Conspiracy theorists... are they all just a bit thick?
Discussion
deckster said:
This is the clever bit. You get to decide yourself! Yes, that's right: each and every one of us can decide who we trust and who we don't!
And if i provided a link that told you that a fact checking service was run by the guy who ran CNN for twenty years and therefore has a left wing bias 'you' would just tell me the article has not been fact checked, or is taken out of context somehow. If i fact checked it with a source that verified it you would fact check it with a source that does not verify it. The whole fact checking thing is a bit of a red herring and just provides another layer of 'told you so' that may or may not be accurate.
(ADDED)
Take facebooks 'independent fact checkers' as an example. Who pays them?
Obviously facebook pays them.
My decorator is an independent decorator but i am paying him, so guess who decides what colour paint he uses when he is painting MY house.
Edited by Shuvi McTupya on Thursday 24th December 10:23
Shuvi McTupya said:
deckster said:
This is the clever bit. You get to decide yourself! Yes, that's right: each and every one of us can decide who we trust and who we don't!
And if i provided a link that told you that a fact checking service was run by the guy who ran CNN for twenty years and therefore has a left wing bias 'you' would just tell me the article has not been fact checked, or is taken out of context somehow. If i fact checked it with a source that verified it you would fact check it with a source that does not verify it. The whole fact checking thing is a bit of a red herring and just provides another layer of 'told you so' that may or may not be accurate.
If all their sources were biased too then you'd have a point, but again, they provide their sources so you can determine the bias yourself
Perhaps it should be renamed to "A source provision service allowing you to verify the claims yourself" than 'fact checking' but I think that "fact check" is somewhat more succint, and I'd expect those with the intelligence to use a fact checking site would also have the intelligence to recognise significant biases in the sources too.
As you're questioning these fact check services, can you provide any examples of where a founder's perceived bias has influenced the sources used or 'facts' presented?
Shuvi loves a conspiracy theory - we had a chat on a 911 thread a good while ago. You can debate him, but you won’t change his mind any more than he’ll change yours... Such is the way of Internet forums. 
At least you’re both being civil, and (to his credit) Shuvi has always been polite when addressed politely.
At least you’re both being civil, and (to his credit) Shuvi has always been polite when addressed politely.
feef said:
It depends..
If all their sources were biased too then you'd have a point, but again, they provide their sources so you can determine the bias yourself
Perhaps it should be renamed to "A source provision service allowing you to verify the claims yourself" than 'fact checking' but I think that "fact check" is somewhat more succint, and I'd expect those with the intelligence to use a fact checking site would also have the intelligence to recognise significant biases in the sources too.
As you're questioning these fact check services, can you provide any examples of where a founder's perceived bias has influenced the sources used or 'facts' presented?
I don't need to provide sources for you, you can test it yourself.If all their sources were biased too then you'd have a point, but again, they provide their sources so you can determine the bias yourself
Perhaps it should be renamed to "A source provision service allowing you to verify the claims yourself" than 'fact checking' but I think that "fact check" is somewhat more succint, and I'd expect those with the intelligence to use a fact checking site would also have the intelligence to recognise significant biases in the sources too.
As you're questioning these fact check services, can you provide any examples of where a founder's perceived bias has influenced the sources used or 'facts' presented?
Find a news story about how Joe Bidens son is 'dodgy' and link to it on FB, it will probably be fact checked and you will be informed the story is wrong.
Then do the same with a news story about how Donald Trumps son is 'dodgy' and you will find no such fact checking will occur.
As far as I am aware neither of the two sons has yet to found guilty in a court so who are these fact checkers to tell you which story is true? All they can do is link to their media partners (more financial backscratching) to confirm their particular views.
Maybe this whole subject needs its own thread, my views have already seen me banned from Political discussions on PH so I will not be participating in it
I have made the point I was trying to make and I Don't want to get banned from this bit of PH for discussing stuff that is of little interest to other posters for 60 pages So that's enough from me, for now.
DanL said:
Shuvi loves a conspiracy theory - we had a chat on a 911 thread a good while ago. You can debate him, but you won’t change his mind any more than he’ll change yours... Such is the way of Internet forums.
At least you’re both being civil, and (to his credit) Shuvi has always been polite when addressed politely.
Thank you. I do try At least you’re both being civil, and (to his credit) Shuvi has always been polite when addressed politely.
By the way, that wasn't me, that was Hedders!
If we ignored social media and only read articles by proper journalists the world would be a very different place right now.
The disinformation issue is made darker by some ‘agents’ knowingly spreading lies to further their agenda and this magnifies the issue as it adds to the delusions of those individuals already spreading the lies out of their own ignorance.
The disinformation issue is made darker by some ‘agents’ knowingly spreading lies to further their agenda and this magnifies the issue as it adds to the delusions of those individuals already spreading the lies out of their own ignorance.
Shuvi McTupya said:
And if i provided a link that told you that a fact checking service was run by the guy who ran CNN for twenty years and therefore has a left wing bias 'you' would just tell me the article has not been fact checked, or is taken out of context somehow. If i fact checked it with a source that verified it you would fact check it with a source that does not verify it.
The whole fact checking thing is a bit of a red herring and just provides another layer of 'told you so' that may or may not be accurate.
(ADDED)
Take facebooks 'independent fact checkers' as an example. Who pays them?
Obviously facebook pays them.
My decorator is an independent decorator but i am paying him, so guess who decides what colour paint he uses when he is painting MY house.
T**** still lost the election.The whole fact checking thing is a bit of a red herring and just provides another layer of 'told you so' that may or may not be accurate.
(ADDED)
Take facebooks 'independent fact checkers' as an example. Who pays them?
Obviously facebook pays them.
My decorator is an independent decorator but i am paying him, so guess who decides what colour paint he uses when he is painting MY house.
Edited by Shuvi McTupya on Thursday 24th December 10:23
HTH
DanL said:
Shuvi McTupya said:
Thank you. I do try
By the way, that wasn't me, that was Hedders!
It was?! Huh - I must be getting old. By the way, that wasn't me, that was Hedders!
Hedders on the other hand only made it to about 40 yrs old if I remember correctly.
Shuvi is older, but, depending on who you ask, not necessarily wiser
V6 Pushfit said:
If we ignored social media and only read articles by proper journalists the world would be a very different place right now.
The disinformation issue is made darker by some ‘agents’ knowingly spreading lies to further their agenda and this magnifies the issue as it adds to the delusions of those individuals already spreading the lies out of their own ignorance.
I agree. The disinformation issue is made darker by some ‘agents’ knowingly spreading lies to further their agenda and this magnifies the issue as it adds to the delusions of those individuals already spreading the lies out of their own ignorance.
Maybe we should leave it at that
Trouble is with these people is causes this sort of thing
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-55399513
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-55399513
If there's anything we can take from all this, its:
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not all opinions are equal. Take a topic like vaccines. The professor of contagious diseases with 45 years experience in the field has an opinion, and so does Vera who works in Greggs. I am interested in what the professor has to say. Vera, less so; there's 24 Chelsea buns out the back need icing sweetheart, so crack on with that and let the grown ups talk.
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but no one is entitled to their own facts.
People who say we should respect the opinions of others are idiots. All opinions do not deserve respect. They deserve tolerance, and no more. I shouldn't be punching a holocaust denier or young Earth creationist in the face, but I'm entitled to think they are a stupid
, and to tell them so.
Those are my opinions. I will not be offended if people disagree. And even if I am offended, so what. Just because I'm offended doesn't make me right, and no one has the right to go thru life without being offended anyway.
We worry far to much about giving people's opinions respect when they don't deserve any, and we worry about offending people when they deserve to be offended.
If you don't want your opinions ridiculed, then stop believing ridiculous stuff.
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not all opinions are equal. Take a topic like vaccines. The professor of contagious diseases with 45 years experience in the field has an opinion, and so does Vera who works in Greggs. I am interested in what the professor has to say. Vera, less so; there's 24 Chelsea buns out the back need icing sweetheart, so crack on with that and let the grown ups talk.
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but no one is entitled to their own facts.
People who say we should respect the opinions of others are idiots. All opinions do not deserve respect. They deserve tolerance, and no more. I shouldn't be punching a holocaust denier or young Earth creationist in the face, but I'm entitled to think they are a stupid
, and to tell them so. Those are my opinions. I will not be offended if people disagree. And even if I am offended, so what. Just because I'm offended doesn't make me right, and no one has the right to go thru life without being offended anyway.
We worry far to much about giving people's opinions respect when they don't deserve any, and we worry about offending people when they deserve to be offended.
If you don't want your opinions ridiculed, then stop believing ridiculous stuff.
CanAm said:
I don’t mind the Flat Earthers, as they do no harm, .
I couldn't agree less. The biggest single problem on the planet today is people believing st that isn't true. That's the root cause of nearly all of our difficulties. Anyone who believes st that isn't true is a contributor. TwigtheWonderkid said:
I couldn't agree less. The biggest single problem on the planet today is people believing st that isn't true. That's the root cause of nearly all of our difficulties. Anyone who believes st that isn't true is a contributor.
Exactly t that isn't true. That's the root cause of nearly all of our difficulties. Anyone who believes st that isn't true is a contributor. That article I link to in my previous post is about Bath council caving into people who believe 5g is harmful with no proof.
As it complies to the regulations the objectors should have to prove otherwise.
Try having a bit of fun. I sometimes tell a story to some people but fill it out with what appears to be scientific or other facts. If they aren’t of a scientific background you can get away with bending the theories or applying ones to suit your fun story. Speak in a calm, calculated way with a serious face ( laughing gives the game away). They know my background in science so it seems plausible. I always let them off the hook at the end though. Often with some outlandish comment that makes it clear I was winding them up.
ThatGuyWhoDoesStuff said:
Here's a real life one. We should put him in a zoo. A wonderful example of human stupidity.
You can forgive being misled, or making a mistake. The problem with most conspiracy theorists, as well as this guy above - is that the issue can be resolved by spending 4 seconds typing something into Google. Then when presented with the evidence, instead of making apologies and slinking away into their embarrassment they double down. How exactly do you propose this woman confirms to you that she's not dead? Make a video and post it on PH where she addresses you directly and shows her bank statements from the past 3 months?
I'm amazed anyone gets anything done with people like this walking among us.
Custard. If it's good enough for Jason Plato...You can forgive being misled, or making a mistake. The problem with most conspiracy theorists, as well as this guy above - is that the issue can be resolved by spending 4 seconds typing something into Google. Then when presented with the evidence, instead of making apologies and slinking away into their embarrassment they double down. How exactly do you propose this woman confirms to you that she's not dead? Make a video and post it on PH where she addresses you directly and shows her bank statements from the past 3 months?
I'm amazed anyone gets anything done with people like this walking among us.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
If there's anything we can take from all this, its:
Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not all opinions are equal. Take a topic like vaccines. The professor of contagious diseases with 45 years experience in the field has an opinion, and so does Vera who works in Greggs. I am interested in what the professor has to say. Vera, less so; there's 24 Chelsea buns out the back need icing sweetheart, so crack on with that and let the grown ups talk.
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but no one is entitled to their own facts.
People who say we should respect the opinions of others are idiots. All opinions do not deserve respect. They deserve tolerance, and no more. I shouldn't be punching a holocaust denier or young Earth creationist in the face, but I'm entitled to think they are a stupid, and to tell them so.
Those are my opinions. I will not be offended if people disagree. And even if I am offended, so what. Just because I'm offended doesn't make me right, and no one has the right to go thru life without being offended anyway.
We worry far to much about giving people's opinions respect when they don't deserve any, and we worry about offending people when they deserve to be offended.
If you don't want your opinions ridiculed, then stop believing ridiculous stuff.
Yeah but...didn't Sarah Palin say that dinosaurs existed just before Jesus? And she ran for US VP. Also, she's on FB and Twitter. Surely that's more important than "so called facts"?Everyone is entitled to an opinion, but not all opinions are equal. Take a topic like vaccines. The professor of contagious diseases with 45 years experience in the field has an opinion, and so does Vera who works in Greggs. I am interested in what the professor has to say. Vera, less so; there's 24 Chelsea buns out the back need icing sweetheart, so crack on with that and let the grown ups talk.
Everybody is entitled to their own opinion, but no one is entitled to their own facts.
People who say we should respect the opinions of others are idiots. All opinions do not deserve respect. They deserve tolerance, and no more. I shouldn't be punching a holocaust denier or young Earth creationist in the face, but I'm entitled to think they are a stupid
, and to tell them so. Those are my opinions. I will not be offended if people disagree. And even if I am offended, so what. Just because I'm offended doesn't make me right, and no one has the right to go thru life without being offended anyway.
We worry far to much about giving people's opinions respect when they don't deserve any, and we worry about offending people when they deserve to be offended.
If you don't want your opinions ridiculed, then stop believing ridiculous stuff.
No??
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