t appeared on the bill… and then just kept the item.
They may have even noticed at the till or just after but said nothing.
Depending on your personal social conscience you may or may not remember it, or care to remember it.

Premeditated theft it wrong.
Spontaneous theft is wrong.

Not bothering to walk the 50 yards back to the shop to pay for the item they didn’t charge you for is .. . .. . . well, that’s up to each person to decide. wink

Riknos

4,283 posts

90 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
JonnyFive said:
Surely you could just scan one thing and put two things on the scale? Thats the way I've always thought people could do it.. The machine would only register one weight added to the total. I really can't believe they've weighed every item and know if what you've put in there isn't right..
HOW have you not used one of these already? You're young (maybe too young?) you're not a pensioner!

Of course they know the weights of every item; otherwise people would scan one item and put all 24 down on the scale and pay £1 for £80 worth of shopping... Think about it rolleyes

Rude-boy

18,834 posts

119 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Where I live half the houses out of town have honesty boxes and fruit/veg/eggs/bedding plants for sale. A few on main roads have web cams linked up to them but most don't bother, certainly not those down the lanes.

People leave a spare key with their neighbour just incase and only lock doors should they happen to be the 1 house that gets done over every few thousand years.

I use the self service but try not to when I have tagged items as it just becoes a pain if the helper isn't there or is helping others. I consider using my large jacket pockets and hands is the same as using a single bag. I'm not going to miss out on CC points just because I chose to carry 4 or 5 items to the car rather than put them in a plastic bag. First time anyone in store picks me up on this and I will bring an individual bag for every sodding item as a mate did when they first came in wink

I think though that the result says more about the members of that website than the population in general.

Isaac Hunt

7,197 posts

97 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Our local Sainsbury's has the most excellent "Scan and Go" option which I use all the time as you scan your shopping with a bar code reader as you go round the store.

I guess it would be fairly easy for someone to put something in their bag without scanning it.

It is also pretty good as once or twice I have found the scanned price is more than the display price which has resulted in a trip to the customer service desk. So maybe the headline should be "Supermarkets steal from their customers".

GTIAlex

584 posts

52 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
In a certain orange supermarket, if you have scan two items that are linked by an offer..for instance

2 bottles of coke for £2

Normal prices being, for instance, £3.

If you use the self service, scan the two items, the total will come to £3, even after you have press the "Pay for Items" button.

You have to press back and go back to the scan screen for it to register and change the price to £2.
Wonder how many people walk away not realising.

Try it out next time your there.

Another example is the meal deal for £3.

Sandwich
Drink
Crisps for £3.

Scan the three items on the self service checkouts, and the total will simply be the original price of the individual items added together.

To trigger the meal deal offer of £3, you have to press the pay for items, and then press back to where you scan the items. Wonder how many people dont notice...

Hope that makes sense.

Edited by GTIAlex on Thursday 26th April 15:22


Edited by GTIAlex on Thursday 26th April 15:23

JonnyFive

27,690 posts

75 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
Riknos said:
JonnyFive said:
Surely you could just scan one thing and put two things on the scale? Thats the way I've always thought people could do it.. The machine would only register one weight added to the total. I really can't believe they've weighed every item and know if what you've put in there isn't right..
HOW have you not used one of these already? You're young (maybe too young?) you're not a pensioner!

Of course they know the weights of every item; otherwise people would scan one item and put all 24 down on the scale and pay £1 for £80 worth of shopping... Think about it rolleyes
Pardon?

If you read the thread you'd see that I use them every day. I couldn't believe they'd have weighed every single item for it, rather than just the scales recognising that something else has been added.

Hysteria1983

1,594 posts

44 months

[news] 
Thursday 26th April 2012 quote quote all
I once miss scanned some socks, well didn't scan them properly I suppose. As I checked my receipt I spotted I hadn't paid for them and went to customer services where I paid for them. I was then given a £5 voucher to spend. Not sure why, I didn't ask, I just went and bought some beer with it.
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