14yr old- flash point over him living on his PlayStation

[Sway]

Bluevanman said:

Sway said:

It does seem exceedingly strange that society would end up deciding it didn't want to routinely beat their children in order to gain total subservience...

There's a middle ground between beating them and letting them do whatever they want.

Indeed, which is why no one is saying 'crack on and let him do whatever he wants'.

Thrashing with a leather belt though? Hmm. Don't think not being a fan of that idea is "society going soft".

[Bluevanman]

Sway said:

Indeed, which is why no one is saying 'crack on and let him do whatever he wants'.

Thrashing with a leather belt though? Hmm. Don't think not being a fan of that idea is "society going soft".

I certainly believe society has gone soft, everyone is overly sensitive,hate crime because someone believes differently to you,kids brought up to believe they can be anything they want, we've all seen reports in the tabloids of kids going to the police because mum took their playstation off them.There was a time when dad ruled the house with an iron fist,kids knew if they stepped out of line mum would say 'just wait til I tell your father when he gets in from work ' and you'd be crapping yourself .
We've gone too far to the 'soft' side if you ask me, society as a whole,not just parenting.Discipline doesn't really seem to be a thing these days, you've got gangs of youths terrorising shopkeepers and the police are ineffective.
Anyway rant over, back to the thread if both parents aren't singing from the same hymn sheet you're pissing in the wind

[DSLiverpool]

As we’re waiting on the police for the 3rd time this Easter I’d love all your issues.

At lease the end is near.

[YorkshireStu]

goldieandblackie said:

In the 1970s he would have been thrashed with a leather belt and told to go to his room and the teachers at school where just as bad pulling your hair and slapping you, ask me how I know.

Seems today society has gone in completely the opposite direction and now far too soft and wishing to best friends with their kids.

Growing up in South Africa, I remember that the Police could discipline kids who got out of hand but who were not overtly criminal: 6 of the best with a very nasty stick that left marks. Not common but the fear factor kept a lot of kids in check.

I was caned at school a few times over the years for various things; usually fighting bullies who picked on me to breaking point.

My Dad was a fan of the leather belt when I was very young. As a teen it was whatever he could throw at me; bricks, tennis racquets etc.

I have a great relationship with him now though and friends with an ex-school teacher who regularly caught me with a half cricket bat he whacked us with as hard as he could if we were late for his class - it was great fun actually, diving into the room trying to avoid the bat. Hurt if he connected though.

My ex and I never resorted to corporal punishment for my step-kids and neither did my sisters with nieces and nephews and they all turned out just great so alternatives do exist. There is no need to resort to corporal punishment - it simply shows a severe lack of imagination and isn't guaranteed to be effective.

[havoc]

YorkshireStu said:

My ex and I never resorted to corporal punishment for my step-kids and neither did my sisters with nieces and nephews and they all turned out just great so alternatives do exist. There is no need to resort to corporal punishment - it simply shows a severe lack of imagination and isn't guaranteed to be effective.

[Howitzer]

My son recently turned 10 and the difference between his friends was very obvious. It was the first time he had a party (bowling) where every parent dropped them off and picked them up later.

1 had his own phone and I ended up asking him to put it away, he then joined in and was a nice lad.
The rest of them were the sports lot and the gamer lot. My son doesn’t do team sports he does martial arts, he also likes switch games and his friends are split roughly half and half.

The sports lot were more active and relaxed, they were getting involved in their teams bowling etc.
his gaming buddies were all
Fidgeting and losing interest as soon as they had bowled, it was quite strange to see as inevitably you compare your child to others.

Me and the wife both agreed to less screen time unless there is some learning involved. There is some excellent stuff out there which is good for grown ups too and directing him to something different has genuinely made a difference in him.

If he had played a game for a few hours, watched the internet or telly and couldn’t tell me what he had been watching or talk about it, he no longer watches it. I don’t want a zombie or avid time waster in the house. He didn’t like it at first but now it’s the new norm and as I remind him when he needs a chat, I’m his Dad first and his friend second. I do stuff that makes me feel bad but know it’s for a good reason and he understands this.

If his hobby really is gaming then why not try and get his friends round to do it together on a weekend. They still get to do what they want but with some more social sides to it. Giving up for an easy life is just hurting the son/daughter.

Dave!

[coldel]

Sway said:

Bluevanman said:

Sway said:

It does seem exceedingly strange that society would end up deciding it didn't want to routinely beat their children in order to gain total subservience...

There's a middle ground between beating them and letting them do whatever they want.

Indeed, which is why no one is saying 'crack on and let him do whatever he wants'.

Thrashing with a leather belt though? Hmm. Don't think not being a fan of that idea is "society going soft".

I mean its pretty obvious that its not about people going soft, its about the fact that thousands of cases of child abuse were conveniently hidden behind 'a clip round the ear' excuse and things had to change.

[vaud]

coldel said:

I mean its pretty obvious that its not about people going soft, its about the fact that thousands of cases of child abuse were conveniently hidden behind 'a clip round the ear' excuse and things had to change.

Indeed. You can have discipline without violence.

[plenty]

Howitzer said:

If his hobby really is gaming then why not try and get his friends round to do it together on a weekend. They still get to do what they want but with some more social sides to it. Giving up for an easy life is just hurting the son/daughter.

I have to say that this strikes me as a rather old-fashioned view of gaming. Online gaming can be an extremely social activity. My eldest ran a Minecraft server from the ages of 12-15, then was active in the Destiny community. Through this he met people from all over the world that he still keeps in touch with years later and some of which he has met in person both in the UK and overseas. He also learned a lot about social dynamics through his involvement in gaming communities. And he found a serious girlfriend via online gaming although they've since split up.

Obviously it's good to have some balance i.e. see people face to face as well as online, but automatically seeing gaming as non-social basically just shows you're from another generation.

[otolith]

Howitzer said:

The sports lot were more active and relaxed, they were getting involved in their teams bowling etc.
his gaming buddies were all
Fidgeting and losing interest as soon as they had bowled, it was quite strange to see as inevitably you compare your child to others.

Cause, though, or effect?

[StuTheGrouch]

JQ said:

Pit Pony said:

ruggedscotty said:

I remember a few years ago (This isnt new) friend got concerned about use of computer and playing of games etc...

curtailed this locked up computer and generally brought in control. Didnt go down well....

14 year old son gets angry about change in computer use.... says you will be sorry to father....

Friend comes home, daughter comes in and says seen your car.... ?

he looks out and sees son standing with tin of white paint, and paint running off of car....

Goes out, just as well son is faster than father as there would have been a murder. Anyways turns out son standing there with tin of dulux's best white paint had put some dairy cream over the car, and sent in the sister....

Grounded, and no computer / consoles for 3 months from that. Think the son learned about actions have consequences....

Son should have been given a medal. Brilliant work. Shows great imagination and creativity. But also a understanding of the boundaries you shouldn't cross ice creme okay, paint not okay

Indeed, my son would have got a high five for getting one over on me and bringing humour into the situation. He'd still have been made to clean it up though.

Seriously? If my kid did anything like that to my car there would be no consoles until they left home!

[Sycamore]

StuTheGrouch said:

Seriously? If my kid did anything like that to my car there would be no consoles until they left home!

For putting cream on it? Living up to your username there

[StuTheGrouch]

Sycamore said:

For putting cream on it? Living up to your username there

Damn right I'm being grouchy about it! fking cream getting into all the gaps, vents etc. Disrespectful little bd putting cream on my car.

Puts me in a bad mood just thinking about the very unlikely situation of it happening!

[JQ]

StuTheGrouch said:

Sycamore said:

For putting cream on it? Living up to your username there

Damn right I'm being grouchy about it! fking cream getting into all the gaps, vents etc. Disrespectful little bd putting cream on my car.

Puts me in a bad mood just thinking about the very unlikely situation of it happening!

This would be the child that will have at some point shat, pissed and puked in my car at some point or another. In the greater scheme of raising a child a bit of cream on the paintwork of my car wouldn't even register. Do you have kids?

[okgo]

plenty said:

I have to say that this strikes me as a rather old-fashioned view of gaming. Online gaming can be an extremely social activity. My eldest ran a Minecraft server from the ages of 12-15, then was active in the Destiny community. Through this he met people from all over the world that he still keeps in touch with years later and some of which he has met in person both in the UK and overseas. He also learned a lot about social dynamics through his involvement in gaming communities. And he found a serious girlfriend via online gaming although they've since split up.

Obviously it's good to have some balance i.e. see people face to face as well as online, but automatically seeing gaming as non-social basically just shows you're from another generation.

All of that existed 20 years ago too. It was a waste of time then, and mostly still is now IMO - possibly with the exception of the more building based games, which I did used to enjoy but weren't as interesting as FPS in a multiplayer sense.

My brother and I clocked up hundreds of (maybe even over 1000) on Counter Strike, I ran a server and had a ventrilo too etc - I was playing well into the night, it ate into everything and at the end of the day, was a waste of time. Apart from I can recognise the "go go go" when its dubbed into something else my son may be watching on Youtube!

Ultimately its probably quite tough to get kids to do what you want, in the end I signed up to my own broadband contract to get round it all, but I was probably given too much rope by my parents.

[StuTheGrouch]

JQ said:

This would be the child that will have at some point shat, pissed and puked in my car at some point or another. In the greater scheme of raising a child a bit of cream on the paintwork of my car wouldn't even register. Do you have kids?

Yes, I have two. Fortunately they are respectful of belongings and property (though one has a bomb site of a bedroom) and are, on the whole, very well behaved kids and have a fantastic relationship with both of them.

The bodily fluids are an accident. Accidents happen. Chucking a load of cream over a car isn't an accident. You do not mess with someone's vehicle.

[Mr.Chips]

StuTheGrouch said:

JQ said:

This would be the child that will have at some point shat, pissed and puked in my car at some point or another. In the greater scheme of raising a child a bit of cream on the paintwork of my car wouldn't even register. Do you have kids?

Yes, I have two. Fortunately they are respectful of belongings and property (though one has a bomb site of a bedroom) and are, on the whole, very well behaved kids and have a fantastic relationship with both of them.

The bodily fluids are an accident. Accidents happen. Chucking a load of cream over a car isn't an accident. You do not mess with someone's vehicle.

True PH response!

[plenty]

okgo said:

It was a waste of time then, and mostly still is now IMO

You could plausibly argue that the gaming itself wasn't especially productive or useful. But you've have to also agree that competitive rowing (which my son did) and competitive karting (which he now does) are also a 'waste of time'. I mean, rowing a boat and driving a kart aren't exactly crucial skills for modern life.

I believe that gaming helped my son be more social, not less. He learned to be very comfortable dealing with all kinds of people, including people from different backgrounds and cultures. He learned how to thrive in group settings, and navigate human emotions and factions (his time as a community moderator was especially valuable for this). He made many friends from it. He talks about how his time as a Minecraft mod gave him experiences relevant to being the president of his university's motorsport society, a role he holds today.

[okgo]

plenty said:

You could plausibly argue that the gaming itself wasn't especially productive or useful. But you've have to also agree that competitive rowing (which my son did) and competitive karting (which he now does) are also a 'waste of time'. I mean, rowing a boat and driving a kart aren't exactly crucial skills for modern life.

I believe that gaming helped my son be more social, not less. He learned to be very comfortable dealing with all kinds of people, including people from different backgrounds and cultures. He learned how to thrive in group settings, and navigate human emotions and factions (his time as a community moderator was especially valuable for this). He made many friends from it. He talks about how his time as a Minecraft mod gave him experiences relevant to being the president of his university's motorsport society, a role he holds today.

Suspect when he is my age, he'll look back and wished he kept up the rowing or karting more than the computer games.

If you can't see that competitive sport/team sport even at lower levels gives you everything (and some actually benefit to your body and mind in a chemical sense) you've written in the second paragraph then I doubt we'll agree.

Through my 20's I spent hundreds of hours road cycling to a decent level competitively, it was FAR more productive in every possible way to my life than the hours I spent sat at my computer.

[vaud]

okgo said:

Suspect when he is my age, he'll look back and wished he kept up the rowing or karting more than the computer games.

If you can't see that competitive sport/team sport even at lower levels gives you everything (and some actually benefit to your body and mind in a chemical sense) you've written in the second paragraph then I doubt we'll agree.

Through my 20's I spent hundreds of hours road cycling to a decent level competitively, it was FAR more productive in every possible way to my life than the hours I spent sat at my computer.

Can we maybe agree that

a) everyone is different
b) moderation is key for most passions

My daughter does jujitsu and plays hockey - both training and tournaments. After either (especially a hockey tournament which are in the cold, outside and playing 6-9 matches) she might like to curl up a read comics and play a bit of minecraft. I'm fine with that balance.