Do you know what your colleagues earn?

[H22observer]

whoami said:

H22observer said:

For the record, i don't dislike "All financially successful people". I only dislike the prats and the modern day yuppies who think they're better than everyone else.

i do sometimes wonder about the mentality of a person that earns £70000-£90000 per year, but then refuses to discuss money because "it is vulgar", then tries really hard (in the most tasteless & vulgar way) to give off the impression that they are in the top 10% of earners by spending loads of money on watches, overpriced consumables and weddings.

How do you "know" what they earn if they won't tell you?

Good point. They give off hints, little gems like :

"I hate the fact that i pay 40% income tax on the majority of my salary"

or

"I'm dangerously close to losing my £10000 personal allowance!"

or

"It's outrageous. My marginal rate of tax is 60%. What's the point in working hard?"

Men trying to impress other men. Trumpets.

[MajorProblem]

70-90k per annum won't see you with much of a different life to dole dossers in some parts of the uk.

[mph1977]

vescaegg said:

mini1380cc said:

We know exactly what each others pay is. My group have identical responsibilities with identical job descriptions.

Lowest paid are on 27k, highest paid are on 74k. The ones higher up have been here longer so benefited from a time when annual pay increases happened regardless of performance.

Do your identical job descriptions and responsibilities fully translate to what each person actually does? If all of you do equal work then that is a ridiculous range!

this is where managers want the secretive bit

they will try and pay at the bottom of scale and banning discussion someone who manages to negotiate a raise from 27k to say 32k on the basis of doing 110% job is pretty huffed

the obvious hypocrisy is the criticism of the Public sector's approach to staggering progression toward the actual rate for the job ( top increment or penultimate increment)

[Ki3r]

We are all paid the same (supermarket), no matter how long you've been here.

I'm on slightly more as my role is classed as 'skilled', home delivery, on around £1.50 a hour extra than someone working on checkouts.

I only earn a little less a hour than a team leader, so not worth moving up really.

[Monkeylegend]

Ki3r said:

We are all paid the same (supermarket), no matter how long you've been here.

I'm on slightly more as my role is classed as 'skilled', home delivery, on around £1.50 a hour extra than someone working on checkouts.

I only earn a little less a hour than a team leader, so not worth moving up really.

So apart from those that earn a bit less than you, or those that earn a bit more than you, you are all paid the same.

[seapod]

When I started work as a graduate for Honda everyone knew what everyone else earned. It was all very Japanese and done in the spirit of harmony, etc. Frankly, it seemed to work, most of the time people will guess/estimate/exaggerate and get the number wrong which leads to unwarranted jealousy 9/10 times.

I really don't see the problem with it, get over yourselves, most people aren't that interested anyway.

As for the chap who will get offended if someone asks if he is married, christ man, you are on the slippery slope to becoming the next 'Disgusted of Tunbridge Wells'. Do you read the daily mail by any chance?

[Pique]

Can we just ban salary related threads? They take about 2 pages to turn into endless willy-waving and "Oh I wouldn't get out of bed for less than £10k per-hour", followed up by endless Elevenerifers trying to better it.

[Countdown]

valiant said:

There was a programme on a few years ago about Pimlico Plumbers who, for an experiment, revealed what everyone was earning (there was a thread if you can be bothered to find it - I can't ) and it didn't turn out to well for them. Basically everyone thought they should be getting more than the others and bhed and moaned and who'd have thought drainage bods earned so much!

Years ago I was Head of Finance for a Public Sector organisation that went through a Pay & Grading Exercise (aka Job Evaluation aka Single Status). As a result of a pretty inept HR Dept 90% of people received increases, 8% stayed the same, and 2% had their salary reduced but were on 3 years protection.

happy days, you'd think? Not a bit of it. 95% of people lodged appeals because

(a) Although they'd had a pay rise somebody else had had a bigger pay rise
(b) Although they'd had a pay rise somebody else had had the same pay rise and they felt [b]they[b] should have had more
(c) Although they'd had a big pay rise people who had had smaller payrises were lodging appeals so they thought they might as well.

HR being HR, at one stage 90% of appeals were successfull. Worse than that, the Unions had eliminated some pay bands and extended the remaining, so that rather than a pay band being £17k-£21k, it was now £21-£29k

Complete financial suicide which led to several years worth of restructuring (e.g. redundancies) mergers and outsourcing to the Private Sector.

It's not pay that annoys people, it's comparative pay.

[Ki3r]

Monkeylegend said:

So apart from those that earn a bit less than you, or those that earn a bit more than you, you are all paid the same.

Ha! Just noticed that! Oops!

[Monkeylegend]

Ki3r said:

Monkeylegend said:

So apart from those that earn a bit less than you, or those that earn a bit more than you, you are all paid the same.

Ha! Just noticed that! Oops!

We knew what you meant.

[dave_s13]

H22observer said:

dave_s13 said:

IanA2 said:

I find it quite difficult to understand the English obsession with secrecy regarding pay. In Italy when you meet someone the first three questions you are usually asked are, are you married, do you have children, and how much do you earn?

Maybe I'm missing something.

That would be consider crass and vulgar in our polite society. If someone asked me that as an ice breaker I would immediately think they were a bit of a tw@t.

That comes across as a bit sniffy and haughty actually. It's a simple question that is relatively inoffensive.

I think it says a lot more about the person who feels offended than it says about the person asking the question.

If somebody politely asks how much you paid for your house, would you also be offended?

If I had just met you, literally for the first time....

me: Hi, I'm Dave, how's it going mate
H22observer: Fine thanks, so are you married
me. errr, yes, you?
H22observer: still looking for the "right" lady >sarcastic grin<
me: riiiiggght
H22observer: any kids?
me: yeah, 3, that's why I look so knackered, it's nice to get out every now and then on our own. You?
H22observer: none that I know of! >chortlesnort<
me: okaaayy...
H22observer: so, how much do you earn?
me: <balefully stares at H22observer for a full 5 seconds then walks off and talks to someone else> >what a fekin tool<

H22observer said:

What about if they wanted to buy a house in your area?

What about if the person was asking your marital status to set you up with one of their friends?

In relevant context these two questions are entirely acceptable, as long as they are asked in a tactful manner and you had already built up some sort of relationship.

I can't say that in my 37 years on the lords green earth that I have either asked, or been asked, what I earn.

which is a good job as I work for the NHS and get paid fek all!!

[TV8]

People are generally happy with what they are paid until they find out what others are paid! Don't do it!

[Pit Pony]

It's weird, because if you don't know what the going rate is, you are going to get screwed.

How do you find out the going rate if you don't know what your colleagues are on?

I've pretty much had a whole change in my attitude, now that I'm contracting. I've made friends with a few other contractors, who whilst they are working for the same organisations, they have different skills and experiences from me, and we share our knowledge of the going rates.

I won't discuss money with any permanent employee, as they tend to multiple the hourly rate by 52 weeks x 40 hours and think that's what I earn, and I need to trust other contractors before sharing info.

[Axionknight]

I have an idea, roughly, but it doesn't bother me as to whether they earn more, or less - I have seen that particular green eyed monster cause a lot of problems in the past so it is something I just don't get involved or engrossed in.

[Pit Pony]

H22observer said:

whoami said:

H22observer said:

For the record, i don't dislike "All financially successful people". I only dislike the prats and the modern day yuppies who think they're better than everyone else.

i do sometimes wonder about the mentality of a person that earns £70000-£90000 per year, but then refuses to discuss money because "it is vulgar", then tries really hard (in the most tasteless & vulgar way) to give off the impression that they are in the top 10% of earners by spending loads of money on watches, overpriced consumables and weddings.

How do you "know" what they earn if they won't tell you?

Good point. They give off hints, little gems like :

"I hate the fact that i pay 40% income tax on the majority of my salary"

or

"I'm dangerously close to losing my £10000 personal allowance!"

or

"It's outrageous. My marginal rate of tax is 60%. What's the point in working hard?"

Men trying to impress other men. Trumpets.

I do the opposite with my wife's snobby friends:

"Our son gets a full university grant, and bursary designed to encourage the children of people from families earning under the average"

"I owe HMRC £1860 in overpaid tax credits, due to a HMRC mistake, but am paying back at £12 a week"

"I'm coming dangerously close to paying tax"

Note 2 of these are actually true.

[iphonedyou]

H22observer said:

Good point. They give off hints, little gems like :

"I hate the fact that i pay 40% income tax on the majority of my salary"

or

"I'm dangerously close to losing my £10000 personal allowance!"

or

"It's outrageous. My marginal rate of tax is 60%. What's the point in working hard?"

Men trying to impress other men. Trumpets.

Much as with the weddings, you just associate with knobs. Try mixing with new people, it'll change your life.

[Countdown]

Pit Pony said:

I do the opposite with my wife's snobby friends:

"Our son gets a full university grant, and bursary designed to encourage the children of people from families earning under the average"

"I owe HMRC £1860 in overpaid tax credits, due to a HMRC mistake, but am paying back at £12 a week"

"I'm coming dangerously close to paying tax"

Note 2 of these are actually true.

One assumes you're, how can I put this, ......."Northern"?

[can't remember]

The Operations Management Accountant at my previous company was a pushy little prick of the highest order. He was always pulling people up on the slightest error in their figures or suggesting ridiculous cost savings in order to push himself up the ladder. Anyway one day he got pissed off that one of my senior admin girls was earning almost the same as he was, so he decided to email the Ops Director a list of those he considered the most overpaid people in the department (I was on the list, much to my delight). Not only did he post this to the Ops Director and the rest of the people included on the Ops group but he also included the wages of everyone in Ops on page two of his spreadsheet. He was totally fked.

[Pommygranite]

H22observer said:

For the record, i don't dislike "All financially successful people". I only dislike the prats and the modern day yuppies who think they're better than everyone else.

It cant be you then that invades every thread to do with money and complains incessantly about wealthy people and higher rate taxpayers...

[PaulG40]

The hm forces is quite open about salaries, we don't tend to bh about our colleagues earnings, rather we bh about how some non technical trades (nco and above) get paid the same as techies yet don't have to go through anywhere near our standard technical training and length of overall training.

Although we do moan about getting paid so little and asked to do far more.