Marriage, How much is she worth?

[Ari]

PH5121 said:

If you are not willing to share your assets in addition to sharing your life with your spouse (whether male or female) you are married to the wrong person.

I think the issue most have isn't sharing their assets - it's the spouse keeping those assets should things not work out.

VERY different thing.

[Ari]

jshell said:

Ari said:

And you think that the kind of woman happy to cheat with a long term partner because she's not getting exactly what she wants will magically change into this chaste, faithful perfect spouse once the ring is on her finger?

Sorry mate but I've got news for you. Women (and men for that matter) who cheat are just people who cheat. They don't go through a character transformation as part of the ceremony.

I think the bold bit of my post covered he fact that it's not a catch-all situation.

However, I do believe that personal circumstances and emotional state can lead people to do things that they wouldn't ordinarily do.

I don't believe the absolute polarity exists that means there are cheaters/non-cheaters. People are affected by their own situation or position at any time of their life.

Exactly! Well done.

The kind of person that cheats because they're not getting their own way regarding a wedding will cheat once married because they're not getting enough attention/getting too much attention/not getting the new kitchen/car/pet/child they 'deserve'/because husband is working too hard/not working hard enough.

Ah, and for the record. If you really were shagging other people's partners with 'a choice few words' as you attest (rather than simply watching too much porn and believing in your head that it was real life) then you're an odorous little turd.

[Ari]

stargazer30 said:

@ C.A.R. - It seems there are two threads here all being mixed up under the Marriage banner.

Your thread financials - Your thinking is spot on. Try to get your debt down, use your new found salary to improve your families financial position. That really has nothing to do with marriage at all.

Your partners thread. Wants to be a full time mum, kids more important than a career, wants to be married and have a "special" wedding day. Nothing wrong with any of that either I'd say.

Marriage is about commitment first and fore most. Its a promise to love and cherish each other for life. Its not about the wedding day at all (regardless of what the media crams down young girls throats). Since you have kids with the lady, lets face it you already made a big commitment to her now anyway. So if you love her, why not marry her. If she wants to be a full time mum whilst the kids are young, I would not push her to go back to work full time. Her children are the most important thing in her life, you are now secondary. If she's smart she soon realize the best way to care for them is with the support of a good/happy husband so you'll be a very very close second!

Back on financials though, she can have the special day but not by taking on £7K debt. The people make it special really, not the fancy venue, honey moon etc... I'd pitch it to her along the lines of how you want to be with her, want to make the commitment ya de da, but having massive debt which will take (insert x amount of years/months) will only stop you giving your kids nice xmases etc.. Talking money facts with women never works, focus on the emotions and use a bit reverse psychology here! The one bit I would cave a bit on is the dress though, that IS a big deal. I'd set a wedding budget (£1K?), plan to save up the money needed and plan the date based on that target date.

Good luck!

Spot on advice.

[PH5121]

Ari said:

PH5121 said:

If you are not willing to share your assets in addition to sharing your life with your spouse (whether male or female) you are married to the wrong person.

I think the issue most have isn't sharing their assets - it's the spouse keeping those assets should things not work out.

VERY different thing.

I am lucky (so far) and admit I am naive having been in a relationship for 25 years, we started out as teenagers with nothing, got a house, had kids, and have both contributed to what we now have.

[C.A.R.]

Thanks once again, especially for the post above.

I'm summarising of course, rather than telling my life story - cos I think even I'd get bored reading that! But it is really refreshing to sit and read some home truths, even if some of the PH contingent are a little 'too honest'!

I think I'll sit her down and draw up a budget,really open her eyes as to what a wedding would cost and how long it would take to save the required sum of money -after having cleared the existing debt. That should at least give us both something to strive for - I think a lot of the problem right now is that there is no "master plan" regardless of setting a date for the big day.

Second interview takes place 9:30 in the morning so I'm off to bed!

[Ari]

C.A.R. said:

Second interview takes place 9:30 in the morning so I'm off to bed!

Good luck!

[Ari]

PH5121 said:

Ari said:

PH5121 said:

If you are not willing to share your assets in addition to sharing your life with your spouse (whether male or female) you are married to the wrong person.

I think the issue most have isn't sharing their assets - it's the spouse keeping those assets should things not work out.

VERY different thing.

I am lucky (so far) and admit I am naive having been in a relationship for 25 years, we started out as teenagers with nothing, got a house, had kids, and have both contributed to what we now have.

Excuse me copying and pasting a reply to a previous poster but I believe it is equally relevant.

Lets say the unthinkable happens, and your wife is no longer with us. A few years later, still pretty grief stricken you meet someone nice. She's got nothing, lives in a bedsit and has a min wage job but she's pretty, funny, cares about you. You maybe don't intend it but things develop and you find a glimmer of happiness and one day you think to yourself 'hey, be nice to be married again, I liked it before' and you pop the question.

Six months later you're married, a year after that you discover the new wife was only after your money and is shagging the (younger, fitter, better looking) gardener.

So you confront her, there are tears, she loves the gardener, there's no future for you and her. She leaves, moves in with the gardener.

How do you feel about her having half the financial comfort that you and your previous wife built up together? How do you feel about the kids of you and your first wife losing half their birthright - half the money that their mother and you created? Maybe they're still at school and have to come out of the private school that they enjoy so much because the woman dad was married to for a year is entitled to x hundred thousand pounds and dad has to find that to buy her out of their home.

What is your view on maintenance? You have no children with this woman but her solicitor says that she has an 'expectation of lifestyle'. Never mind that she had nothing two years ago, a rented bedsit and beans on toast for dinner. She's been married to a successful wealthy man, lived in a five bedroom house, drove a brand new Audi. Judge agrees, you've made a promise, you now need to keep her in a lifestyle. Because you were married.

What are your views on pensions? You've been prudent, you've made investments over many years, a comfortable retirement beckons - a well deserved life of golf, holidays and maybe a small yacht on the south coast. Or it did - her solicitor says half of that is hers now. Happy with that are you?

Presumably you're happy with all of it - the massive chunk of the money the mother of your kids and you built up that you are now forced to gift her. The lost legacy for your kids, the state school they're now in, the much reduced pension.

Because, in your own words - "If you are not willing to share your assets in addition to sharing your life with your spouse (whether male or female) you are married to the wrong person."

[anonymous-user]

I got married in 2003 (divorced this year!) and I was one of the last of our group of friends to get married. Over half of them are now divorced and one of them is now on his second marriage. At the time it seemed to turn into a female urinating contest, with each couple trying to outdo each other by spending more money and having more artsy wedding photos to prove they loved each other more than every other couple.

Obviously they were compensating for something and the couple who spent the most money were the ones that were divorced the quickest. Two couples who spent £25K - £30K on their weddings were divorced 5 years later.

I don't really understand how people go on about it being the best day of your life as I just found the organisation consumed a whole year of my life. It is a totally stressful day and I actually remember how relieved I felt as I drove home the next day knowing it was done.

Still not a patch on how stressful the divorce was though!!! ;-)

Wish I had just spent the money on a 993 Porsche 911 as it would have been far more enjoyable and would have been a far better investment.

[BrabusMog]

Two of my good friends were married and divorced before they hit 30. One had the flash UK wedding, the other flew a bunch of family and friends abroad for a lavish ceremony. But, for a bit of balance, whilst one may have had a cheating wife (nothing proven), they both definitely had their own issues as well - one nearly lost his house due to a massive gambling problem and was bailed out to the tune of 25k by his dad, the other had/has a bit of a problem with getting on the coke and going on a weekend bender. And, in this instance, I actually think it fair that they had to give up half of the assets/money as they both have kids and their wives definitely suffered.

[jshell]

Ari said:

The kind of person that cheats because they're not getting their own way regarding a wedding will cheat once married because they're not getting enough attention/getting too much attention/not getting the new kitchen/car/pet/child they 'deserve'/because husband is working too hard/not working hard enough.

Ah, and for the record. If you really were shagging other people's partners with 'a choice few words' as you attest (rather than simply watching too much porn and believing in your head that it was real life) then you're an odorous little turd.

Women don't spend their whole childhood planning the perfect kitchen. Many, many of them DO spend most of their childhood planning a perfect princess wedding... It seriously affects a lot of women who meet their near-perfect guy and he doesn't want to get married. It is a definite gap in many women's emotional needs, and you don't want to mess with an emotional woman... If they 'do something stupid' as a one-off, then it doesn't mean it'll be a repeat process.

Guess some guys get some, and some don't. Don't blame the guy though, he's just doing what guys do and playing the game...

Oh, and it's 'odious'!

[lord trumpton]

Ari said:

I think the issue most have isn't sharing their assets - it's the spouse keeping those assets should things not work out.

VERY different thing.

If one enters marriage with an eye on the possibility it may go bad and then who keeps the money then that's the wrong approach.

To me; this is where a lot of people go wrong. Its their understanding of the word commitment. If you commit to oneanother then that's it...its a commitment forever. You commit to follow the vows and you both commit everything you are and everything you have.

Its like putting a huge deposit on a car. If you change your mind then you lose the deposit. One would argue that if you changed your mind that you weren't 100% sure in the first place.

[Ari]

jshell said:

Guess some guys get some, and some don't. Don't blame the guy though, he's just doing what guys do and playing the game...

Yup, porn.

[Ari]

lord trumpton said:

If one enters marriage with an eye on the possibility it may go bad and then who keeps the money then that's the wrong approach.

To me; this is where a lot of people go wrong. Its their understanding of the word commitment. If you commit to oneanother then that's it...its a commitment forever. You commit to follow the vows and you both commit everything you are and everything you have.

Its like putting a huge deposit on a car. If you change your mind then you lose the deposit. One would argue that if you changed your mind that you weren't 100% sure in the first place.

And if it's a hugely expensive car, one worth half of everything you own, and you love it dearly and plan to keep it forever but one day you wake up and it's not on the drive any more..?

Your theory is lovely, and you're right, that is how exactly how it should be, of course it is.

Unfortunately there are plenty of men (one or two in this very thread if you have a read through) who will tell you that the lovey dovey roses round the cottage till death us do part schtick doesn't always work out quite like that...

Edited by Ari on Saturday 26th September 10:09

[rog007]

Captain Muppet said:

Realise it how? I had no previous divorce experience, and the legal representative of the government made no mention of it in either of our meetings or in any of the literature. In a world where there are warnings that coffee is hot I find it extremely weird that my house was put at risk without warning. It's the least transparent financial transaction of my life, and the third most expensive one too.

That's funny; never looked at it that way before.

[mikefacel]

lord trumpton said:

If one enters marriage with an eye on the possibility it may go bad and then who keeps the money then that's the wrong approach.

To me; this is where a lot of people go wrong. Its their understanding of the word commitment. If you commit to oneanother then that's it...its a commitment forever. You commit to follow the vows and you both commit everything you are and everything you have.

Its like putting a huge deposit on a car. If you change your mind then you lose the deposit. One would argue that if you changed your mind that you weren't 100% sure in the first place.

It's the car changing its mind that's the problem!! One partner can be 100% sure but has to trust that the other is too.

[lord trumpton]

mikefacel said:

lord trumpton said:

If one enters marriage with an eye on the possibility it may go bad and then who keeps the money then that's the wrong approach.

To me; this is where a lot of people go wrong. Its their understanding of the word commitment. If you commit to oneanother then that's it...its a commitment forever. You commit to follow the vows and you both commit everything you are and everything you have.

Its like putting a huge deposit on a car. If you change your mind then you lose the deposit. One would argue that if you changed your mind that you weren't 100% sure in the first place.

It's the car changing its mind that's the problem!! One partner can be 100% sure but has to trust that the other is too.

Bang on! Its all about trust, it underpins marriage.

There's no guarantees in life and marriage is no exception.

If you want a get out clause then don't get married. Stay as a partnership as the main difference in the grand scheme is little.

[TwigtheWonderkid]

mikefacel said:

lord trumpton said:

If one enters marriage with an eye on the possibility it may go bad and then who keeps the money then that's the wrong approach.

To me; this is where a lot of people go wrong. Its their understanding of the word commitment. If you commit to oneanother then that's it...its a commitment forever. You commit to follow the vows and you both commit everything you are and everything you have.

Its like putting a huge deposit on a car. If you change your mind then you lose the deposit. One would argue that if you changed your mind that you weren't 100% sure in the first place.

It's the car changing its mind that's the problem!! One partner can be 100% sure but has to trust that the other is too.

If you picked an unreliable car that let you down, well you picked it! Perhaps you should have had a longer test drive before making the deal.

[Impasse]

TwigtheWonderkid said:

If you picked an unreliable car that let you down, well you picked it! Perhaps you should have had a longer test drive before making the deal.

How long would you deem long enough? One year? Two years? Five? Ten? Longer?

[BrabusMog]

Impasse said:

TwigtheWonderkid said:

If you picked an unreliable car that let you down, well you picked it! Perhaps you should have had a longer test drive before making the deal.

How long would you deem long enough? One year? Two years? Five? Ten? Longer?

Just long enough to make sure she isn't going to do you over and steal half your cash.

[Impasse]

BrabusMog said:

Just long enough to make sure she isn't going to do you over and steal half your cash.

So get rid just before the marriage ceremony?