The term "Mong"
Discussion
wildcat45 said:
To clear things up, I find the term offensive.
It may be an age thing. A mate of mine - early 40s like me - heard two of his staff describing someone as a Joey. He questioned them about it. They thought it was as inoffensive as Wally. They knew nothing of Joey Deacon, who most kids of a certain age (me included) mocked.
I think it must be ignorance. I still hate the term Mong.
You shouldn't use the word wally in such a derogatory way, it's offensive to people named Wally.It may be an age thing. A mate of mine - early 40s like me - heard two of his staff describing someone as a Joey. He questioned them about it. They thought it was as inoffensive as Wally. They knew nothing of Joey Deacon, who most kids of a certain age (me included) mocked.
I think it must be ignorance. I still hate the term Mong.
stitchface said:
100% sure that if I called any of my mates a mong they wouldn't experience 'psychological distress'. Are you selling a rifle by any chance?
Of course they wouldn't.They would know you were being rude to them though; but mates generally take it in the spirit it is intended.
The "offence" is normally felt by bystanders who have to experience it secondhand.
It is akin to publicly smoking, shouting
, not showering so you stink, singing profane lyrics, eating stinky food, stting in the floor, shouting racist comments.The things you are doing are causing discomfort to those around you.
If one is not intending to cause offense, be rude or be antisocial, then one shouldn't do that stuff in public.
The big problem is with people who set out to deliberately offend, and then get indignant that someone was offended.
Some people are just horrible people.
Snowboy said:
Riff Raff said:
OK, but they are "Merkins. Ask them to say 'Aluminium'.
Americans would say aluminium the same as a Brit.Just as a Brit would say aluminum the same as an American.
shakotan said:
MikeOxlong said:
Mong is offensive?
Be offended then. Nothing happens.
This. Being offended by sounds that come out of another persons mouth is purely a sign of poor upbringing.Be offended then. Nothing happens.
If you'd never been told to be offended by a word by someone else, then would wouldn't be offended.
ks.If you want to consider poor upbringing then look at the people who are unable to communicate without using socially unacceptable vocabulary.
The internet has created a place where people can be as offensive and rude as they like with impunity.
In the real world if someone speaks in such a rude manner they are likely to get punched.
Or; if physical violence isn't an option they might get barred from the pub, fired from their job, kicked out of the shop, ostracised by peers or posted on YouTube and investigated by the police.
There are times where rude and offensive language is acceptable and times when it isn't. Good upbringing means you know the difference.
Snowboy said:
shakotan said:
MikeOxlong said:
Mong is offensive?
Be offended then. Nothing happens.
This. Being offended by sounds that come out of another persons mouth is purely a sign of poor upbringing.Be offended then. Nothing happens.
If you'd never been told to be offended by a word by someone else, then would wouldn't be offended.
ks.If you want to consider poor upbringing then look at the people who are unable to communicate without using socially unacceptable vocabulary.
shakotan said:
But if you weren't told the language was unacceptable, then you wouldn't find it unacceptable, and therefore you wouldn't be upset about it. Therefore the words would have no power.
So your suggesting ignorance as a way to avoid offence?Some language is unnaceptable, if your not taught about it then you become part of the problem.
Gaspode said:
9mm said:
Can someone who is offended please explain what that means please?
For me, it's all about witnessing an act which I feel causes unnecessary and unwarranted psychological distress to the recipient/victim of the attack. The giver of the insult may hide behind the defence that they don't understand what the insult means, but nevertheless the use of it is an attack on an individual intended to demean, belittle, or reduce the feelings of self-worth of recipient of the ridicule. This is hardly ever done in a true spirit of fun, it's done to place the recipient in a position of social disadvantage as compared to the deliverer of the insult. Why do it? To make the victim feel good about themselves, or to make the deliverer feel secure in their social group?
The casual use of ability-based insults helps to keep people marginalised and marked out as being less than 'normal' people. We have seen that people who have DS don't 'suffer' from it, neither necessarily do people with cerebral palsy or a host of other 'disabilities'. But the use of these types of insult perpetuate their state of victimhood, and it's done simply to reinforce the in-group self-worth of the attacker.
I know nothing about you, but there must be something in this world you care deeply about, be it a car or a pet or a pastime or something. How do you feel when a group of influential people start belittling it? Does this scene have any resonance with you?
You are stood in the pub with people you thought were your mates, and you say you are going target shooting this weekend. For the rest of the night, there's a constant stream of psycho-killer sniper jokes aimed at you. It's ok, it's funny, they don't mean anything by it. But 3 weeks later one of the guys is still going on about you training up to be a terrorist sniper. Every time you see him he makes a sniper scope reference. It pisses you off. You'd lamp him one, but he's a foot taller than you and built like a brick s
thouse, You are too scared to do anything about it, so you suffer in silence. It gnaws away at you, to the point where to get him to stop you pack up target shooting, the one thing you really loved doing. Of course, it won't work, he'll just find something else about you to have a go at, he's got the taste for it now.That's why I get offended. I don't think it's right that people can do that to you using the defence "it's only a bit of fun".
If someone called me a mong, it would be because they perceived I had done something stupid, not that they were making some association with someone who has Downs. Equally if someone called me a nutter, it would be because they perceived I had done something outside of the norm, not because they were associating me with someone with a diagnosed mental illness (and by implication insulting diagnosed schizophrenics, manic-depressives, etc).
Likewise if I hear people using those terms with other people in everyday conversation, I'd just laugh.
Centurion07 said:
So can someone point out to me why this is unacceptable, yet you don't hear anyone whining about big nose insults? Or ears, or teeth, or lack of hair or any other physical "abnormality". Why is one "defect" okay and another not?
I think you have missed the point; or you are trolling.Certain words and language have horrible associations such that they aren't acceptable.
Most are based around hate of colour, religion, nationality, gender or suchlike.
Others are based around disabilies, illness or other differences.
Some of these words are being "taken back" by those who were the targets of them. " Gay" being one, Dykes on Bikes in Australis another example.
The N-word is being reclaimed by some elements of the black community - although still remains a taboo word and an insult.
Insulting someone for being bald is fair enough in the grand scheme of insults. But if you insulted them with reference to chemotherapy or a burn victim then it would be in very poor taste.
Is this stuff not taught by parents and schools anymore?
When I grew up we were all taught basic manners and how not to be a massive prick.
Sure, we acted like little brats in the playground. But we never pretended we weren't.
We never tried to justify it.
In fact the reason we did it was because we knew it was naughty.
Snowboy said:
I think you have missed the point; or you are trolling.
Certain words and language have horrible associations such that they aren't acceptable.
Most are based around hate of colour, religion, nationality, gender or suchlike.
Others are based around disabilies, illness or other differences.
Some of these words are being "taken back" by those who were the targets of them. " Gay" being one, Dykes on Bikes in Australis another example.
The N-word is being reclaimed by some elements of the black community - although still remains a taboo word and an insult.
Insulting someone for being bald is fair enough in the grand scheme of insults. But if you insulted them with reference to chemotherapy or a burn victim then it would be in very poor taste.
Is this stuff not taught by parents and schools anymore?
When I grew up we were all taught basic manners and how not to be a massive prick.
Sure, we acted like little brats in the playground. But we never pretended we weren't.
We never tried to justify it.
In fact the reason we did it was because we knew it was naughty.
Exactly. The words that we say have an emotional impact on those around us, and not just to the person to whom we are saying them. We live in a society of shared norms and values, and breaking those norms causes dissonance and discomfort to other people.Certain words and language have horrible associations such that they aren't acceptable.
Most are based around hate of colour, religion, nationality, gender or suchlike.
Others are based around disabilies, illness or other differences.
Some of these words are being "taken back" by those who were the targets of them. " Gay" being one, Dykes on Bikes in Australis another example.
The N-word is being reclaimed by some elements of the black community - although still remains a taboo word and an insult.
Insulting someone for being bald is fair enough in the grand scheme of insults. But if you insulted them with reference to chemotherapy or a burn victim then it would be in very poor taste.
Is this stuff not taught by parents and schools anymore?
When I grew up we were all taught basic manners and how not to be a massive prick.
Sure, we acted like little brats in the playground. But we never pretended we weren't.
We never tried to justify it.
In fact the reason we did it was because we knew it was naughty.
A failure to recognise and understand this is evidence of a sociopathic personality. Or a troll.
I used to work with somebody called XXXXXX Mong......
We used to call him "Mong".....
Now, we didn't mean it to be an insult, we used his surname as there was a couple of people with the same first name.
Mr Mong was never insulted.....
I am always referred to by my surname too.
We used to call him "Mong".....
Now, we didn't mean it to be an insult, we used his surname as there was a couple of people with the same first name.
Mr Mong was never insulted.....
I am always referred to by my surname too.
Edited by SickFish on Friday 18th July 10:34
Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff