PH 2014 Goals, Progress & Transformations Thread

[pilchardthecat]

smiffy180 said:

I'd be interested to see how bodybuilder like I could get naturally. I know I'm not anywhere near peak muscle yet and without being big headed I'm huge
I like food too much to bother though
(Carries on eating curry and chips)

How much of it is fat though? i was a smidge over 200lbs not so long ago, i'm now 3 stone lighter, a good deal smaller but just as strong

People dont realise how much of their "mass" is actually fat- and its not just under the skin. Intra-muscular fat is significant- i can put an inch on my biceps by putting on 5-10 lbs

If you want to know how much muscle you really have, you need to get to 7-8% body fat

[Vladimir]

I'm a bit under 10% and have trained all of my adult life. I'm not very heavy but can manage my bodyweight pretty well. I like to thing of myself as an R500. Except uglier.

[TheJimi]

Vladimir said:

I'm a bit under 10% and have trained all of my adult life. I'm not very heavy but can manage my bodyweight pretty well. I like to thing of myself as an R500. Except uglier.

I read "R500" as "RS500" and though "Jaysus, must be one ugly f*cker!"

[smiffy180]

pilchardthecat said:

How much of it is fat though? i was a smidge over 200lbs not so long ago, i'm now 3 stone lighter, a good deal smaller but just as strong

People dont realise how much of their "mass" is actually fat- and its not just under the skin. Intra-muscular fat is significant- i can put an inch on my biceps by putting on 5-10 lbs

If you want to know how much muscle you really have, you need to get to 7-8% body fat

25-30, was 30 last time I used calipers but leaned up a little. If I say 30 and work out my bw at 10% bf I would weigh 264lbs, a tad under 19 stone.

[pilchardthecat]

smiffy180 said:

pilchardthecat said:

How much of it is fat though? i was a smidge over 200lbs not so long ago, i'm now 3 stone lighter, a good deal smaller but just as strong

People dont realise how much of their "mass" is actually fat- and its not just under the skin. Intra-muscular fat is significant- i can put an inch on my biceps by putting on 5-10 lbs

If you want to know how much muscle you really have, you need to get to 7-8% body fat

25-30, was 30 last time I used calipers but leaned up a little. If I say 30 and work out my bw at 10% bf I would weigh 264lbs, a tad under 19 stone.

I think you should do it.

There are probably only a handful of people on earth that have that much lean mass without taking steroids. To the circus with you, you freak!

[theshrew]

I want to up my cardio a bit so have less time for the weights to fit in before work.

So thought stronglifts was a good program to try nice and simple and doesnt take a great deal of time.

Had my first crack at it this morning. I dont feel like ive really had a workout apart from the cardio side.

Anyone else done it ? Worth sticking with or try something else ?

[pilchardthecat]

theshrew said:

I want to up my cardio a bit so have less time for the weights to fit in before work.

So thought stronglifts was a good program to try nice and simple and doesnt take a great deal of time.

Had my first crack at it this morning. I dont feel like ive really had a workout apart from the cardio side.

Anyone else done it ? Worth sticking with or try something else ?

It's a beginner's strength program - very good if you are in the first 18 months of weight training. 90% of the benefits will be neurological adaptations and muscle fibre activation. Dont get hung up on the absence of "pump" though.

If you've been doing strength training more than 18 months i would find a different one though

[TheJimi]

pilchardthecat said:

smiffy180 said:

pilchardthecat said:

How much of it is fat though? i was a smidge over 200lbs not so long ago, i'm now 3 stone lighter, a good deal smaller but just as strong

People dont realise how much of their "mass" is actually fat- and its not just under the skin. Intra-muscular fat is significant- i can put an inch on my biceps by putting on 5-10 lbs

If you want to know how much muscle you really have, you need to get to 7-8% body fat

25-30, was 30 last time I used calipers but leaned up a little. If I say 30 and work out my bw at 10% bf I would weigh 264lbs, a tad under 19 stone.

I think you should do it.

There are probably only a handful of people on earth that have that much lean mass without taking steroids. To the circus with you, you freak!

I agree. If the stats above are accurate, then that is very impressive indeed.

[Halb]

Losing the fat and keeping the muscle is a different story though.


For those interested in 5x5, there is a good adapter in the wiki for advanced lifters.

[pilchardthecat]

Halb said:

Losing the fat and keeping the muscle is a different story though.

I disagree - most people just arent aware that at say 20% body fat, a substantial part of their muscle "size" is actually intra-muscular fat. So when they lose fat they get smaller and moan about losing muscle. In reality all that's happening is they are going from a marbled steak to a fillet

Biceps at 20% body fat



Biceps at 7% body fat



The amount of muscle fibres lost is a very very small percentage

[smiffy180]

TheJimi said:

pilchardthecat said:

smiffy180 said:

pilchardthecat said:

How much of it is fat though? i was a smidge over 200lbs not so long ago, i'm now 3 stone lighter, a good deal smaller but just as strong

People dont realise how much of their "mass" is actually fat- and its not just under the skin. Intra-muscular fat is significant- i can put an inch on my biceps by putting on 5-10 lbs

If you want to know how much muscle you really have, you need to get to 7-8% body fat

25-30, was 30 last time I used calipers but leaned up a little. If I say 30 and work out my bw at 10% bf I would weigh 264lbs, a tad under 19 stone.

I think you should do it.

There are probably only a handful of people on earth that have that much lean mass without taking steroids. To the circus with you, you freak!

I agree. If the stats above are accurate, then that is very impressive indeed.

After I've finished with strongman I'll lean up, I'm going to try anyway at the same time but the process will obviously be a lot slower

[theshrew]

We need to get this thread made sticky.

PS whats happend to Lee ? Not seen him post for a zillion years

[HonestIago]

Hoofy suggested I take our shoulder training discussion here...

Hoofy said:

HonestIago said:

Seriously, if you care about long term shoulder health you will bin the lateral raises and upright rows. Upright rows have to be one of the worst gym exercises people do IMO. Lateral raises are not as terrible but I find I get clicking/pain from them. Front raises are rather pointless so long as you are DB/BB Benching in some shape or form.

You'd be much better served by simply focusing on getting stronger in the bread and butter pressing exercises. If you can bash out ten reps with the 40kg DBs on shoulder press you will have decent shoulder development! Any benefits to muscle gain from doing the extra stuff you mention are FAR outweighed by the injury risks.

Not arguing but why do BBers do higher rep with lower weight?

Also, AnonSS mentioned I should do more lateral raises for shoulder development.

(PS Shall we take this to the Transformation 2014 thread?)

Higher reps with lighter weights induce hypertrophy that's why...but Bodybuilders are all chemically assisted and can get much more from this type of training than a natty. I sometimes think people often fail to realise just how differently one needs to train to get optimal growth as a natural lifter.

I'm not saying lateral raises will not help shoulder development, just that the benefit over and above simple pressing, in a natural lifter, is somewhat questionable. If interested I will detail how I train which I think works well in terms of gaining size/strength AND staying injury free.

[Hoofy]

HonestIago said:

Higher reps with lighter weights induce hypertrophy that's why...but Bodybuilders are all chemically assisted and can get much more from this type of training than a natty. I sometimes think people often fail to realise just how differently one needs to train to get optimal growth as a natural lifter.

I'm not saying lateral raises will not help shoulder development, just that the benefit over and above simple pressing, in a natural lifter, is somewhat questionable. If interested I will detail how I train which I think works well in terms of gaining size/strength AND staying injury free.

Please do. I'm all for avoiding injury. Had far too many from climbing.

[theshrew]

Hoofy said:

Please do. I'm all for avoiding injury. Had far too many from climbing.

I will 2nd that its always nice to learn + my shoulder gets pain sometimes.

[HonestIago]

Hoofy said:

HonestIago said:

Higher reps with lighter weights induce hypertrophy that's why...but Bodybuilders are all chemically assisted and can get much more from this type of training than a natty. I sometimes think people often fail to realise just how differently one needs to train to get optimal growth as a natural lifter.

I'm not saying lateral raises will not help shoulder development, just that the benefit over and above simple pressing, in a natural lifter, is somewhat questionable. If interested I will detail how I train which I think works well in terms of gaining size/strength AND staying injury free.

Please do. I'm all for avoiding injury. Had far too many from climbing.

Example upper body day (done every 3-5 days):

BB Bench Press
2 working sets

Seated DB Press
2 working sets (far easier to build strength in higher rep ranges with these, I do 10-20 normally)

Pullups
either 2-3 sets of BW x 20-25 spread between my pressing OR 1 set BW and 4-5 sets weighted

DB Row
2-3 heavy sets per side OR some horizontal machine pulldowns

I finish with a circuit of normally 2-3 sets of:
-light CG bench (focusing on TUT)
-curl variation
-rear delt flys

Very seldom I will add another curl variation and do some light squeezy rope pushdowns.

For lower body I do:
-back squat/paused BS
-Deadlift
-SLDL
-Glute Ham Raise (weighted)

...and the odd set of knee raises for abs.

Basically: frequency trumps volume and progression in the main compounds rules all else as a measure of progress.

[pilchardthecat]

Deadlifts + high volume = injury waiting to happen IMO

[HonestIago]

pilchardthecat said:

Deadlifts + high volume = injury waiting to happen IMO

I only DL/SLDL every other lower session.

Lower 1:
Back Squat

Lower 2:
Paused Back Squat (only 3x3 usually)
DL
SL DL

[pilchardthecat]

HonestIago said:

pilchardthecat said:

Deadlifts + high volume = injury waiting to happen IMO

I only DL/SLDL every other lower session.

Lower 1:
Back Squat

Lower 2:
Paused Back Squat (only 3x3 usually)
DL
SL DL

Cool - the rules are definitely different for deads in my experience. They are weird lifts - i've even skipped them for 4 weeks and then come straight back and got a PB.... very odd

[HonestIago]

pilchardthecat said:

Cool - the rules are definitely different for deads in my experience. They are weird lifts - i've even skipped them for 4 weeks and then come straight back and got a PB.... very odd

I should have clarified that frequency > volume for smaller upper body muscle groups. I wouldn't suggest ever DLing more than once a week.

That said, I find deads fall off a cliff if I don't train them consistently.