Would a decent air rifle kill a grey squirrel?

Would a decent air rifle kill a grey squirrel?

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mybrainhurts

90,809 posts

254 months

Monday 30th May 2016
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FlyingMeeces said:
eldar said:
bhstewie said:
I kind of get it in areas where there may be reds or real pest control issues, but I'm sure in most cases it's just killing stuff for the sake of it which is pretty messed up.
A neighbours cat appears to kill birds and rodents (and moles and squirrels) slowly and just for the fun of it, end enjoys leaving the twitching bodies all over the place.

But they are on the CITES list of invasive species, like grey squirrels, so that is OK cruelty?
Let's not get onto the responsibility of animal owners to ensure their pets don't cause harm, we've done that one before.

But no. Unnecessary cruelty isn't okay. Effecting the swift and painless dispatch of something causing harm, with the goal of ameliorating or preventing future harm, is neither unnecessary nor cruel. Which is why I keep saying, only as part of an eradication programme, otherwise it's utterly pointless and therefore not at all okay.
By killing one squirrel, you save countless birds. Why is that not ok?

FlyingMeeces

9,932 posts

210 months

Monday 30th May 2016
quotequote all
mybrainhurts said:
FlyingMeeces said:
eldar said:
bhstewie said:
I kind of get it in areas where there may be reds or real pest control issues, but I'm sure in most cases it's just killing stuff for the sake of it which is pretty messed up.
A neighbours cat appears to kill birds and rodents (and moles and squirrels) slowly and just for the fun of it, end enjoys leaving the twitching bodies all over the place.

But they are on the CITES list of invasive species, like grey squirrels, so that is OK cruelty?
Let's not get onto the responsibility of animal owners to ensure their pets don't cause harm, we've done that one before.

But no. Unnecessary cruelty isn't okay. Effecting the swift and painless dispatch of something causing harm, with the goal of ameliorating or preventing future harm, is neither unnecessary nor cruel. Which is why I keep saying, only as part of an eradication programme, otherwise it's utterly pointless and therefore not at all okay.
By killing one squirrel, you save countless birds. Why is that not ok?
Because you don't.

Squirrels produce more offspring than can naturally survive, pretty much every litter (all animals do this, it's not a vermin thing).

When you make a tiny dent in a very very high density population like that, the vacancy you create won't last weeks. There is literally a successor already queued up, a youngster or two or three that's going to survive the winter because you've just cleared a spot at the bird feeder for them.

It is utterly, totally pointless to shoot one or ten or a hundred grey squirrels unless the person next door, and the person next door to him, over an area of many square miles, is doing exactly the same thing.

If there's a sudden late season glut of food (because there's one or two fewer established adults eating it), some species will go into oestrus again and actually have a second litter that year in direct response.

Just don't bother. Seriously, waste of ammo, waste of everything. Bringing pine martens in might do it, though, did you see that great article about the effect martens have on grey squirrels?

bitchstewie

50,808 posts

209 months

Monday 30th May 2016
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mybrainhurts said:
By killing one squirrel, you save countless birds. Why is that not ok?
You can't simply kill with abandon anything that might eat something else.

Hedgehogs eat bird eggs as do various other wildlife, it's just nature.

Personally I'm not a fan of cats antics but I wouldn't seriously suggest it be legal to kill them.

If some of the guys on thread who want to hang out their window like the guy from Schindler's list picking off squirrels with an air rifle with a sniper scope simply said "I like killing stuff and living in the UK this is as close as I'll ever get to shooting a gun" I'd respect the honesty even if I disagreed with it.

The justifications are utterly ludicrous though.

FlyingMeeces

9,932 posts

210 months

Monday 30th May 2016
quotequote all
bhstewie said:
mybrainhurts said:
By killing one squirrel, you save countless birds. Why is that not ok?
You can't simply kill with abandon anything that might eat something else.

Hedgehogs eat bird eggs as do various other wildlife, it's just nature.

Personally I'm not a fan of cats antics but I wouldn't seriously suggest it be legal to kill them.

If some of the guys on thread who want to hang out their window like the guy from Schindler's list picking off squirrels with an air rifle with a sniper scope simply said "I like killing stuff and living in the UK this is as close as I'll ever get to shooting a gun" I'd respect the honesty even if I disagreed with it.

The justifications are utterly ludicrous though.
I don't like the thought of killing everything but I'm all for humans taking responsibility for limiting the impact of destructive invasive species. Which were, of course, all introduced by us. For stuff bigger than bunnies, things like spay/neuter programs start being effective and you have some options other than just removal (reducing the cat population in this country by, say, 25% would probably do more for wild birds than anything else I can think of).

Hedgehogs aren't invasive species and they play a pretty balanced role in a long established ecosystem. They aren't damaging the environment and their predation of eggs is fairly minimal when weighed against their predation of - well - everything else they can fit into their snouts. Nothing's in danger of going extinct due to hedgehogs.

CharlesdeGaulle

26,099 posts

179 months

Monday 30th May 2016
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As is often the way with PH threads, and invariably the way with discussion of animal control in the UK, the original question has got lost amongst peoples' own views on culling (although in fairness flying meeces was fairly balanced) and animal 'rights'.

The OP asked a specific question about killing squirrels. All those who felt that wading-in to tell him he shouldn't are hardly adding value, and the idiot that accused those of us who do kill vermin as being in it for the sexual pleasure might have been moderately amusing if he wasn't such a sanctimonius misguided prick.

Edited by CharlesdeGaulle on Monday 30th May 18:53

Tannedbaldhead

2,952 posts

131 months

Monday 30th May 2016
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CharlesdeGaulle said:
The OP asked a specific question about killing squirrels.
Edited by CharlesdeGaulle on Monday 30th May 18:53
Then yes.

I used to survey land-estates in NE England. It was an area where greys were starting to encroach on red territory. To deal with this estate staff would live-trap. Once in the trap the red squirrel would get a very good feed upping its fat content and giving it an edge for survival through the winter. Grey squirrels were dispatched by air-pistols. When they got shot they died.

Don1

15,936 posts

207 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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Personally I dispatch the greys to help the owls living in that tree.

What would the nay-sayers prefer? A happy, healthy pair of breeding tawny owls or an invasive species? You can't have both. Or is the knowledge that every kill results in a sexual frisson, too much to move past?

Tyre Smoke

Original Poster:

23,018 posts

260 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
CharlesdeGaulle said:
As is often the way with PH threads, and invariably the way with discussion of animal control in the UK, the original question has got lost amongst peoples' own views on culling (although in fairness flying meeces was fairly balanced) and animal 'rights'.

The OP asked a specific question about killing squirrels. All those who felt that wading-in to tell him he shouldn't are hardly adding value, and the idiot that accused those of us who do kill vermin as being in it for the sexual pleasure might have been moderately amusing if he wasn't such a sanctimonius misguided prick.

Edited by CharlesdeGaulle on Monday 30th May 18:53
Thank you. I haven't re-read my original post, but I believe it was either in that post or one soon after where I wasn't interested in the morals of whether I should or shouldn't shoot little furry animals.

Anyway. On Sunday I purchased a Cometa 300 0.22 which I am very pleased with. I also bought a SMK 3.9x40 sight but in my naiivety forgot the sight mounts which are on their way. However, the fixed sights are pretty good. For the record, no warm (or cold) blooded creatures have given their lives for the pleasure of me or my son.



S11Steve

6,374 posts

183 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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I think the phrase is "Proper Job". https://www.youtube.com/user/squirrelhuntertv

Hours of tree-rat culling on that channel, all with a dead-pan commentary.


julian64

14,317 posts

253 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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I recently started paying my teenage son a bounty for each dead rabbit he presents me with. I assume some peoples heads will explode at that.

Laurel Green

30,770 posts

231 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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Rabbit stew. yum

Timmy40

12,915 posts

197 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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Totally off topic, but I always pay attention to footprints left in soft areas of ground when I'm out walking around. A few weeks back I saw one I didn't recognise, too big for a rat, not a dog or a fox, we're too far from water for an otter. I've just put two and two together and checked the pic I took at the time on my phone versus ones on the web.

Pine Martin. Definitely.

Excellent thumbup my Grandad last saw one in the area and that was over 40 years ago since when they've been absent. Brilliant if they're back.

julian64

14,317 posts

253 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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Laurel Green said:
Rabbit stew. yum
And possibly a Davy Crocket hat

Laurel Green

30,770 posts

231 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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julian64 said:
Laurel Green said:
Rabbit stew. yum
And possibly a Davy Crocket hat
...and with all this global-warming we'll all need one soon. thumbup

julian64

14,317 posts

253 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
Laurel Green said:
julian64 said:
Laurel Green said:
Rabbit stew. yum
And possibly a Davy Crocket hat
...and with all this global-warming we'll all need one soon. thumbup
I get my son to kill rabbits to save both the flowers and chickens. How's that for ecology in action

sc0tt

18,032 posts

200 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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I killed around 50 clays on Sunday.

I decided to spare 20 of them.

Although them broke when they hit the floor.

Don1

15,936 posts

207 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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sc0tt said:
I killed around 50 clays on Sunday.

I decided to spare 20 of them.

Although them broke when they hit the floor.
Still haven't found a good recipe for them. Always too crunchy. And don't get me started on shooting craps....

Rawwr

22,722 posts

233 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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FlyingMeeces said:
I don't like the thought of killing everything but I'm all for humans taking responsibility for limiting the impact of destructive invasive species.
Is there some irony here?

FlyingMeeces

9,932 posts

210 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
quotequote all
Rawwr said:
FlyingMeeces said:
I don't like the thought of killing everything but I'm all for humans taking responsibility for limiting the impact of destructive invasive species.
Is there some irony here?
Not intentionally. paperbag

hairy

323 posts

239 months

Tuesday 31st May 2016
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Evanivitch said:
Magpies and crows are legal targets.
http://www.shootinguk.co.uk/guns/air-rifles/pest-c...
As are ring necked parakeets!