Upgrading lock cylinders
Discussion
I want to upgrade the standard lock cylinders on our 2 year old house to prevent the lock snapping stories the internet tells us about.
My niece can get Yale 1 star replacements for £23 plus £4.50 per key (not sure if "cheap") which puts it near Avocet ABS price territory I think.
Any views on which I should go for? I would prefer 1 key fits all locks if possible but quality and effectiveness is paramount.
My niece can get Yale 1 star replacements for £23 plus £4.50 per key (not sure if "cheap") which puts it near Avocet ABS price territory I think.
Any views on which I should go for? I would prefer 1 key fits all locks if possible but quality and effectiveness is paramount.
I'm happy with Cisa Astral cylinders bought from lockandkey.co.uk. You can get them keyed alike, add more cylinders later if required and a bonus is that you can leave a key fully inserted on the inside and still use a key on the outside - useful for those who sometimes forget to pull the key out on the inside before leaving home!
I was advised that to avoid risk of 'bumping' you need a lock with the availability of blank keys controlled. If any old body can get a key, that same person can make a bumping key for your lock. Registered blanks prevent this. I have a Wilka brand barrel that has registered blanks supplied by a locksmith in East Sussex I seem to recall. Bumping is in some ways worse than drilling or snapping because you have a problem proving that you were burgled to your insurer - no trace left on the barrel.
jshell said:
I bought the Avocet ABS, sized them exactly and single-keyed the 3 house doors. They've been flawless and being completely smooth, toothless keys don't catch on clothing. Strange thing is that 5p pieces stick to the magnets when I take them out of my pocket!
Same here - also found that modern coinage has some magnetic pieces! I also bought padlocks for the shed and garage in the keyed alike set.Had a locksmith here last week for a separate problem, he rated the Avocet highly/
You want PAS24 handles with whatever locks you buy for that added level of protection. I fit yale superior locks to my rental portfolio, I buy them keyed alike from eBay so you get 6 keys with them, with a hoppe PAS24 handle and have had no problems with any of them.
Normally pay about £10-15 a lock.
Normally pay about £10-15 a lock.
motco said:
I was advised that to avoid risk of 'bumping' you need a lock with the availability of blank keys controlled. If any old body can get a key, that same person can make a bumping key for your lock. Registered blanks prevent this. I have a Wilka brand barrel that has registered blanks supplied by a locksmith in East Sussex I seem to recall. Bumping is in some ways worse than drilling or snapping because you have a problem proving that you were burgled to your insurer - no trace left on the barrel.
From my admitedly incomplete knowledge of bumping I believe the technique only works on a normal/conventional key, the sort that looks like a tiny saw. As soon as there are lateral pins bumping no longer works.AW10 said:
motco said:
I was advised that to avoid risk of 'bumping' you need a lock with the availability of blank keys controlled. If any old body can get a key, that same person can make a bumping key for your lock. Registered blanks prevent this. I have a Wilka brand barrel that has registered blanks supplied by a locksmith in East Sussex I seem to recall. Bumping is in some ways worse than drilling or snapping because you have a problem proving that you were burgled to your insurer - no trace left on the barrel.
From my admitedly incomplete knowledge of bumping I believe the technique only works on a normal/conventional key, the sort that looks like a tiny saw. As soon as there are lateral pins bumping no longer works.MOBB said:
Any views on which I should go for?
Doubtless too late for the OP, but I'd probably go for Kaba pExtra Guard (Swiss quality) or maybe Mul-T-Lock BS TS007 3 Star Integrator. ABS Avocet is a relatively old design and a tool's now available to open these quickly.
AW10 said:
From my admitedly incomplete knowledge of bumping I believe the technique only works on a normal/conventional key, the sort that looks like a tiny saw.
I believe bumping can work on both normal and dimple keys. It works on any lock with pin tumblers, which includes most Yale-type door locks and uPVC door locks. However, the cylinders in these locks can very easily be upgraded to a bump-resistant cylinder. Also, I imagine drilling or snapping the lock are greater risks than bumping.AW10 said:
As soon as there are lateral pins bumping no longer works.
Not "lateral pins", but locks with a sidebar should resist bumping. Sidebars can be found in a select number of high-security lock cylinders.Edited by SVS on Sunday 20th November 18:16
Look at www.ukbumpkeys.com - there isn't much they can't get past, either by brute force, a pick gun (I have a Klum one and it beats 90% of locks), or practice and skill.
I'm a bit lacking in the "practice and skill" department - so I showed my mum how I could use a pick gun to open her euro cylinders in seconds.
She had them replaced, so I showed her how I could break in in less than 5 seconds with a cylinder snapper.
Now she has Avocet ones, at great expense (12 sets of doors in the house!) and I can't get near them.
Ask in the forum there, they are not into breaking into houses, they just like the challenge of picking a new lock.
They'll happily tell you what they can do with a screwdriver and a claw hammer, and what they can't do even with the best gear.
You do still have windows, though!
I'm a bit lacking in the "practice and skill" department - so I showed my mum how I could use a pick gun to open her euro cylinders in seconds.
She had them replaced, so I showed her how I could break in in less than 5 seconds with a cylinder snapper.
Now she has Avocet ones, at great expense (12 sets of doors in the house!) and I can't get near them.
Ask in the forum there, they are not into breaking into houses, they just like the challenge of picking a new lock.
They'll happily tell you what they can do with a screwdriver and a claw hammer, and what they can't do even with the best gear.
You do still have windows, though!
Ah, don't worry about it - soon both your keys and your wallet will both be implanted RFID chips in your thumb... then there will be a huge market in "anti-snap thumbs".
I have a mate in Australia who is a piercer/tattooist, and he doesn't have to swipe his card or phone to pay for things, just touches the card machine with his thumb. Freaks people out.
He says it was fairly painful, and now is working it's way out - but there are plenty of people working on ways to stop your body rejecting it.
Also know a mechanic in London who has a magnet implant in his index finger, both for fun and for holding on to nuts. Loves it, he can dip his finger into a tray of paperclips and come away with about 7 of them hanging off his finger. Good one for winning "bar bet money" - he can pick up a coin just by touching it!
I have a mate in Australia who is a piercer/tattooist, and he doesn't have to swipe his card or phone to pay for things, just touches the card machine with his thumb. Freaks people out.
He says it was fairly painful, and now is working it's way out - but there are plenty of people working on ways to stop your body rejecting it.
Also know a mechanic in London who has a magnet implant in his index finger, both for fun and for holding on to nuts. Loves it, he can dip his finger into a tray of paperclips and come away with about 7 of them hanging off his finger. Good one for winning "bar bet money" - he can pick up a coin just by touching it!
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