Discussion
V8mate said:
For all those who plateau, get bored easily, like to mix things up a bit etc, I offer this suggestion*.
It's not based on any kind of science, and I don't promise you untold riches or that you'll be more attractive to women.... it's just something that has 'felt right' to me, after a couple of years of using 5x5 as part of my weight training during that time.
1. Do 5x5 for 4-6 weeks. Only do it for less than 6 weeks if you hit an absolute wall though, otherwise see the 6 weeks through.
2. Lets say your stats at that point are:
Bench - 80kg
Squat - 90kg
Dead - 100kg
BOR - 60kg
OHP - 50kg
(It doesn't matter what they are; I use these figures illustratively)
3. For 2 weeks, do the same exercises, but in a 'hypertrophic' way. This could look like:
Bench - 15 x 50kg; 12 x 60kg; 10 x 70kg
Squat - 12 x 60kg; 10 x 70kg; 8 x 80kg
Dead - 10 x 60kg; 8 x 80kg (just two sets; you'll be doing just one under 5x5)
BOR - 3 x 10 x 50kg
OHP - 3 x 8 x 40kg
4. You'll note that they don't all follow the same pattern of starting number and step down, but these have 'felt right' for me.
5. If you fail in a set, quickly re-rack, drop 5-10kg, and continue the set.
6. Always finish the set, even if you end up with just an empty bar!
7. After the two weeks - and I wouldn't necessarily bother increasing the weight in the second week, just let your first week experience guide you - return to 5x5 at the next step you were due to have done. If you were failing, that may mean the stage you were failing at.
8. Do add accessory lifts/pulls into sessions if you have time/energy etc. This is about properly pushing the muscles to exhaustion. The first time I did it, after several months of 5x5, I found that I had remarkably poor endurance strength. But the muscles quickly switched to lapping it up. Looks great in the mirror too; #GetSwole
*This suggestion may or may not be good for you. Other exercise regimes are available.
Gave this a go today as I was running short on time, and doing squats on monday ripped some skin off where the bar sits on my left shoulder so it's painful with heavy weights sat on it. It's not based on any kind of science, and I don't promise you untold riches or that you'll be more attractive to women.... it's just something that has 'felt right' to me, after a couple of years of using 5x5 as part of my weight training during that time.
1. Do 5x5 for 4-6 weeks. Only do it for less than 6 weeks if you hit an absolute wall though, otherwise see the 6 weeks through.
2. Lets say your stats at that point are:
Bench - 80kg
Squat - 90kg
Dead - 100kg
BOR - 60kg
OHP - 50kg
(It doesn't matter what they are; I use these figures illustratively)
3. For 2 weeks, do the same exercises, but in a 'hypertrophic' way. This could look like:
Bench - 15 x 50kg; 12 x 60kg; 10 x 70kg
Squat - 12 x 60kg; 10 x 70kg; 8 x 80kg
Dead - 10 x 60kg; 8 x 80kg (just two sets; you'll be doing just one under 5x5)
BOR - 3 x 10 x 50kg
OHP - 3 x 8 x 40kg
4. You'll note that they don't all follow the same pattern of starting number and step down, but these have 'felt right' for me.
5. If you fail in a set, quickly re-rack, drop 5-10kg, and continue the set.
6. Always finish the set, even if you end up with just an empty bar!
7. After the two weeks - and I wouldn't necessarily bother increasing the weight in the second week, just let your first week experience guide you - return to 5x5 at the next step you were due to have done. If you were failing, that may mean the stage you were failing at.
8. Do add accessory lifts/pulls into sessions if you have time/energy etc. This is about properly pushing the muscles to exhaustion. The first time I did it, after several months of 5x5, I found that I had remarkably poor endurance strength. But the muscles quickly switched to lapping it up. Looks great in the mirror too; #GetSwole
*This suggestion may or may not be good for you. Other exercise regimes are available.
12 x 60kg, 10x 70kg squat (currently on 2nd attempt at 90kg 3x5)
10 x 2 40kg bench (52.5kg on 5x5)
5 x 32kg row (dumbell bench rows, my form is shocking with pendlay rows) and then 10 x 2 24kg
10 x 2 22.5kg lying tricep extension
Also, couple of form check videos if you don't mind, today's 2nd set of squats (10x70kg).
https://youtu.be/-jY9pi7gLZ0
My back looks a little rounded at the bottom but I think it's just the angle, getting a more rear facing angle would mean my water bottle/phone sat out in the middle of the floor
sorry for the light in the way, the below video has better placement.And then Monday's 90kg, 3rd set - only managed 4 and had to reset after 3 reps as the bar was slipping a little (and to have a little breather!). I know my form isn't great when I'm lifting at my limit, I tend to come forward a bit and my hips come up faster then my chest/head, any suggestions? Bear in mind I'm doing low bar squats so my back will be flatter than high bar squats.
https://youtu.be/gGP0xWQG-gA
Edited by Tall_Paul on Wednesday 10th August 10:46
So having seen lots of references to 5x5, I recently investigated and really like the idea of it; looks like something i'd really enjoy to mix into some traditional light cardio between sessions however, i am desperately struggling with a basic squat.
Thus far, i'm either leaning onto my toes, or losing my balance backwards, and this is without bar (so i can sort technique). I have tried with a bench and dipping/sitting towards that to try and get it sorted but finding it very frustrating. Advice welcome pls, as the piss-taking PT guys down there want £75/ph.
Thus far, i'm either leaning onto my toes, or losing my balance backwards, and this is without bar (so i can sort technique). I have tried with a bench and dipping/sitting towards that to try and get it sorted but finding it very frustrating. Advice welcome pls, as the piss-taking PT guys down there want £75/ph.
crashley said:
So having seen lots of references to 5x5, I recently investigated and really like the idea of it; looks like something i'd really enjoy to mix into some traditional light cardio between sessions however, i am desperately struggling with a basic squat.
Thus far, i'm either leaning onto my toes, or losing my balance backwards, and this is without bar (so i can sort technique). I have tried with a bench and dipping/sitting towards that to try and get it sorted but finding it very frustrating. Advice welcome pls, as the piss-taking PT guys down there want £75/ph.
You could raise your heels by placing a length of wood, 1-2" thick under them. This may help.Thus far, i'm either leaning onto my toes, or losing my balance backwards, and this is without bar (so i can sort technique). I have tried with a bench and dipping/sitting towards that to try and get it sorted but finding it very frustrating. Advice welcome pls, as the piss-taking PT guys down there want £75/ph.
crashley said:
So having seen lots of references to 5x5, I recently investigated and really like the idea of it; looks like something i'd really enjoy to mix into some traditional light cardio between sessions however, i am desperately struggling with a basic squat.
Thus far, i'm either leaning onto my toes, or losing my balance backwards, and this is without bar (so i can sort technique). I have tried with a bench and dipping/sitting towards that to try and get it sorted but finding it very frustrating. Advice welcome pls, as the piss-taking PT guys down there want £75/ph.
How is your hamstring flexibility, can you touch your toes while standing up without bending your knees? I struggled to get my squat form down for a year or so and it seemed my tight hamstrings were the problem, a few months of regular stretching and now no such problems at all.Thus far, i'm either leaning onto my toes, or losing my balance backwards, and this is without bar (so i can sort technique). I have tried with a bench and dipping/sitting towards that to try and get it sorted but finding it very frustrating. Advice welcome pls, as the piss-taking PT guys down there want £75/ph.
Shoulder flexibility is also relevant, if your elbows are stuck out behind you with the bar on your shoulder then your whole back will be in an incorrect posture. If that's the case working on your shoulder external rotation can help out.
TurboHatchback said:
How is your hamstring flexibility, can you touch your toes while standing up without bending your knees? I struggled to get my squat form down for a year or so and it seemed my tight hamstrings were the problem, a few months of regular stretching and now no such problems at all.
Shoulder flexibility is also relevant, if your elbows are stuck out behind you with the bar on your shoulder then your whole back will be in an incorrect posture. If that's the case working on your shoulder external rotation can help out.
This would make sense, my hams are super tight. TYShoulder flexibility is also relevant, if your elbows are stuck out behind you with the bar on your shoulder then your whole back will be in an incorrect posture. If that's the case working on your shoulder external rotation can help out.
A guy in the gym who was performing some very impressive squats showed me a good exercise for developing your form and posture.
Hold a 5 to 10kg full diameter plate in both hands flat against your chest while standing upright. As you go down into a squat extend the arms forward and down to touch the edge of the plate onto the floor between your legs. He did his with his arms outside of his legs, I did mine inside with a wider stance. This exercise forces you to hold your shoulders back in a good squatting position otherwise you will naturally fall forward.
He reckoned you should do sets of ten until you could do the exercise with a 25kg plate before attempting overhead squats(which is what I was practicing) but that it is good training for all squats.
Hold a 5 to 10kg full diameter plate in both hands flat against your chest while standing upright. As you go down into a squat extend the arms forward and down to touch the edge of the plate onto the floor between your legs. He did his with his arms outside of his legs, I did mine inside with a wider stance. This exercise forces you to hold your shoulders back in a good squatting position otherwise you will naturally fall forward.
He reckoned you should do sets of ten until you could do the exercise with a 25kg plate before attempting overhead squats(which is what I was practicing) but that it is good training for all squats.
Desiato said:
A guy in the gym who was performing some very impressive squats showed me a good exercise for developing your form and posture.
Hold a 5 to 10kg full diameter plate in both hands flat against your chest while standing upright. As you go down into a squat extend the arms forward and down to touch the edge of the plate onto the floor between your legs. He did his with his arms outside of his legs, I did mine inside with a wider stance. This exercise forces you to hold your shoulders back in a good squatting position otherwise you will naturally fall forward.
He reckoned you should do sets of ten until you could do the exercise with a 25kg plate before attempting overhead squats(which is what I was practicing) but that it is good training for all squats.
This is amazing advice. Feels like it has worked a treat. Ty very much.Hold a 5 to 10kg full diameter plate in both hands flat against your chest while standing upright. As you go down into a squat extend the arms forward and down to touch the edge of the plate onto the floor between your legs. He did his with his arms outside of his legs, I did mine inside with a wider stance. This exercise forces you to hold your shoulders back in a good squatting position otherwise you will naturally fall forward.
He reckoned you should do sets of ten until you could do the exercise with a 25kg plate before attempting overhead squats(which is what I was practicing) but that it is good training for all squats.
Guys how do you classify a failed rep for squats. I mean other than the obvious you went down and got stuck on the spotter arms and could not get back up.
For me I've never really not been able to stand back up, but as I hit my limits my form goes to crap and I count that as a failed rep.
Today though, I had a new one. 105kg for 3x5 and my form held up okay, but coming up out of the squat on the last set was painfully slow. To the point where a got a few odd stares from the other gym rats. I probably looked like I was about to snap in half or something. The problem I seem to have is my quads are strong enough but my lower back and maybe glutes are lacking, so the bottom of the squat is tough and coming up forcing my back straight is tough too. I have to come up slow to avoid a good morning and a back injury.
For me I've never really not been able to stand back up, but as I hit my limits my form goes to crap and I count that as a failed rep.
Today though, I had a new one. 105kg for 3x5 and my form held up okay, but coming up out of the squat on the last set was painfully slow. To the point where a got a few odd stares from the other gym rats. I probably looked like I was about to snap in half or something. The problem I seem to have is my quads are strong enough but my lower back and maybe glutes are lacking, so the bottom of the squat is tough and coming up forcing my back straight is tough too. I have to come up slow to avoid a good morning and a back injury.
stargazer30 said:
Guys how do you classify a failed rep for squats. I mean other than the obvious you went down and got stuck on the spotter arms and could not get back up.
For me I've never really not been able to stand back up, but as I hit my limits my form goes to crap and I count that as a failed rep.
Today though, I had a new one. 105kg for 3x5 and my form held up okay, but coming up out of the squat on the last set was painfully slow. To the point where a got a few odd stares from the other gym rats. I probably looked like I was about to snap in half or something. The problem I seem to have is my quads are strong enough but my lower back and maybe glutes are lacking, so the bottom of the squat is tough and coming up forcing my back straight is tough too. I have to come up slow to avoid a good morning and a back injury.
If you go through the full range of motion at a struggle, it's hard, not failed. If you can't complete full range of motion, or lose form to get back to standing, it's failed.For me I've never really not been able to stand back up, but as I hit my limits my form goes to crap and I count that as a failed rep.
Today though, I had a new one. 105kg for 3x5 and my form held up okay, but coming up out of the squat on the last set was painfully slow. To the point where a got a few odd stares from the other gym rats. I probably looked like I was about to snap in half or something. The problem I seem to have is my quads are strong enough but my lower back and maybe glutes are lacking, so the bottom of the squat is tough and coming up forcing my back straight is tough too. I have to come up slow to avoid a good morning and a back injury.
stargazer30 said:
Guys how do you classify a failed rep for squats. I mean other than the obvious you went down and got stuck on the spotter arms and could not get back up.
For me I've never really not been able to stand back up, but as I hit my limits my form goes to crap and I count that as a failed rep.
Today though, I had a new one. 105kg for 3x5 and my form held up okay, but coming up out of the squat on the last set was painfully slow. To the point where a got a few odd stares from the other gym rats. I probably looked like I was about to snap in half or something. The problem I seem to have is my quads are strong enough but my lower back and maybe glutes are lacking, so the bottom of the squat is tough and coming up forcing my back straight is tough too. I have to come up slow to avoid a good morning and a back injury.
At some point, you are going to plateau no matter what for your age & size but you can probably go further than you think.For me I've never really not been able to stand back up, but as I hit my limits my form goes to crap and I count that as a failed rep.
Today though, I had a new one. 105kg for 3x5 and my form held up okay, but coming up out of the squat on the last set was painfully slow. To the point where a got a few odd stares from the other gym rats. I probably looked like I was about to snap in half or something. The problem I seem to have is my quads are strong enough but my lower back and maybe glutes are lacking, so the bottom of the squat is tough and coming up forcing my back straight is tough too. I have to come up slow to avoid a good morning and a back injury.
Maybe it's time to mix things up a bit to engage the muscles a bit differently.
Have you tried front squats? You won't be able to lift as much but it stops you leaning forwards and you might squat a bit deeper.
I'd try them for a month and then go back to rear squats to see if it makes a difference.
Hi guys, I started this about 3 weeks ago as I've been just going to the gym and doing whatever I feel like with no structure so thought this would help get me focused on something.
I was wondering if you guys do anything else or just the 3 workouts a week? I feel like I'm not doing enough yet (I know this will change later) so was thinking HIIT cardio a couple of times a week as well?
Also I've downloaded the stronglifts app which is really helping me but I have messed up with the weights its given me (So for say 40Kg lift I am putting 2 x 20Kg plates on and not including the bar) will I be ok if I keep going like this or start again?
I was wondering if you guys do anything else or just the 3 workouts a week? I feel like I'm not doing enough yet (I know this will change later) so was thinking HIIT cardio a couple of times a week as well?
Also I've downloaded the stronglifts app which is really helping me but I have messed up with the weights its given me (So for say 40Kg lift I am putting 2 x 20Kg plates on and not including the bar) will I be ok if I keep going like this or start again?
Chris77 said:
Hi guys, I started this about 3 weeks ago as I've been just going to the gym and doing whatever I feel like with no structure so thought this would help get me focused on something.
I was wondering if you guys do anything else or just the 3 workouts a week? I feel like I'm not doing enough yet (I know this will change later) so was thinking HIIT cardio a couple of times a week as well?
Also I've downloaded the stronglifts app which is really helping me but I have messed up with the weights its given me (So for say 40Kg lift I am putting 2 x 20Kg plates on and not including the bar) will I be ok if I keep going like this or start again?
You can keep going if you wish, but obviously it won't be tracking the true weight.I was wondering if you guys do anything else or just the 3 workouts a week? I feel like I'm not doing enough yet (I know this will change later) so was thinking HIIT cardio a couple of times a week as well?
Also I've downloaded the stronglifts app which is really helping me but I have messed up with the weights its given me (So for say 40Kg lift I am putting 2 x 20Kg plates on and not including the bar) will I be ok if I keep going like this or start again?
If you read the StrongLifts PDF, it advocates doing cardio on the same day as your lifts, after you've finished your workout.
My first post on this thread - I am on week 8 and going well. Squats at 80kg, dead lift at 85kg, bench at 75kg, row at 57.5kg and OHP 42.5kg. One failure on 5th rep of 5th set on bench press but got it next time so pleased with progress and no stalls on any other lifts.
However, I think I may have done some tendon or other damage in my left forearm. I can still do the lifts but I have some discomfort. It is most noticeable when I grip with left hand but also when I hold my arm straight and raise my hand/fingers up at right angle to my forearm.
I have been on holiday for a week so no lifting at all but the forearm is no better. This makes me think it is not muscle damage but maybe tendons?
Has anyone had this or know of any treatment? Rest does not seem to be making any difference. I could just man up and carry on but I do not want to cause a longer term problem.
However, I think I may have done some tendon or other damage in my left forearm. I can still do the lifts but I have some discomfort. It is most noticeable when I grip with left hand but also when I hold my arm straight and raise my hand/fingers up at right angle to my forearm.
I have been on holiday for a week so no lifting at all but the forearm is no better. This makes me think it is not muscle damage but maybe tendons?
Has anyone had this or know of any treatment? Rest does not seem to be making any difference. I could just man up and carry on but I do not want to cause a longer term problem.
After about a year of training but not really knowing what I was doing I tried SL 5x5.
I did make some strength gains but it had no impact on my muscle size.If anything they got smaller lol.After 2 months I've switched to a 3x8 routine and am noticing small gains in size after just a few weeks. My diet has been the same throughout.
5x5 is not for me
I did make some strength gains but it had no impact on my muscle size.If anything they got smaller lol.After 2 months I've switched to a 3x8 routine and am noticing small gains in size after just a few weeks. My diet has been the same throughout.
5x5 is not for me
V8covin said:
After about a year of training but not really knowing what I was doing I tried SL 5x5.
I did make some strength gains but it had no impact on my muscle size.If anything they got smaller lol.After 2 months I've switched to a 3x8 routine and am noticing small gains in size after just a few weeks. My diet has been the same throughout.
5x5 is not for me
The clue's in the name? 5x5 is strength training. I did make some strength gains but it had no impact on my muscle size.If anything they got smaller lol.After 2 months I've switched to a 3x8 routine and am noticing small gains in size after just a few weeks. My diet has been the same throughout.
5x5 is not for me
You need muscle atrophy to build muscle mass, generally at least 8 reps per set, and with 15, 12, 8 drop sets and super-setting exercises being the killer builders.
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