House purchase - garage was underpinned
Discussion
Hi All,
As title suggests, a house that i've put an offer on a 1930s house in the Greater London/Kent area.
Just been informed that the garage was underpinned circa 25 years ago.
On the viewings it was pointed out that the garage was a relatively recent addition but nothing was memtioned as to why.
It now appears to be the case that it may have replaced an older garage at the time the underpinning was done or it could have been partially rebuult at the time of underpinning.
The house is detached, dated (probate), and the garage is attached to the side of the house.
I'm concerned about whether this is something that could also affect the house and also whether it is sensible to continue with the purchase given that it may be difficult to re-sell in the future and also the insurance may be difficult/expensive to adequately cover.
FWIW I have a bank valuation survey booked (i think its next week) so I will onform them of this, and I was planning on getting a structural surveyor to do a structural survey afterwards anyway.
Am I mad proceeding and is there anything else that I should consider?
Cheers
As title suggests, a house that i've put an offer on a 1930s house in the Greater London/Kent area.
Just been informed that the garage was underpinned circa 25 years ago.
On the viewings it was pointed out that the garage was a relatively recent addition but nothing was memtioned as to why.
It now appears to be the case that it may have replaced an older garage at the time the underpinning was done or it could have been partially rebuult at the time of underpinning.
The house is detached, dated (probate), and the garage is attached to the side of the house.
I'm concerned about whether this is something that could also affect the house and also whether it is sensible to continue with the purchase given that it may be difficult to re-sell in the future and also the insurance may be difficult/expensive to adequately cover.
FWIW I have a bank valuation survey booked (i think its next week) so I will onform them of this, and I was planning on getting a structural surveyor to do a structural survey afterwards anyway.
Am I mad proceeding and is there anything else that I should consider?
Cheers
k called it a Bank Valuation Survey? It isn't. It's a valuation.My first property purchase was an underpinned place.
I had a copy of the full plans and engineer's report, and I kept the insurance with the prior supplier as it was then (no internet) difficult to find alternatives. When I sold the property the plans/paperwork were passed to the purchaser and they continued with the same insurers.
I'd ask for similar if faced with this again, and would have a full survey, too.
I had a copy of the full plans and engineer's report, and I kept the insurance with the prior supplier as it was then (no internet) difficult to find alternatives. When I sold the property the plans/paperwork were passed to the purchaser and they continued with the same insurers.
I'd ask for similar if faced with this again, and would have a full survey, too.
As you and others have said Insurance will probably be your greatest difficulty. I would have thought (caution not an expert opinion) that if you had a Structural Engineers report saying that the Underpinning has fixed the issue then it would be as good as a house that hadn't had an issue. Worth asking your prospective Insurer though to get the facts of the matter.
In terms of whether or not the garage will fall down and rip the side out of the house leaving you homeless (exaggeration mode). I would have thought that as it was done 25 years ago then any subsequent movement would show up as cracks in the walls? If there aren't any, or obvious signs of re-pointing, then it's probably stable now.
HTH
Bob
In terms of whether or not the garage will fall down and rip the side out of the house leaving you homeless (exaggeration mode). I would have thought that as it was done 25 years ago then any subsequent movement would show up as cracks in the walls? If there aren't any, or obvious signs of re-pointing, then it's probably stable now.
HTH
Bob
Insurance will be a real issue.
On all/most of the online sites, subsidence is one of the first questions they ask and if you answer yes they just decline.
The telephone operators don't seem to have any more latitude and just refer you to a specialist insurer.
It's a massive pain in the neck. Unless it's really cheap then I wouldn't.
On all/most of the online sites, subsidence is one of the first questions they ask and if you answer yes they just decline.
The telephone operators don't seem to have any more latitude and just refer you to a specialist insurer.
It's a massive pain in the neck. Unless it's really cheap then I wouldn't.
russ_a said:
Insurance won't be an issue, especially after 25 years. You could always knock the garage down and rebuild too.
We have a house that had a subsidence claim in the 80's and our insurance is about £300 a year.
A house we were interested in last year had suffered subsidence 12 years earlier to the detached garage. After consulting a structural engineer I enquired about either taking the garage down or rebuilding the affected wall with underpinning or piling but the specialist insurance underwriter I spoke to said it would make little difference to premiums. The buildings insurance quotes I got were well loaded on premium and excess.We have a house that had a subsidence claim in the 80's and our insurance is about £300 a year.
megaphone said:
OP how do you know the garage has suffered from subsidence? Is it documented anywhere? Who told you?
Thanks to everyone for responses thus far.The agent called on Thursday to chase on the valuation survey and then told me that the buyer had just, that morning, imformed them of underpinning and re-building of the garage.
That night I did a search if the local council building control notices and saw that, according to the coumcil, the garage was re-built, and the flank wall of the house was underpinned.
I then called the bank to let them know, ahead of the valuation survey which is scheduled for this coming week, have informed my solicitors who will be asking for further details and called the estate agent tot ell them that the seller may have forgotten to mention that the house was underpinned rather than the garage.
The agent then came back to me to confirm that I was right.
We have a structural surveyor that we have previoulsy used and we have lined him up for an inspection once we have comments/requests from the bank and also some firther detail from the seller.
I like the house, but what worries me is that I have ofered over the odds and outbid other potential buyers without being informed of all relevant information that Inshould consider ehen making an offer.
If I lose my job, or become ill and need to sell then this history will surely turn future prospective buyers off. That's what i'm worried about, along with restrictions for extensions and possible liability to neighbouring properties.
The owner has said, so far, that it was considered that a tree (subsequently removed) was a 'contributing' factor. This seems a bit vague to me and given the sellers have not been forthcoming with disclosure so far i've got reservations
From what you've said it sounds like the vendor knows the house was underpinned (& surely they'd have to declare it to get buildings insurance) and neglected to tell the estate agent (who would have to declare it if the vendor had told him). To me it sounds like the vendor is acting close to fraudulent to get max value for the house and agent hasn't been as diligent as they could in prepapring their details - did they even ask the vendor if it had suffered subsidence?
So in your shoes I'd have more than reservations, especially as I'd paid over the odds, I'd run a mile. If you really want the place I'd want a really good structural survey, a buildigns insurance quote and I'd have a plumber & electrician check the heating & electrics. Then I'd wait till the night before exchange and offer him 10% less.
So in your shoes I'd have more than reservations, especially as I'd paid over the odds, I'd run a mile. If you really want the place I'd want a really good structural survey, a buildigns insurance quote and I'd have a plumber & electrician check the heating & electrics. Then I'd wait till the night before exchange and offer him 10% less.
Fat hippo said:
The owner has said, so far, that it was considered that a tree (subsequently removed) was a 'contributing' factor. This seems a bit vague to me and given the sellers have not been forthcoming with disclosure so far i've got reservations
I walked away from the place I mentioned in my previous post. After speaking to neighbours it turned out a natural pond in the front garden had been filled in and a large willow had been cut down. I'd do some more research if I was you OP, what I found was enough to put me off any affected property that wasn't significantly under normal market value. Collectingbrass said:
From what you've said it sounds like the vendor knows the house was underpinned (& surely they'd have to declare it to get buildings insurance) and neglected to tell the estate agent (who would have to declare it if the vendor had told him). To me it sounds like the vendor is acting close to fraudulent to get max value for the house and agent hasn't been as diligent as they could in prepapring their details - did they even ask the vendor if it had suffered subsidence?
So in your shoes I'd have more than reservations, especially as I'd paid over the odds, I'd run a mile. If you really want the place I'd want a really good structural survey, a buildigns insurance quote and I'd have a plumber & electrician check the heating & electrics. Then I'd wait till the night before exchange and offer him 10% less.
He has to declare it anyway when he fills in the property information form (ta10??) which specifically asks if the property has been underpinned. So in your shoes I'd have more than reservations, especially as I'd paid over the odds, I'd run a mile. If you really want the place I'd want a really good structural survey, a buildigns insurance quote and I'd have a plumber & electrician check the heating & electrics. Then I'd wait till the night before exchange and offer him 10% less.
Considering this is one of the first things you do after you accept an offer, the seller is on a hiding to nothing trying to conceal it.
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