LSD/Steady state exercise
Discussion
This is probably how concepts in broscience develop but I've been thinking about my experiences and observations of different types of exercise and the effects they have on fat burning.
Now, looking at Olympic athletes who participate in marathons and long bicycle races, and indeed, anyone who takes their training seriously, they are certainly not fat in any way, often sporting lean, muscular bodies with the obligatory six pack. But these people probably run at least 70miles a week or cycle 120miles a week.
And going back to my personal experiences, whenever I have resorted to reasonable levels of steady state exercise (because I don't have the time that the above-mentioned athletes have), I'll probably only do around 40 miles a week of cycling (and I never run) and this has resulted in my body not getting leaner and in fact often starting to store fat (the body getting used to the exercise?). And as soon as I drop the mileage/time put in but resort to HIIT, the fat just melts away.
So, my broscience conclusion for long term fat avoidance - either do HIIT or very long steady state exercise.
You could even do HIIT training with a discus. Discuss.
Afterthought: I suspect that steady state competitors also train in sprinting for the final part of the race... which lends support to the notion that HIIT is important for remaining lean.
Afterthought 2: Do not read this as "if you want to lose weight, don't do LSD" - any exercise is better than sitting on the couch. The issue would be "How soon will you hit the plateau if you don't do massive amounts of LSD?"
Now, looking at Olympic athletes who participate in marathons and long bicycle races, and indeed, anyone who takes their training seriously, they are certainly not fat in any way, often sporting lean, muscular bodies with the obligatory six pack. But these people probably run at least 70miles a week or cycle 120miles a week.
And going back to my personal experiences, whenever I have resorted to reasonable levels of steady state exercise (because I don't have the time that the above-mentioned athletes have), I'll probably only do around 40 miles a week of cycling (and I never run) and this has resulted in my body not getting leaner and in fact often starting to store fat (the body getting used to the exercise?). And as soon as I drop the mileage/time put in but resort to HIIT, the fat just melts away.
So, my broscience conclusion for long term fat avoidance - either do HIIT or very long steady state exercise.
You could even do HIIT training with a discus. Discuss.
Afterthought: I suspect that steady state competitors also train in sprinting for the final part of the race... which lends support to the notion that HIIT is important for remaining lean.
Afterthought 2: Do not read this as "if you want to lose weight, don't do LSD" - any exercise is better than sitting on the couch. The issue would be "How soon will you hit the plateau if you don't do massive amounts of LSD?"
Edited by Hoofy on Monday 27th August 12:42
Ah ha!
6. Do Cardio. Don’t Over-Do It. If you’re overweight, you can sometimes get away with very low calorie diets without adverse consequences if you’re not doing tons of cardio on top of it. Endurance athletes get away with high volume training because they provide ample amounts of food to fuel it (man, those guys can EAT!) Dieters and physique competitors on the other hand, often semi-starve themselves while doing huge amounts of cardio at the same time. Exercise research says that extreme amounts of cardio during a diet can actually cause the same type of adaptive metabolic downshift as eating too little food. Fitness and figure competitors have been known to do 2 or even 3 hours of cardio a day before competitions. This kind of overtraining can be counter-productive when you look at the metabolic damage and “cardio dependency” potential. And remember, if you’re not diligent, you can out-eat almost any amount of exercise. If you’re doing upwards of an hour of cardio a day and not seeing significant fat loss, you’d better take a close look at your diet first before you rush to add more cardio.
http://www.ironmagazine.com/2011/metabolic-damage-...
6. Do Cardio. Don’t Over-Do It. If you’re overweight, you can sometimes get away with very low calorie diets without adverse consequences if you’re not doing tons of cardio on top of it. Endurance athletes get away with high volume training because they provide ample amounts of food to fuel it (man, those guys can EAT!) Dieters and physique competitors on the other hand, often semi-starve themselves while doing huge amounts of cardio at the same time. Exercise research says that extreme amounts of cardio during a diet can actually cause the same type of adaptive metabolic downshift as eating too little food. Fitness and figure competitors have been known to do 2 or even 3 hours of cardio a day before competitions. This kind of overtraining can be counter-productive when you look at the metabolic damage and “cardio dependency” potential. And remember, if you’re not diligent, you can out-eat almost any amount of exercise. If you’re doing upwards of an hour of cardio a day and not seeing significant fat loss, you’d better take a close look at your diet first before you rush to add more cardio.
http://www.ironmagazine.com/2011/metabolic-damage-...
I think the difference here is the target. Endurance athletes tend to train for a performance target, not a weight or bodyfat %age or image target. The lean, low bodyfat %age build of most endurance athletes is a side effect of the volume and intensity of training they put in to compete at national and international levels. I get the impression that a lot of people consider the image as the target but don't class themselves as endurance athletes so can't commit to the training levels of the performance-driven athletes. Most of the endurance athletes I know eat a LOT. Diet is more a case of ingesting enough fuel to recover from sessions and power the next sessions, rather than limiting the intake to achieve weight loss.
On the cardio vs speed/intervals/anaerobic conversation, my running coach's rule of thumb is that about 80% of my weekly mileage should be easy/steady (so pure cardio), with the remaining 20% or so tempo/threshold (i.e. right at the top of my current aerobic capability) and faster (so anaerobic work, hill reps, intervals etc). Then you add in core conditioning and flexibility work of course.
On the cardio vs speed/intervals/anaerobic conversation, my running coach's rule of thumb is that about 80% of my weekly mileage should be easy/steady (so pure cardio), with the remaining 20% or so tempo/threshold (i.e. right at the top of my current aerobic capability) and faster (so anaerobic work, hill reps, intervals etc). Then you add in core conditioning and flexibility work of course.
ewenm said:
I think the difference here is the target. Endurance athletes tend to train for a performance target, not a weight or bodyfat %age or image target. The lean, low bodyfat %age build of most endurance athletes is a side effect of the volume and intensity of training they put in to compete at national and international levels. I get the impression that a lot of people consider the image as the target but don't class themselves as endurance athletes so can't commit to the training levels of the performance-driven athletes. Most of the endurance athletes I know eat a LOT. Diet is more a case of ingesting enough fuel to recover from sessions and power the next sessions, rather than limiting the intake to achieve weight loss.
On the cardio vs speed/intervals/anaerobic conversation, my running coach's rule of thumb is that about 80% of my weekly mileage should be easy/steady (so pure cardio), with the remaining 20% or so tempo/threshold (i.e. right at the top of my current aerobic capability) and faster (so anaerobic work, hill reps, intervals etc). Then you add in core conditioning and flexibility work of course.
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Either train properly to compete (which involves a lot of time and effort) or do something else. What kind of competitions do you compete in and how many miles do you run a week?On the cardio vs speed/intervals/anaerobic conversation, my running coach's rule of thumb is that about 80% of my weekly mileage should be easy/steady (so pure cardio), with the remaining 20% or so tempo/threshold (i.e. right at the top of my current aerobic capability) and faster (so anaerobic work, hill reps, intervals etc). Then you add in core conditioning and flexibility work of course.
Hoofy said:
Yeah, that's what I was thinking. Either train properly to compete (which involves a lot of time and effort) or do something else. What kind of competitions do you compete in and how many miles do you run a week?
Now? Very little 
(coming back from injury and priorities change after becoming a parent).In the past I've competed on track at everything from 1500m upwards, and on the road and XC at anything up to 20 miles, plus pacemaking a GB international woman in a marathon. Competition level everything from local races/leagues to UK championships.
When taking it seriously, I was doing between 80 and 100 miles a week running which was about as much as I could fit round a full time job. If away on training camps that would increase to about 120 mpw.
Hoofy said:
Halb said:
Hoofy said:
So, my broscience conclusion for long term fat avoidance - either do HIIT or very long steady state exercise.
Avoiding insulin spikes would be best I reckon.
Yip.A big stick used in medieval battles.
ewenm said:
Now? Very little (coming back from injury and priorities change after becoming a parent).
In the past I've competed on track at everything from 1500m upwards, and on the road and XC at anything up to 20 miles, plus pacemaking a GB international woman in a marathon. Competition level everything from local races/leagues to UK championships.
When taking it seriously, I was doing between 80 and 100 miles a week running which was about as much as I could fit round a full time job. If away on training camps that would increase to about 120 mpw.
Ouch. So more than I guestimated but what I expected (ie lots more than most people can deal with). (coming back from injury and priorities change after becoming a parent).In the past I've competed on track at everything from 1500m upwards, and on the road and XC at anything up to 20 miles, plus pacemaking a GB international woman in a marathon. Competition level everything from local races/leagues to UK championships.
When taking it seriously, I was doing between 80 and 100 miles a week running which was about as much as I could fit round a full time job. If away on training camps that would increase to about 120 mpw.
Hoofy said:
Ouch. So more than I guestimated but what I expected (ie lots more than most people can deal with).
The volume of training that results in the lean, low bodyfat shape isn't something you can just decide to start doing. It takes a lot of gradual build up to be "comfortable" at those training volumes, so obviously isn't something everyone can do (time, motivation, injury etc).ewenm said:
The volume of training that results in the lean, low bodyfat shape isn't something you can just decide to start doing. It takes a lot of gradual build up to be "comfortable" at those training volumes, so obviously isn't something everyone can do (time, motivation, injury etc).Sadly, too many people think that if they run a reasonable amount (eg 3 miles every other day), they will get lean like Farah.
LordGrover said:
Surely just one of the many ways to skin this furry feline though?
Plenty of fit (in appearance) fitness models and body builders who do very little in the way of CV exercise.
Sure. I am comparing cardio types, though. It appears that there are ways of skinning the cat and losing a finger, though!Plenty of fit (in appearance) fitness models and body builders who do very little in the way of CV exercise.
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