Do you spare change for the homeless?
Discussion
Kermit power said:
Far fewer than there ever used to be, thanks to the RBL putting pressure on the MOD to provide troops with proper training to get them used to civilian life before discharge. From what I read about at the time, those ending up on the streets due to mental issues were actually dwarfed by those ending up there because they had no clue about the need to balance a budget and set aside money for rent and bills, as they'd never had to do it in their lives before.
I have absolutely no doubt that £50 given to the Legion will do far, far more for the cause of ex-soldiers living on the streets (or, indeed, ensuring they never get there in the first place) than giving £50 to beggars will.
I've never heard of a charity turning round and saying "stop donating, please, we've got enough", so every penny you give to the sort of scum who pressure people for money in the streets and throw gifts of food back in your face because they can't drink it, smoke it or stick it in their veins is a penny effectively stolen from those who really can do something to help those in need.
I can assure you there's no training on how to live your life once out of the Army.I have absolutely no doubt that £50 given to the Legion will do far, far more for the cause of ex-soldiers living on the streets (or, indeed, ensuring they never get there in the first place) than giving £50 to beggars will.
I've never heard of a charity turning round and saying "stop donating, please, we've got enough", so every penny you give to the sort of scum who pressure people for money in the streets and throw gifts of food back in your face because they can't drink it, smoke it or stick it in their veins is a penny effectively stolen from those who really can do something to help those in need.
You carry on thinking they are all scum without knowing anything about them. Maybe you should go through what they have gone through for them to now be in that situation.
No I don't, but I give money to other charities via direct debit each month.
I'm sure many are deserving but I can't tell which. There's a bloke who sells the Big Issue outside our local Waitrose (I believe other supermarkets are available but as I'm on PH I won't admit to knowing of them) who I thought was deserving until my son told me he was a regular at the pub he worked in at the time, I've also seen him on his mobile phone and at times a woman turns up who he hands over to for a bit while he has a break.
We all draw the line somewhere, this is mine and my admittedly very subjective reason.
I'm sure many are deserving but I can't tell which. There's a bloke who sells the Big Issue outside our local Waitrose (I believe other supermarkets are available but as I'm on PH I won't admit to knowing of them) who I thought was deserving until my son told me he was a regular at the pub he worked in at the time, I've also seen him on his mobile phone and at times a woman turns up who he hands over to for a bit while he has a break.
We all draw the line somewhere, this is mine and my admittedly very subjective reason.
Shaolin said:
No I don't, but I give money to other charities via direct debit each month.
I'm sure many are deserving but I can't tell which. There's a bloke who sells the Big Issue outside our local Waitrose (I believe other supermarkets are available but as I'm on PH I won't admit to knowing of them) who I thought was deserving until my son told me he was a regular at the pub he worked in at the time, I've also seen him on his mobile phone and at times a woman turns up who he hands over to for a bit while he has a break.
We all draw the line somewhere, this is mine and my admittedly very subjective reason.
http://www.bigissue.com/how-become-vendorI'm sure many are deserving but I can't tell which. There's a bloke who sells the Big Issue outside our local Waitrose (I believe other supermarkets are available but as I'm on PH I won't admit to knowing of them) who I thought was deserving until my son told me he was a regular at the pub he worked in at the time, I've also seen him on his mobile phone and at times a woman turns up who he hands over to for a bit while he has a break.
We all draw the line somewhere, this is mine and my admittedly very subjective reason.
as I understand it once someone is a vendor they aren't forced to stop selling the big issue after aset period of time or on the basis of a set change of circumstances although they do encourage people to move on to 'real' jobs once they are set (back) up and in a position to move on.(stable accomodation, bank account, phone etc )
If I happen to be carrying spare industrial alcohol on me, I'll let them have a sip, or if I have any heroin, I'm happy to share my needle with them, but loose change ? Nope.
In all seriousness I think I'll give to the Salvation Army Christmas Appeal, this year. I have to do something because my wife got all s
tty with me when I failed to 'spare' any change whilst walking through Liverpool city centre one evening, on a cold damp night. Apparently I don't care. I think maybe my Christmas present to her is going here :
http://www.salvationarmy.org.uk/uki/autumn-appeal
In all seriousness I think I'll give to the Salvation Army Christmas Appeal, this year. I have to do something because my wife got all s
tty with me when I failed to 'spare' any change whilst walking through Liverpool city centre one evening, on a cold damp night. Apparently I don't care. I think maybe my Christmas present to her is going here : http://www.salvationarmy.org.uk/uki/autumn-appeal
Sometimes.
It depends on who it is though as there are a couple of scrounging buggers in Gloucester who claim to be homeless yet arrive in town in a car & park it in disabled bays with a blue badge!!
There is one older man who spends his time in the shadows of Gloucester Cathedral - doesn't swear, doesnt drink alcohol, doesn't ask for anything from anyone & who always wishes everyone who passes either good morning or good afternoon.
When he is given tea, coffee, some food or cigarettes he always, without fail, says thank you.
Also sometimes buy The Big Issue although I don't always read it.
It depends on who it is though as there are a couple of scrounging buggers in Gloucester who claim to be homeless yet arrive in town in a car & park it in disabled bays with a blue badge!!
There is one older man who spends his time in the shadows of Gloucester Cathedral - doesn't swear, doesnt drink alcohol, doesn't ask for anything from anyone & who always wishes everyone who passes either good morning or good afternoon.
When he is given tea, coffee, some food or cigarettes he always, without fail, says thank you.
Also sometimes buy The Big Issue although I don't always read it.
jimbop1 said:
I can assure you there's no training on how to live your life once out of the Army.
You carry on thinking they are all scum without knowing anything about them. Maybe you should go through what they have gone through for them to now be in that situation.
And as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I can assure you there is help there if required. I left this year and went through an awful lot of re-settlement courses, talks, leaflets and various other things. The help is there for those that require it. They will not babysit and hold your hand to do it though, if you need it, you have to go to them.You carry on thinking they are all scum without knowing anything about them. Maybe you should go through what they have gone through for them to now be in that situation.
Even now that I'm stable with a place and a job, they still contact me at least every 6 months to make sure everything is ok.
PHuzzy said:
jimbop1 said:
I can assure you there's no training on how to live your life once out of the Army.
You carry on thinking they are all scum without knowing anything about them. Maybe you should go through what they have gone through for them to now be in that situation.
And as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I can assure you there is help there if required. I left this year and went through an awful lot of re-settlement courses, talks, leaflets and various other things. The help is there for those that require it. They will not babysit and hold your hand to do it though, if you need it, you have to go to them.You carry on thinking they are all scum without knowing anything about them. Maybe you should go through what they have gone through for them to now be in that situation.
Even now that I'm stable with a place and a job, they still contact me at least every 6 months to make sure everything is ok.
mph1977 said:
I also think Pay as you dine Save as you starve has opened a few eyes as to the levle of lack of knowledge of that kind of personal admin among some of the less bright members of the other ranks ...
Ahh great name. Although I did actually prefer PAYD as you weren't 'penalised' for eating out or opting for a higher standard of food and cooking yourself.Indeed you are correct though, I suppose if you've joined at 16/17 and have known no different than your monthly wage being play money then it may come as a bit of a shock when civvy wages don't offer you that affordability to millionaires weekend it every month and not worry about bills, essentials.
Luckily I don't need the help that is available but should I ever find myself in that horrendous situation, my personal pride wouldn't stop me from getting in touch with them.
San Fran is a good example of the various different levels of street livers.
There's the guy who hides behind some leafy twigs and jumps out to make tourist crap themselves.
He earns his contributions.
Then there are the cheats. Plenty of them there but the worst I've seen was so blatant.
A car parked up on Fishermans Walt, man and women got out and in front of plenty if people swapped there outer cloths for dirty stuff. They got there 'homeless plac's out of the car, the guy then pointed for his wife to go down the street while went the other.
3:00am on Union Square coming out of Lefty O'Dools and a black guy politely asked me if I could help him with a dollar.
I gave him ten and he insisted that he walk me to my hotel 'just in case'.
On the way he told me he was out of the US Marines and everything had gone pair shaped for him.
Gave him another tenner.
There's the guy who hides behind some leafy twigs and jumps out to make tourist crap themselves.
He earns his contributions.
Then there are the cheats. Plenty of them there but the worst I've seen was so blatant.
A car parked up on Fishermans Walt, man and women got out and in front of plenty if people swapped there outer cloths for dirty stuff. They got there 'homeless plac's out of the car, the guy then pointed for his wife to go down the street while went the other.
3:00am on Union Square coming out of Lefty O'Dools and a black guy politely asked me if I could help him with a dollar.
I gave him ten and he insisted that he walk me to my hotel 'just in case'.
On the way he told me he was out of the US Marines and everything had gone pair shaped for him.
Gave him another tenner.
PHuzzy said:
And as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I can assure you there is help there if required. I left this year and went through an awful lot of re-settlement courses, talks, leaflets and various other things. The help is there for those that require it. They will not babysit and hold your hand to do it though, if you need it, you have to go to them.
Even now that I'm stable with a place and a job, they still contact me at least every 6 months to make sure everything is ok.
Officer or pen pusher?Even now that I'm stable with a place and a job, they still contact me at least every 6 months to make sure everything is ok.
Reality isn't as simple as that.
I'll never forget as a kid this poor guy who had come into McDonald's on a snowy, miserable day and bought a coffee, presumably with something he'd been given. Once he'd finished the staff threw him out.
I remember him going a bit hysterical and them manhandling him out the door. The pavements were covered in slush.
He had no shoes
I'll never forget that poor guy. I can't believe nobody offered to buy him some cheap trainers.
That said, life does jade you somewhat and I don't give change very often as an adult. I do it sometimes, it just depends on how I'm feeling at the time and how poor the conditions are etc. I last gave change to someone wrapped up by the entrance to a tube in Central London because I felt sorry for her and the weather was awful. Gave her enough to get a hot drink. It's up to her where she went from there.
I feel sorry for the dogs they have but I also understand how just having that company when you have absolutely nothing else can be the difference between carrying on or giving up.
The stories of people with decent lives losing it all via divorce etc. and ending up on the street are terrifying!
I remember him going a bit hysterical and them manhandling him out the door. The pavements were covered in slush.
He had no shoes
I'll never forget that poor guy. I can't believe nobody offered to buy him some cheap trainers.
That said, life does jade you somewhat and I don't give change very often as an adult. I do it sometimes, it just depends on how I'm feeling at the time and how poor the conditions are etc. I last gave change to someone wrapped up by the entrance to a tube in Central London because I felt sorry for her and the weather was awful. Gave her enough to get a hot drink. It's up to her where she went from there.
I feel sorry for the dogs they have but I also understand how just having that company when you have absolutely nothing else can be the difference between carrying on or giving up.
The stories of people with decent lives losing it all via divorce etc. and ending up on the street are terrifying!
The thing I can never understand is where are other family members when things are going horribly wrong? Injured ex service men/women who end up with nothing or people who have gone through a devorce etc, where are other family members? Do they even realize that their loved ones are living like this?
boobles said:
The thing I can never understand is where are other family members when things are going horribly wrong? Injured ex service men/women who end up with nothing or people who have gone through a devorce etc, where are other family members? Do they even realize that their loved ones are living like this?
Jesus H.I think this post neatly demonstrates just how removed from the realties of 'life' some on here are.
Some people don't have loved ones. Some people are abused in horrendous ways by the very people that are supposed to be protecting them through life. Some people lose their loved ones to drugs, alcoholism, crime....
Some people are ALONE in this life and have no one who would even bat an eye if they ceased to exist.
Sorry if my post seems blunt but really, if you are over the age of 16 I'd expect this to be pretty common knowledge.
jimbop1 said:
PHuzzy said:
And as I mentioned earlier in the thread, I can assure you there is help there if required. I left this year and went through an awful lot of re-settlement courses, talks, leaflets and various other things. The help is there for those that require it. They will not babysit and hold your hand to do it though, if you need it, you have to go to them.
Even now that I'm stable with a place and a job, they still contact me at least every 6 months to make sure everything is ok.
Officer or pen pusher?Even now that I'm stable with a place and a job, they still contact me at least every 6 months to make sure everything is ok.
Reality isn't as simple as that.
Kermit power said:
so every penny you give to the sort of scum who pressure people for money in the streets and throw gifts of food back in your face because they can't drink it, smoke it or stick it in their veins is a penny effectively stolen from those who really can do something to help those in need.
You dont have to give anything to homeless people, that's fine. It's not fine to push your agenda of who's worth what onto them and other people. I also dont think that 'scum' and 'peasants' is really appropriateIf the people on the street turn down your kind offers for whatever reason, accept it. You're thinking you're doing them a favour from some up on high position, they're thinking they dont actually want that. Just accept their decision
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