Home Schooling

Author
Discussion

Frimley111R

15,611 posts

234 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
quotequote all
Yes, my business partner lives near Reading and he has 4 boys.

sdyson31

Original Poster:

156 posts

125 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
quotequote all
Frimley111R said:
Yes, my business partner lives near Reading and he has 4 boys.
Could you pls pm me the contact details.


Edited by sdyson31 on Thursday 21st May 18:14

Zerotonine

1,171 posts

174 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
quotequote all
Good subject OP.I am in the Wiltshire area and as of the end of the school year will be pulling the eldest (12 and Aspergers) out of mainstream school and bringing him into a home schooling environment.
My other half and myself have realised that sending him to a mainstream school (with a specialised ASD unit) isn't working for him, and he comes home shattered, argumentative, tearful and on the verge of a mental breakdown. This is because he pretends all day to be coping with all the pressures, academic and social, and by the end of it just cannot do it anymore.
I for one believe that the Education System (Mainly Secondary) does not work anymore. I know that there are a lot of people who jump straight to the socialisation aspect, but when the child starts school at 8:40, tutor time until 9:00, 5 lessons with half an hour lunch break, then home for a further two hours homework, how exactly are they supposed to fit in time to socialise with their peers?
Also, there is far too much emphasis on GCSE success. My boy is currently in Year 7, and every parent consultation goes on about how he will fare in GCSEs 5 YEARS AWAY. I am not concerned how he is predicted to do in 5 years time, he has a lot of learning to do between now and then, some subjects he would be fine with, others, not so much. I think it is ridiculous to be trying to force children into thinking about GCSE success that far away. It is like trying to predict the Grand National winner in 5 years time, all speculation.
Now my other half has been getting resources from different organisations, learning aids, etc. She has also been visiting other local families who educate at home, so she could discuss the benefits and pitfalls of pulling him out of school. She has also been having weekly meetings with the head of the ASD unit, to see if there is anything that could be done in order to continue at mainstream school, so it isn't a quick knee-jerk reaction.
I do not think that the Education System is all bad, I believe that for a lot of children it works just fine, some children flourish, others merely coast, but there are some children who it just does not work for, and for those, with the right support network and parents who actually want to help their child and is prepared to do the work associated with it (and potentially get private tutors etc), then they should go for it. The LEA does take an interest in Home Schooling and they will monitor the situation anyway.

stuart313

740 posts

113 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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eldar said:
sdyson31 said:
no wonder why there are many teenage pregnancies
As in being lower now?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-31602417
You know it has to be warped if its the BBC. Simple question, are there more slags nowadays than there were in 1969? If yes then it's not falling is it.

Jasandjules

69,862 posts

229 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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I know a lady near me who did it. Two boys. One is a not hugely well adjusted fellow, no friends to speak of, is early 20s but holidays with mum. The other lad has loads of friends, own place, good job etc and goes on hols with his mates.


uncinqsix

3,239 posts

210 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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My sister home schooled her daughter. Completely screwed her up. She's a smart kid, but has no social skills, no ambition and no idea what she wants to do with her life.

It's heartbreaking to see such a waste of potential.

ooo000ooo

2,529 posts

194 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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sdyson31 said:
no wonder why there are many teenage pregnancies
The daughter of a friend of a friend of the wife is pregnant at 14, her mother announced that she would be home schooling her when the child is born so that she could spend as much time with her child as possible.
I don't think i've ever seen one of her facebook posts with more than 10% of the words spelt right.
Bodes well for the future.

hardcastlephil

351 posts

162 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Hi OP,

I read this with interest - wasn't planning to post, but then I've just been out cutting the grass and couldn't stop thinking about it. I'm a primary teacher by trade; and I guess that puts me in the minority on PH (cars in general don't seem to be hot topic in the staff room!). I did come into teaching late after having a private sector job, so I'm not one of those 'teaching is the only job' types.

Bullying is horrendous - but I'm sure that working with the school (or even moving school) would offer a considerably better outcome for your children.

Anyway - I won't dwell on the social interaction point. That appears to have been well untruly covered! Although in response to the chap who was discussing the minimal social interaction which happens only between lesson periods - I don't know when you last attended school, but it's very very different now. Children do not sit at desks and listen to teachers talk. All lessons are based on interaction and collaborative learning with others, and emphasis is given to children following their own interests using the resources available (I'll come to that in a minute). All children have speaking and listening expectations and targets which are developed through presentation to others. This isn't only at my school, it is law.

My first thought was about subject knowledge. Do you really know about how to use an auxiliary verb or abstract noun? Or how the use of modal or perfect verbs affect the way the reader feels about a text? Maybe you do, but can you explain this clearly to a child? I have a maths degree, and not one day goes by without my having to consider carefully how I'm going to teach my children the most basic of of mathematical concepts in a way which will be engaging and understandable. I then have to think of relevant tasks which will help scaffold the learning, yet let me assess how much they have understood - only then can I think about their next steps through the curriculum. This is not like the friends episode in which Phoebe wants to teach piano - "I'll just stay one lesson ahead of the children". You must have both good subject knowledge and cognitive understanding.

Maybe you think that 11 year old children should not have to be able to determine an exclamatory sentence from an imperative sentence, or understand basic algebra. Maybe that's right. But what you can be sure of, is that by not teaching any of this - you're children will be falling behind of others their age who do know this. How will they compete for a job or university place if they are academically years behind?

My second thought was about resources. I've only taught half a day today, but I used:

Scales (electric and analogue)
Newton meters
Weights (plastic and metal)
Pulley and rope system
Stopwatches
Snap N Fix electronic set
Digit cards
Number fans
'Talking tins' - children talk into them to help remember sentences

These are just the basics. A home schooled child will not have access to anywhere near the resources required to provide a good standard of education - and unless you have past experience of teaching, I can't see how you would know what to use. I certainly wouldn't before becoming a teacher.

I'm not saying that our school system is the best. And I've seen plenty of poor teachers come and go, but all are regulated by others in the school. Moderation and assessment of both pupil and teacher is constant, and there are very limited chances for children to slip through the net.

I'll admit to making some stupid personal decisions - mostly going against advice and forging against others' ideas, but at least they've only affected myself. Pulling your children out of a formal education is a decision you are making for them, and will affect them for life.

Apologies for any poor spelling/grammar - I was rushing!

Best,

Phil


Edited by hardcastlephil on Thursday 21st May 21:15

Studio117

4,250 posts

191 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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The above post just reinforces the modern culture of overthinking everything. Why make it so convoluted and obtuse for the sake of it?

(awaits the resident language pendants to scorn me)

Shaolin

2,955 posts

189 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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I left teaching at Christmas after 25 years in secondary. My wife also used to be a secondary teacher. There is no way we ever have considered home educating our own 2 boys.

Our neighbours are home schoolers, or more accurately, they are non-schoolers. My wife did some tutoring for them and their home schooler friends for a couple of years. Hers and my impression are of lovely polite children who are behind in pretty much everything. One of them at least would be regarded as special needs if he was in mainstream due to an inability to read/write/do simple maths, the parents view is that "he'll start to do it when he's ready", except he probably won't most kids like that get behind for life.

The OP would be far better off finding a better school and maybe relax a bit. As a form tutor and teacher I have had several previously home-schooled kids in my form and classes, every single one was a bit odd, if they have been educationally ok, socially they weren't or vice versa. The bullying thing is frequently cited as a reason for home schooling, it can be addressed, I have helped (successfully) kids to get through it and to be accepted by their peers (which is what it is usually about). I have seen kids who are not being bullied being convinced by their parents that they are and so removed from school altogether, invariably in these cases the parent was bullied at school.

I think it's really important that kids get on with their peers, the people they will be spending most of their lives with. Home school kids are often fine with adults who make allowances for them, but not good with their peers, this is often largely due to the parents being too controlling. Our neighbours don't mix at all with the local kids, they only mix with other home schoolers for instance. The result is they are spending most of their childhood in the family home instead of 6-7 hours a day in school with other people including a whole bunch of kids their own age.

Condi

17,141 posts

171 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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Dont all 8 year olds get bullied? Isnt that what kids do? They call each other smelly, poohead and whatever. By the time thy get to 12 they're normal, well adjusted people who are able to deal with the st life throws at you over the remaining 80 years of your life. Otherwise they become overly sensitive wimps who will run away from any confrontation which is inevitable in life.

No way in hell would I want to be homeschooled, or do the same to my kids!

vonuber

17,868 posts

165 months

Thursday 21st May 2015
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sdyson31 said:
Our eight years old son gets bullied in schools alot.
I was bullied a lot at school, it was truly horrendous. Made the whole period one I would rather forget, so I understand what he is going through.

Still I got through it and they haven't found their bodies yet, so things can get better.

Sir Bagalot

6,474 posts

181 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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As many others have said there is also the social side.

I know two families that have home schooled their children. Both sets of Children are what I would call Social Retards.

Nobby Diesel

2,051 posts

251 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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I know a couple of families who have home schooled.
In my opinion, it was done more for the benefit of the parents than the children. The parents seemed to have a idealistic view, that they would cosset their children, from the evils of the modern world. They might do this, but at what price?

However, the OP mentioned that one of his children was being bullied. Not sure that this is reason enough to home school. Maybe try sorting the issue, as opposed to avoiding it. Speak to the school and be adamant about your concerns. They need to sort this issue out. Not you.
As for the "kissing a boy on the lips" comment from another child, well, not entirely sure that would motivate me to remove my child from the school system. You need to understand that your children will be taught sex education in Junior School! Remember, kids have access to the internet! If you say "my kids don't", then you need to realise, that they will be in a society where other kids do, so be prepared!

I'm sure that there are a number of advantages to home schooling and each situation should be considered on its own merits. I'm also sure that there is a huge amount to be gained by being in a socially interactive environment, such as a Junior School. Day trips, group discussion, varied ethnic, socio economic and religious views. Also, how do home schooled children learn about sport and being part of a team? Competitive sport is great for kids - the vast majority thrive on it. Learning to lose, is just as important as learning about winning. How would a home schooled child truly experience this?

I hope that the OP makes the right decision for his kids and not a decision for himself.

KFC

3,687 posts

130 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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I think home schooling your children is one of the most selfish things you could possibly do to them, assuming there wasn't any direct medical need for it.

If a kid is being bullied, deal with the problem. If you can't deal with the problem, move them to another school?

eltax91

9,866 posts

206 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
quotequote all
stuart313 said:
eldar said:
sdyson31 said:
no wonder why there are many teenage pregnancies
As in being lower now?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-31602417



You know it has to be warped if its the BBC. Simple question, are there more slags nowadays than there were in 1969? If yes then it's not falling is it.
Inaccurate. There could well be more slags, there probably are. But maybe more slags discovered contraception.

Edited by eltax91 on Friday 22 May 07:17

Hoofy

76,323 posts

282 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
quotequote all
eltax91 said:
Inaccurate. There could well be more slags, there probably are. But maybe more slags discovered contraception.

Edited by eltax91 on Friday 22 May 07:17
So if you found out your daughter was a slag but she was using contraception, would you be happy? biggrin

AJS-

15,366 posts

236 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
quotequote all
A lot of absolute rot talked about home schooling. I've met some very well adjusted home schooled people, and bythe same token very many people who went through large state schools and ended up very badly adjusted.

There is probably a good deal of selection bias as most people who choose to home school their children have very strong ideas about all sorts of things, and by definition are not "normal."

It is important to make sure they do interact with other children socially to develop those skills, but if I had the time and money it's definitely something I would consider.

Pistom

4,960 posts

159 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
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There are a lot of generalisations here and had I not had direct experience of a home schooler near me, I would agree with the comments of it being a route to socially inept adults and missed opportunities.

The only home schooler I know may be the exception but I believe the parents of this particular kid did an outstanding job and if you have the ability and the commitment, it can work well.

Without going into detail, the parents of this kid were not happy that the local school was giving their child the support he needed. They moved the child to an alternative school and this proved to be not much better. They didn't take the decision to home educate lightly but the mum gave up work and the child was taken out of school.

That was 12 years ago.

The kid didn't re-enter the formal education system until A levels and the tutors were amazed that his academic ability was outstanding. He is now in his penultimate year at university with predictions of a good degree.

As for socially, he is one of the nicest, well balanced youths I've had the pleasure of meeting. He's a real self starter, popular with girls and has lots of male friends too. He does all the social stuff that kids of that age do but what his mum really taught him was to think independently.

There is no saying how well he would have done had he spent more time in formal education in his early days but he does not appeared to have suffered from home ed.

I know I'm not good enough to home ed. kids but get it right and I don't think it is any worse than formal education where people are taught on mass.

From some of the teachers I've met in recent years, they shouldn't be allowed near kids, let alone teach them.

Zerotonine

1,171 posts

174 months

Friday 22nd May 2015
quotequote all
I thank the two teachers for coming on here and putting their points across. I think that it is good for perspective.
In regards to my boy, there are 45 ASD unit places in my local area, he has one, there are 2000+ children who require these slots.
In regards to bullying, he doesn't actually get bullied per se, but within the first term at Secondary school he has punched in the head with such force that not only did he require a quick trip to the hospital, he had to go on a spinal board as he had blood trickling out of his ear. Fortunately he recovered physically, but mentally he is now always on guard. This happened because he accidently stood on another student's foot. And this is also a highly rated school.
Did you know that when I arrived on the scene that day, the head of the ASD unit didn't tell the police (who were first on scene first aiders) that he has Aspergers, and that could be the reason why he was being very un-cooperative with any treatment? I had to tell them when I arrived, all she said was 'Is that important?' Um... Yes.

Back to the socialisation aspect. In my case, my boy has a T.A support throughout each lesson. That puts any dampers on forming any social relationships. Also, in some instances, i would regard that as forced association. I remember back when I was at school when there was group work where teachers would assign groups of students for projects, this quite often was with people who didn't have shared interests, or was unlikely to be with anyone who was likely to be friends with afterwards. I reckon it hasn't changed a great deal, but I will bow to your superior knowledge on this as you have current experience and I do not, I only have the word of my boy.

All decisions have been made with him a major part in them. He has been on all the visits to other home schoolers' houses, always been asked of his opinion, etc.
It is also our intention to send him to college at 14 for any catching up of bits we have missed, and for his GCSEs, there is excellent provision for this in my local area.

There is a long list of resources that we have available to him for his education, so do not worry there. In fact I can safely say that he has learned more not being at school than being there, life skills, cooking, use of English language, so on so forth. Any subjects that we cannot cover will be covered by private tutors. He has strong friendships with people which will also be encouraged not in a school setting.

As for all those english technical terms you mentioned Phil, I can honestly say I haven't even the beginning of a clue what you are talking about there. I was never taught any of that, and I went through the school system. I got a C in GCSE English too. However, my other half has a degree in English so I think ahe has it covered.

Once again, I do not think that home schooling is for everyone, but for some it is the only viable option. The problem is there is a stigma attached to it, but if the parents aren't lazy and are prepared to put the effort in, there is no reason why they cannot be successful people in the future.

I will leave this poem by Michael Rosen here, a famous children's author.

Guide to Education

You get education in schools.

To find out how much education you get,

the government gives you tests.

Before you do the tests

the government likes it if you are put on

different tables that show how well or badly

you are going to do in the tests.

The tests test whether they

have put you on the right table.

The tests test whether you know what you’re

supposed to know.

But

don’t try to get to know any old stuff like

‘What is earwax?’ or ‘how to make soup’.

The way to know things you’re supposed to know

is to do pretend tests.

When you do the pretend tests

you learn how to think in the way that tests

want you to think.

The more practice you do,

the more likely it is that you won’t make the mistake

of thinking in any other way other than in

the special test way of thinking.

Here’s an example:

The apples are growing on the tree.

What is growing on the tree?

If you say, ‘leaves’, you are wrong.

It’s no use you thinking that when apples are on a tree

there are usually leaves on the tree too.

There is only one answer. And that is ‘apples’.

All other answers are wrong.

If you are the kind of person that thinks ‘leaves’ is a

good answer, doing lots and lots and lots of practice tests

will get you to stop thinking that ‘leaves’ is a good answer.

Doing many, many practice tests will also make it

very likely that there won’t be time for you to go out

and have a look at an apple tree to see what else

grows on apple trees. Like ants. Or mistletoe.

Education is getting much better these days

because there is much more testing.

Remember, it’s ‘apples’ not ‘leaves’.

  • For the record, I have just copied and pasted this in. I apologise for any formatting issues. *