E-Cigs

[CuckooInMyNest]

LordGrover said:

You are however feeding an addiction to nicotine.

Absolutely.

lordGrover said:

If you're happy with that then I'm happy too.

Good.

LordGrover said:

Please don't be surprised or offended by others though, who have doubts about the safety of the fumes/smoke. Whether currently proven or not, some people will have genuine concerns about their safety.

I understand that, I don't vape close to others. I KNOW tobacco smoke will kill me, Vapour may or may not kill me so seems a wiser choice, but all the evidence (so far) suggests it will not.

So why not take an even wiser choice and quit nicotine altogether? Because addict.

Sad but true, so I'll take the lesser evil.

Why doesn't everyone give up alcohol and coffee and eat lettuce? They don't want to or because addicts.

This thread is really about vapers advising each other but it frequently gets hijacked by trolls (not suggesting you are one) trying to wind up the thread regulars, although they claim otherwise.

[Fotic]

CuckooInMyNest said:

This thread is really about vapers advising each other but it frequently gets hijacked by trolls (not suggesting you are one) trying to wind up the thread regulars, although they claim otherwise.

This thread is about E-Cigs and therefore all can comment on it. Other than religion I can't think of another topic where anyone who isn't 100% on board with the idea, is declared a troll.

I've said it before but it bares repeating: I think E-Cigs look extraordinary and are totally unproven, medically. I also don't believe in nicotine substitutes of any type - it's just another industry that you're too weak to avoid.

No trolling here, just valid opinions that happen to be different to yours. Feel free to counter them if you're not too busy clapping yourself on the back for 'kicking the habit' by replacing it with another addictive habit.

[CuckooInMyNest]

FFS

[VEA]

CuckooInMyNest said:

FFS

Boring now.



This is why I spend less and less time on this website. I am actually contemplating handing in my PH card completely. Some people just wont't give up.

You've expressed your opinion over and over again, we've express ours. Now how about going and joining in with something where you actually have something to offer?

[Fotic]

VEA said:

Boring now.



This is why I spend less and less time on this website. I am actually contemplating handing in my PH card completely. Some people just wont't give up.

You've expressed your opinion over and over again, we've express ours. Now how about going and joining in with something where you actually have something to offer?

You sound as though my difference of opinion on an internet page is causing you actual upset. Maybe see it for what it is.

[Du1point8]

Fotic said:

VEA said:

Boring now.



This is why I spend less and less time on this website. I am actually contemplating handing in my PH card completely. Some people just wont't give up.

You've expressed your opinion over and over again, we've express ours. Now how about going and joining in with something where you actually have something to offer?

You sound as though my difference of opinion on an internet page is causing you actual upset. Maybe see it for what it is.

Look petal its simple...

This is a thread about vaping/e-cigs for people that WANT to do it, you have expressed your non interest in them, refuse to listen when people say its not smoking, you are basically trolling here and people don't want you on the thread.

You have 2 options, you either behave and stop trolling on a pro vaping/e-cig thread, or you gat barred from the thread for trolling and winding up people on here because you think its fun.

Which do you want? It only takes 1/2 reports and an explanation for you to be removed.

[VEA]

Fotic said:

You sound as though my difference of opinion on an internet page is causing you actual upset. Maybe see it for what it is.

No, your inability to get the fact that we understand and respect your opinion and move on is what is irking me.

As others have said. Maybe it's time for you to move on.

[Fotic]

Du1point8 said:

Look petal its simple...


Which do you want? It only takes 1/2 reports and an explanation for you to be removed.

>Massive cringe<

[Afromonk]

Also to add a point, myself and a few others I know were not tobacco smokers but currently vape, we vape 0mg Nicotine.
SO its not always a case of substituting a habit for some people and plenty of ex-smokers vape 0mg nic.
So this point about replacing a habit with another is not always true.

[Fotic]

VEA said:

No, your inability to get the fact that we understand and respect your opinion and move on is what is irking me.

As others have said. Maybe it's time for you to move on.

Is quoting someone and replying 'Boring' and then putting a picture about trolls into the post 'respecting' my opinion? I must say it didn't feel like it, it felt much more like you didn't want to discuss any of the potentially negatives to vaping and wanted to close me out, again.

I'll leave you to your myopic worship of the vaporised unknowns and genuinely hope they don't make you as poorly as I suspect they will further down the line.

[moleamol]

VEA said:

Boring now.



This is why I spend less and less time on this website. I am actually contemplating handing in my PH card completely. Some people just wont't give up.

You've expressed your opinion over and over again, we've express ours. Now how about going and joining in with something where you actually have something to offer?

Why is his opinion trolling but yours an opinion?

[VEA]

I think the point is that the discussion has been had, by the same people, on multiple occasions. The first couple of times, questions were answered, views were expressed, agreed to disagree and all that.

The issue comes from someone repeatedly coming onto a thread and stirring things up.

I think things probably have gotten out of hand, and for that I applogise. I see no issue with expressing ones opinion, infact that is what the entire point of a forum is.

[Cotty]

moleamol said:

Why is his opinion trolling but yours an opinion?

I think this definition covers it http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=tro...

Fotic does not want to discuss anything, he wants to have a go at people, look down on them, insult them and generally wind people up. If it looks like a duck, quacks like and walks like a duck, it usually is a duck.

Edited by Cotty on Monday 4th August 15:17

[Cotty]

Fotic said:

No trolling here, just valid opinions that happen to be different to yours. Feel free to counter them if you're not too busy clapping yourself on the back for 'kicking the habit' by replacing it with another addictive habit.

Prove it then, respond to my comments to you from yesterday.

The problem is you are not listening or understanding. As an example even after being told it is not another addictive habit, it just a different nicotine delivery system like gum or a patch, therefore its the same addiction. You still claim it to be another addictive habit, do you understand its not a different addiction or are you just being obtuse.

[Fotic]

OK, I didn't as it seemed overly argumentative and cruel but since you ask:

Cotty said:

This is my problem with all this, why are you trying to demonise vaping? You say yourself it has unknown health risks, so if you don't know if its good or bad why do you hate it so much? Why do you care if someone is addicted to something? and as I assume you are a non smoker and therefore does not affect you in any way, why do you have a problem?

You're assumptions are totally wrong, I'm afraid. I did used to smoke and gave up and I didn't like the health consequences, the image, the smell and the cost.

I'm not trying to demonise it, I'm just looking at it with an open mind. I put up a link regarding the health risks and ONE person made a derogatory remark about it while the rest of you busied yourselves with more purchases and totally ignored it. Let me ask you - why do you think it's so good and why are you anti any negativity towards it?

Cotty said:

People have achieved something, they have stopped smoking. They have not switched from one addictive habit to another.

Neither of those statements are remotely true. For example, a chap in this thread mentioned that his vaper broke so he was forced to smoke normal cigarettes.

Cotty said:

As for the looks bizarre and looks unusual comments, so what? It appears that people have decided to not ask your permission as to what is or not acceptable to vape on. I think we can just chalk that one up to person choice and you are just going to have to deal with what people drive, how they dress, what they vape on, tattoos etc

Isn't the purpose of a discussion forum to discuss...? Should we all be nodding in agreement to others just in case their skin's too think to handle the truth? You've mentioned a couple of times how upset you are that people don't praise you for 'achieving something' and have totally failed to see it's because you haven't. I think you're under a mild delusion about these vaper things.

So there are your answers.

[WinstonWolf]

Ah, you're a reformed smoker, you should have said...

[Cotty]

Fotic said:

I'm not trying to demonise it, I'm just looking at it with an open mind. I put up a link regarding the health risks and ONE person made a derogatory remark about it while the rest of you busied yourselves with more purchases and totally ignored it. Let me ask you - why do you think it's so good and why are you anti any negativity towards it?

No you are not looking at this with an open mind. To you its bad hence the link you posted pointing at lots of negatives. Basically the link was garbage and not worth a discussion. The truth is no one has done any long term tests on the health benefits or negativity regarding vaping.

Regarding my negativity its towards people who are anty vaping because they think its bad but they have no scientific of medical research to back it up. e-cigs have not been around long enough for the research to be done.

Fotic said:

Cotty said:

People have achieved something, they have stopped smoking. They have not switched from one addictive habit to another.

Neither of those statements are remotely true. For example, a chap in this thread mentioned that his vaper broke so he was forced to smoke normal cigarettes.

But its not a different addition, the addition is nicotine. E-gigs and cigarettes have nicotine in them, you can switch between them but its still nicotine, still the same addition.

[Sway]

Fotic said:

OK, I didn't as it seemed overly argumentative and cruel but since you ask:

Cotty said:

This is my problem with all this, why are you trying to demonise vaping? You say yourself it has unknown health risks, so if you don't know if its good or bad why do you hate it so much? Why do you care if someone is addicted to something? and as I assume you are a non smoker and therefore does not affect you in any way, why do you have a problem?

You're assumptions are totally wrong, I'm afraid. I did used to smoke and gave up and I didn't like the health consequences, the image, the smell and the cost.

I'm not trying to demonise it, I'm just looking at it with an open mind. I put up a link regarding the health risks and ONE person made a derogatory remark about it while the rest of you busied yourselves with more purchases and totally ignored it. Let me ask you - why do you think it's so good and why are you anti any negativity towards it?

Cotty said:

People have achieved something, they have stopped smoking. They have not switched from one addictive habit to another.

Neither of those statements are remotely true. For example, a chap in this thread mentioned that his vaper broke so he was forced to smoke normal cigarettes.

Cotty said:

As for the looks bizarre and looks unusual comments, so what? It appears that people have decided to not ask your permission as to what is or not acceptable to vape on. I think we can just chalk that one up to person choice and you are just going to have to deal with what people drive, how they dress, what they vape on, tattoos etc

Isn't the purpose of a discussion forum to discuss...? Should we all be nodding in agreement to others just in case their skin's too think to handle the truth? You've mentioned a couple of times how upset you are that people don't praise you for 'achieving something' and have totally failed to see it's because you haven't. I think you're under a mild delusion about these vaper things.

So there are your answers.

Seeing as I've been indirectly referenced in this post...

I did criticise the link to possible health issues - the science was flawed and very quick to leap to potential harm. That's not the point however, as I do vape I (and most others in the thread) have researched as much as possible, over a reasonable length of time. Your assumption that we haven't, and therefore need articles pointing out, implies that we have our head in the sand regarding possible health issues (the reality is that we generally believe there may be health risks, but they will be less damaging and less likely than the confirmed risks of smoking).

Your second point - I have changed. I'm still addicted to nicotine, but I don't smoke. Very different things (especially considering two of the reasons you yourself quit - smell and money). I did break my kit, and did go back to smoking. First time in over two years mind, and confirmation that I'm not addicted to smoking, but nicotine. If I didn't have such bad reactions to nicotine patches I'd have used them instead, but I can't. So smoked whilst I waited for my new kit to arrive. My choice, but another affirmation for me that I'm doing the right thing by vaping.

Now to your last point. I have by no means thin skin, yet your only comment was that 'you'd assume that I suffered from emphysema' based purely on the appearance of my ecig. The tone, and content of that and most of your other posts on this thread, come across as inflammatory (or trolling), with the only (seemingly) cause being 'just because'. You don't smoke, or vape, yet you seem very keen to offer your opinion on both. Yet as you've no experience or vested interest, your opinions come across as poorly considered, based upon ignorance and unnecessary. All because your prejudices come across clearly. Thought about rationally, and without the history, someone lighting a paper, foam and dried leaf concoction and sticking it in their mouth to inhale would look, smell, and seem, ridiculous. Yet you stick with offering these comments about ecigs.

I'm rambling now, but hopefully there's enough meaningful content in there about why your contributions to the thread are being rebuffed...

[Cotty]

Fotic said:

You've mentioned a couple of times how upset you are that people don't praise you for 'achieving something' and have totally failed to see it's because you haven't. I think you're under a mild delusion about these vaper things.

See that's the troll comment there. I have achieved something I have quit smoking. If you do not believe that then please prove to me that I am smoking.

[Fotic]

Cotty said:

Fotic said:

You've mentioned a couple of times how upset you are that people don't praise you for 'achieving something' and have totally failed to see it's because you haven't. I think you're under a mild delusion about these vaper things.

See that's the troll comment there. I have achieved something I have quit smoking. If you do not believe that then please prove to me that I am smoking.

If you insist on calling me troll I'll have to think of a name for you too.

Until you've put down the imitation pipe, you've achieved nothing. You are using a substitute or crutch to convince yourself that you have.

I wholeheartedly think that vapes are less harmful than smoking but please don't think you've kicked your addiction or habit.