Children, manners and good habits from an early age...
Discussion
el stovey said:
I'm glad Raymond has started a thread about etiquette.
Raymond,
I was recently at a supper with friends and my wife was speaking out of turn, I wasn't sure If I should silence her at the table perhaps with a sharp look or kick under the table or should I wait until we got home?
Also what do other posters do regarding wives who have become slightly drunk and are heading towards social unattractiveness?
I believe Mr Cholmondley Warner has produced a newsreel guide on this very topic.Raymond,
I was recently at a supper with friends and my wife was speaking out of turn, I wasn't sure If I should silence her at the table perhaps with a sharp look or kick under the table or should I wait until we got home?
Also what do other posters do regarding wives who have become slightly drunk and are heading towards social unattractiveness?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LS37SNYjg8w
With apologies to The greatest Poet Laureate in recent times;
How To Get On In Society by John Betjeman
Phone for the fish knives, Norman
As cook is a little unnerved;
You kiddies have crumpled the serviettes
And I must have things daintily served.
Are the requisites all in the toilet?
The frills round the cutlets can wait
Till the girl has replenished the cruets
And switched on the logs in the grate.
It's ever so close in the lounge dear,
But the vestibule's comfy for tea
And Howard is riding on horseback
So do come and take some with me
Now here is a fork for your pastries
And do use the couch for your feet;
I know that I wanted to ask you-
Is trifle sufficient for sweet?
Milk and then just as it comes dear?
I'm afraid the preserve's full of stones;
Beg pardon, I'm soiling the doileys
With afternoon tea-cakes and scones.
How To Get On In Society by John Betjeman
Phone for the fish knives, Norman
As cook is a little unnerved;
You kiddies have crumpled the serviettes
And I must have things daintily served.
Are the requisites all in the toilet?
The frills round the cutlets can wait
Till the girl has replenished the cruets
And switched on the logs in the grate.
It's ever so close in the lounge dear,
But the vestibule's comfy for tea
And Howard is riding on horseback
So do come and take some with me
Now here is a fork for your pastries
And do use the couch for your feet;
I know that I wanted to ask you-
Is trifle sufficient for sweet?
Milk and then just as it comes dear?
I'm afraid the preserve's full of stones;
Beg pardon, I'm soiling the doileys
With afternoon tea-cakes and scones.
Edited by ClaphamGT3 on Wednesday 3rd September 11:01
FlossyThePig said:
Having a meal in a restaurant recently, there was a young couple at the next table. They hardly spoke but spent most of the time between courses looking at their phones and texting.
I think that's how they communicate with each other. 
I read something recently about 'young people' being less adept at interpreting facial expressions due to the amount of electronic communication they use.
el stovey said:
I'm glad Raymond has started a thread about etiquette.
Raymond, as you don't have children but undoubtably are a man of gentlemanlyness, defined by flawless manners and polite masculinity typical of the British gent. I was wondering if you could provide some guidance on the following,
I was recently at a supper with friends and my wife was speaking out of turn, I wasn't sure If I should silence her at the table perhaps with a sharp look or kick under the table or should I wait until we got home?
Also what do other posters do regarding wives who have become slightly drunk and are heading towards social unattractiveness?
Sir, you should explain to your good lady wife that it is socially acceptable for her to drink not less than 1/3 or more than 1/2 of a bottle of wine.Raymond, as you don't have children but undoubtably are a man of gentlemanlyness, defined by flawless manners and polite masculinity typical of the British gent. I was wondering if you could provide some guidance on the following,
I was recently at a supper with friends and my wife was speaking out of turn, I wasn't sure If I should silence her at the table perhaps with a sharp look or kick under the table or should I wait until we got home?
Also what do other posters do regarding wives who have become slightly drunk and are heading towards social unattractiveness?
ClaphamGT3 said:
With apologies to The greatest Poet Laureate in recent times;
How To Get On In Society by John Betjeman
Phone for the fish knives, Norman
As cook is a little unnerved;
You kiddies have crumpled the serviettes
And I must have things daintily served.
Are the requisites all in the toilet?
The frills round the cutlets can wait
Till the girl has replenished the cruets
And switched on the logs in the grate.
It's ever so close in the lounge dear,
But the vestibule's comfy for tea
And Howard is riding on horseback
So do come and take some with me
Now here is a fork for your pastries
And do use the couch for your feet;
I know that I wanted to ask you-
Is trifle sufficient for sweet?
Milk and then just as it comes dear?
I'm afraid the preserve's full of stones;
Beg pardon, I'm soiling the doileys
With afternoon tea-cakes and scones.
Shame he was such a peasant, if he'd used the word "knapkin" the first verse would have scanned better. How To Get On In Society by John Betjeman
Phone for the fish knives, Norman
As cook is a little unnerved;
You kiddies have crumpled the serviettes
And I must have things daintily served.
Are the requisites all in the toilet?
The frills round the cutlets can wait
Till the girl has replenished the cruets
And switched on the logs in the grate.
It's ever so close in the lounge dear,
But the vestibule's comfy for tea
And Howard is riding on horseback
So do come and take some with me
Now here is a fork for your pastries
And do use the couch for your feet;
I know that I wanted to ask you-
Is trifle sufficient for sweet?
Milk and then just as it comes dear?
I'm afraid the preserve's full of stones;
Beg pardon, I'm soiling the doileys
With afternoon tea-cakes and scones.
Edited by ClaphamGT3 on Wednesday 3rd September 11:01
My son is well mannered and eats pretty much correctly, uses please and thank you etc.
My step son however
...
He doesn't eat with his mouth closed, he uses a fork to shovel food in and when I ask him not to text at the table he glares at me. Out for dinner one Friday night on recent holiday, he gets his phone out, I shake my head and he glares at me and then refuses to speak or interact with me until Monday, cannot even be civil to me. The atmosphere was dreadful.
His father does try but if we correct him too much, he flies off the handle and is a moody little *%"^" so my OH doesn't like to rock the boat and therefore doesn't correct him too much.
My step son is 13 and old enough to know better. (although he plays over 18 games and watches inappropriate films until 4am on a school night at home at his mother's house, seems everyone is scared of him kicking off).
My step son however
...He doesn't eat with his mouth closed, he uses a fork to shovel food in and when I ask him not to text at the table he glares at me. Out for dinner one Friday night on recent holiday, he gets his phone out, I shake my head and he glares at me and then refuses to speak or interact with me until Monday, cannot even be civil to me. The atmosphere was dreadful.
His father does try but if we correct him too much, he flies off the handle and is a moody little *%"^" so my OH doesn't like to rock the boat and therefore doesn't correct him too much.
My step son is 13 and old enough to know better. (although he plays over 18 games and watches inappropriate films until 4am on a school night at home at his mother's house, seems everyone is scared of him kicking off).
My little one who has just turned 2 currently is in a transition stage from wedging food into her face using her paws, to using cutlery. She will use one hand to scoop food onto a fork then into her mouth. She hasn't got used to the knife just yet. When she gets that far the next step will be to get her to hold it properly, not with her fist wrapped round the fork/ spoon like she is about to stab someone. My mate still uses this technique and he is 29 and it fills me with rage eating at the same table as him.
As for the dominant hand, i couldn't care less, and fish knives can jog on too.
As for the dominant hand, i couldn't care less, and fish knives can jog on too.
Edited by dazwalsh on Wednesday 3rd September 12:02
I get really irritated by those people who eat with their elbows spread out, and keep hitting you and limiting your own mobility when sitting next to them. Might be related to erroneous cutlery management.
Another thing which grates, and seems a specialty of my fellow Italians, is the practice of lowering your face really close to the plate and then almost scooping up the food with the fork. Is it so hard to sit upright and slowly guide the fork to your mouth without spilling food everywhere?
Open mouth chewers - die.
Another thing which grates, and seems a specialty of my fellow Italians, is the practice of lowering your face really close to the plate and then almost scooping up the food with the fork. Is it so hard to sit upright and slowly guide the fork to your mouth without spilling food everywhere?
Open mouth chewers - die.
My daughter is not even 2 years old yet and we have successfully tought her to eat with her mouth closed.
The whole using the fork to get food into the mouth thing is still a bit of a battle but I'm pretty impressed with how politely she actually 'eats'.
I know what the OP is getting at though. My folks were very strict with me and my grandparents even stricter (you couldn't even mutter the word 'bum' around them!) whereas nowadays it seems the norm for kids to be hurling the C word around.
It's all to do with moral standards.
My nephew (7 yo) came to stay with us a little while ago and he wanted to play Call of Duty with me. No. It's not for your age group. His folks let him play Grand Theft Auto day-in-day-out so he thought this was very unfair. Instead, I suggested we play with a couple of my RC cars outside. He threw a tantrum.
Little pillock.
The whole using the fork to get food into the mouth thing is still a bit of a battle but I'm pretty impressed with how politely she actually 'eats'.
I know what the OP is getting at though. My folks were very strict with me and my grandparents even stricter (you couldn't even mutter the word 'bum' around them!) whereas nowadays it seems the norm for kids to be hurling the C word around.
It's all to do with moral standards.
My nephew (7 yo) came to stay with us a little while ago and he wanted to play Call of Duty with me. No. It's not for your age group. His folks let him play Grand Theft Auto day-in-day-out so he thought this was very unfair. Instead, I suggested we play with a couple of my RC cars outside. He threw a tantrum.
Little pillock.
Bill said:
Risotto said:
Surely you were taught a fish knife should be held in precisely the same manner as a pen? No? Gosh, what a dreadful peasant you must be! 
Unfortunately these days many people seem to think a limited knowledge of etiquette is simply a tool to belittle others and draw smug conclusions about them.
A fish knife is a bit nouveau, no?Unfortunately these days many people seem to think a limited knowledge of etiquette is simply a tool to belittle others and draw smug conclusions about them.
I was simply trying to illustrate that people who use etiquette rules to judge others leave themselves open to being judged too. Rather than being used as a useful set of guidelines for how to eat, etiquette seems to have become a means to judge the social standing of others.Edited by Risotto on Wednesday 3rd September 19:59
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