The reality of life for many MANY people.
Discussion
danllama said:
I know we've all read that or heard it before, but it makes me smile every time.
t for so many people.Thankyou4calling said:
I'd consider myself to be a relatively stereotypical pistonheader.
Powerfully built, company director, opinionated and into cars, property, watches and food.
I'm right of centre, a capitalist, a striver who wants to improve their lot.
Recently I sold a business and am moving house so in the interim I was delighted to secure a short term work contract managing the relocation of a business to new premises 17 miles away. I'm dealing with the planning, implementation, logistics, IT, utility and fixtures and fitting installations to make sure it's a seamless move and business continues.
D day is looming and so far so good.
I'm working with the directors, managers, supervisors but also hands on with the front line warehouse people. There are packers and sweepers and pickers etc and in talking with them I've really had my eyes opened to a society I knew little about.
The company employs a lot of agency workers, they work for minimum wage and have no contract.
They can and are told to go home at any time and contacted by text when they are needed again.
I know a lot of people are employed like this on zero hours contracts but to see it in its rawest form is quite enlightening.
I thought the people working like this would be wasters. Scruffy, unreliable, disinterested. COUNCIL!
The sort you wouldn't trust to tie a shoelace.
Far from it!
I'm going to generalise and I've only had limited dealings but the people doing this work aren't like that at all.
They live in the same towns as you and I but they don't talk about house prices and loft conversions, there lives couldn't be further from this.
Without exception they want to work and they work hard, the wages supplement their benefits and they live day to day, they are all ages, not many immigrants at all, mostly British.
While we on PH talk about Brexit, Heathrow expansion and the merits of DSG gearboxes, they know absolutely nothing about those things or craft beer, costa coffee, Holland and Barrett or waitrose.
It's not that they aren't interested, it's simply that all they care about is earning £50 a day as many days as they can to buy fags, a pint or pay off a pay day loan which they all have.
They all have rubbish phones, most don't have a car, they ride an old bone shaker or walk 2 or 3 miles to work. They aren't looking for a carbon fibre frame, if they get a puncture they are sunk.
If you ask how the weekend was there is no talk of a restaurant they went to or a nice walk or a show they enjoyed. They don't watch much TV surprisingly. No X factor and reality shows, they are on their play station, a lot of gaming.
None have any plans other than hoping they win the lottery (they all buy tickets) they don't scour the web for holidays or right move and they don't go shopping for clothes.
They wear what they have and eat rubbish. Fizzy drinks, crisps, chocolate just stuff that we might have as a snack is their staple food. No croissants, no pasta, no aged steak.
It's quite remarkable to me that there are so many like this in this one firm so I guess there are thousands in the UK.
They aren't scum, they aren't work shy, they are just people trying to keep their head above water.
When their day is done they put on an old jacket and walk home.
It's made me look at people differently, I don't know if it's good or bad but I didn't think about it much.
I don't know if it makes me feel better about myself or worse but it is interesting.
Politicians are always on about trying to help people back to work, these people are at work, they don't seem to have dreams, goals of much hope beyond what they're doing.
I'm not drawing any conclusions just writing my thought.
Haha. To me that reads like "Good grief, I've just discovered poor people. How quaint they are, with their imperfect cars and second rate mobile phones. I wonder if it's permitted to keep or hunt them?"Powerfully built, company director, opinionated and into cars, property, watches and food.
I'm right of centre, a capitalist, a striver who wants to improve their lot.
Recently I sold a business and am moving house so in the interim I was delighted to secure a short term work contract managing the relocation of a business to new premises 17 miles away. I'm dealing with the planning, implementation, logistics, IT, utility and fixtures and fitting installations to make sure it's a seamless move and business continues.
D day is looming and so far so good.
I'm working with the directors, managers, supervisors but also hands on with the front line warehouse people. There are packers and sweepers and pickers etc and in talking with them I've really had my eyes opened to a society I knew little about.
The company employs a lot of agency workers, they work for minimum wage and have no contract.
They can and are told to go home at any time and contacted by text when they are needed again.
I know a lot of people are employed like this on zero hours contracts but to see it in its rawest form is quite enlightening.
I thought the people working like this would be wasters. Scruffy, unreliable, disinterested. COUNCIL!
The sort you wouldn't trust to tie a shoelace.
Far from it!
I'm going to generalise and I've only had limited dealings but the people doing this work aren't like that at all.
They live in the same towns as you and I but they don't talk about house prices and loft conversions, there lives couldn't be further from this.
Without exception they want to work and they work hard, the wages supplement their benefits and they live day to day, they are all ages, not many immigrants at all, mostly British.
While we on PH talk about Brexit, Heathrow expansion and the merits of DSG gearboxes, they know absolutely nothing about those things or craft beer, costa coffee, Holland and Barrett or waitrose.
It's not that they aren't interested, it's simply that all they care about is earning £50 a day as many days as they can to buy fags, a pint or pay off a pay day loan which they all have.
They all have rubbish phones, most don't have a car, they ride an old bone shaker or walk 2 or 3 miles to work. They aren't looking for a carbon fibre frame, if they get a puncture they are sunk.
If you ask how the weekend was there is no talk of a restaurant they went to or a nice walk or a show they enjoyed. They don't watch much TV surprisingly. No X factor and reality shows, they are on their play station, a lot of gaming.
None have any plans other than hoping they win the lottery (they all buy tickets) they don't scour the web for holidays or right move and they don't go shopping for clothes.
They wear what they have and eat rubbish. Fizzy drinks, crisps, chocolate just stuff that we might have as a snack is their staple food. No croissants, no pasta, no aged steak.
It's quite remarkable to me that there are so many like this in this one firm so I guess there are thousands in the UK.
They aren't scum, they aren't work shy, they are just people trying to keep their head above water.
When their day is done they put on an old jacket and walk home.
It's made me look at people differently, I don't know if it's good or bad but I didn't think about it much.
I don't know if it makes me feel better about myself or worse but it is interesting.
Politicians are always on about trying to help people back to work, these people are at work, they don't seem to have dreams, goals of much hope beyond what they're doing.
I'm not drawing any conclusions just writing my thought.
Edited by Thankyou4calling on Wednesday 19th October 14:56
Edited by Thankyou4calling on Thursday 20th October 21:34
Crazy.
308mate said:
Haha. To me that reads like "Good grief, I've just discovered poor people. How quaint they are, with their imperfect cars and second rate mobile phones. I wonder if it's permitted to keep or hunt them?"
Crazy.
Nothing crazy about it. Perfectly easy to live in a bubble. Live in nice area. Drive nice car to work. Work with other people well off. Weekends is trips away or golf and no need to mix with poor. Easy to avoid povertyCrazy.
johnwilliams77 said:
308mate said:
Haha. To me that reads like "Good grief, I've just discovered poor people. How quaint they are, with their imperfect cars and second rate mobile phones. I wonder if it's permitted to keep or hunt them?"
Crazy.
Nothing crazy about it. Perfectly easy to live in a bubble. Live in nice area. Drive nice car to work. Work with other people well off. Weekends is trips away or golf and no need to mix with poor. Easy to avoid povertyCrazy.
Being from the 'shop floor' and still spending a lot of my time there, I think one thing the OP missed is just how much a lot of people want to get the working day done as quick as possible and get home to the kids. Forget working late, home for a quick kick about before it gets dark, go fishing, football practice, anything family.
Just enough £ to survive, time's more precious to a lot of people. Sometimes I have to agree with them.
Politicians just get don't seem to get it.
Just enough £ to survive, time's more precious to a lot of people. Sometimes I have to agree with them.
Politicians just get don't seem to get it.
"A tie is a noose, and inverted though it is, it will hang a man nonetheless if he's not careful"
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff. I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff. I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
johnwilliams77 said:
308mate said:
Haha. To me that reads like "Good grief, I've just discovered poor people. How quaint they are, with their imperfect cars and second rate mobile phones. I wonder if it's permitted to keep or hunt them?"
Crazy.
Nothing crazy about it. Perfectly easy to live in a bubble. Live in nice area. Drive nice car to work. Work with other people well off. Weekends is trips away or golf and no need to mix with poor. Easy to avoid povertyCrazy.
Are you saying me that a well off man can believe that who serve his dinner, who park his car, who clean his house, etc. can afford to live like him?
djc206 said:
"A tie is a noose, and inverted though it is, it will hang a man nonetheless if he's not careful"
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff.
This is very true, nobody can buy happiness. But, at least for me, a one week escape to Maui in mid-autumn, a nice drive, a great Barolo Vintage and many other things you can actually buy, can ease the pain.Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff.
djc206 said:
I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
It is not always so easy to spot happiness but according to my experience poor people can be exactly like wealthy ones, good and awful. matsoc said:
djc206 said:
"A tie is a noose, and inverted though it is, it will hang a man nonetheless if he's not careful"
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff.
This is very true, nobody can buy happiness. But, at least for me, a one week escape to Maui in mid-autumn, a nice drive, a great Barolo Vintage and many other things you can actually buy, can ease the pain.Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff.
djc206 said:
I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
It is not always so easy to spot happiness but according to my experience poor people can be exactly like wealthy ones, good and awful. I suppose I live in a bubble. I spend six months working here and earn a salary which comfortably places me in the 10th decile. Even the majority of the crew here are what one would describe as privileged. I live in the sticks, My wife is a stay at home parent and my children attend the best prep school in the region. Yet my father was dragged up in the slums of a Northern provincial town and (probably) only because of a stint in HM Forces managed later to provide a better standard of living for me and my brother. Social mobility is possible in this country despite what some politicians will have you believe. I agree it is not possible for everyone but with the right attitude the opportunities are there. I think a lot of people simply lack self confidence. There is a lot to be said for National Service in that respect.
djc206 said:
"A tie is a noose, and inverted though it is, it will hang a man nonetheless if he's not careful"
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff. I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff. I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
Yeah, sounds great doesn't it, tune in, turn on, dropout, stick it to the man.
Trouble is, as with all forms of parasitism, it only works if a small number sit around playing their guitars and having a beer and a spliff while everyone else gets on with working to provide all the stuff which is taken for granted, and I don't mean material stuff. Got toothache? Oh bugga, all the dentists have dropped out and gone fishing, better get the pliers out. Got stinking rubbish piling up and rats everywhere? Fek, all the bin men are stoned, better start digging a very large hole. Your kid got appendicitis? ............
Anyone who thinks that pre-industrial society was some kind of 'The Good Life' utopia is seriously deluded, apart from a privileged few, life was a living hell of disease, filth, starvation and misery.
Vizsla said:
djc206 said:
"A tie is a noose, and inverted though it is, it will hang a man nonetheless if he's not careful"
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff. I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff. I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
Yeah, sounds great doesn't it, tune in, turn on, dropout, stick it to the man.
Trouble is, as with all forms of parasitism, it only works if a small number sit around playing their guitars and having a beer and a spliff while everyone else gets on with working to provide all the stuff which is taken for granted, and I don't mean material stuff. Got toothache? Oh bugga, all the dentists have dropped out and gone fishing, better get the pliers out. Got stinking rubbish piling up and rats everywhere? Fek, all the bin men are stoned, better start digging a very large hole. Your kid got appendicitis? ............
Anyone who thinks that pre-industrial society was some kind of 'The Good Life' utopia is seriously deluded, apart from a privileged few, life was a living hell of disease, filth, starvation and misery.
Vizsla said:
Yeah, sounds great doesn't it, tune in, turn on, dropout, stick it to the man.
Trouble is, as with all forms of parasitism, it only works if a small number sit around playing their guitars and having a beer and a spliff while everyone else gets on with working to provide all the stuff which is taken for granted, and I don't mean material stuff. Got toothache? Oh bugga, all the dentists have dropped out and gone fishing, better get the pliers out. Got stinking rubbish piling up and rats everywhere? Fek, all the bin men are stoned, better start digging a very large hole. Your kid got appendicitis? ............
Anyone who thinks that pre-industrial society was some kind of 'The Good Life' utopia is seriously deluded, apart from a privileged few, life was a living hell of disease, filth, starvation and misery.
t. I'm merely suggesting that a work/life balance is to be struck and that many in this country are following the lead of the yanks and going the wrong way in search of material possessions and wealth they have no opportunity to spend.djc206 said:
Vizsla said:
Yeah, sounds great doesn't it, tune in, turn on, dropout, stick it to the man.
Trouble is, as with all forms of parasitism, it only works if a small number sit around playing their guitars and having a beer and a spliff while everyone else gets on with working to provide all the stuff which is taken for granted, and I don't mean material stuff. Got toothache? Oh bugga, all the dentists have dropped out and gone fishing, better get the pliers out. Got stinking rubbish piling up and rats everywhere? Fek, all the bin men are stoned, better start digging a very large hole. Your kid got appendicitis? ............
Anyone who thinks that pre-industrial society was some kind of 'The Good Life' utopia is seriously deluded, apart from a privileged few, life was a living hell of disease, filth, starvation and misery.
t. I'm merely suggesting that a work/life balance is to be struck and that many in this country are following the lead of the yanks and going the wrong way in search of material possessions and wealth they have no opportunity to spend.matsoc said:
djc206 said:
"A tie is a noose, and inverted though it is, it will hang a man nonetheless if he's not careful"
Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff.
This is very true, nobody can buy happiness. But, at least for me, a one week escape to Maui in mid-autumn, a nice drive, a great Barolo Vintage and many other things you can actually buy, can ease the pain.Life is for living not working, I can't think of anything more pointless that working 12 hours a day for 40 years to acquire stuff.
djc206 said:
I've never known anyone really rich but of the moderately wealthy people I know none are any happier than the poor people I've known and know.
It is not always so easy to spot happiness but according to my experience poor people can be exactly like wealthy ones, good and awful. My neighbours haven't been on holiday for years, the bloke of the house leaves at 6am most mornings and doesn't return until 7pm most evenings. That's not a life. But it's ok because they have a £500k house, an Audi and a BMW.....
danllama said:
I think it's a good point, one of the best in this thread. Every time I'm out drinking with my boss I'll try to persuade him to change our working hours to a four day week. I think having a third day off really makes a huge difference to morale and attitude. He hasn't agreed yet. The sooner I'm my own boss the better.
Ha good luck with that. The Swedes are reducing their working days because they reckon long hours don't mean high productivity, you could try that approach?Gassing Station | The Lounge | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff