Could I have a frozen shoulder? or what else?

[ED209]

Over the last couple of weeks I have experienced quite severe pain which seems to be coming from deep inside my right shoulder. This pain lasts a few hours and is very uncomfortable (stopped me sleeping last night) but goes as quickly as it comes. I would liken the pain to dental pain but it doesn't seem to restrict movement at all.

There doesn't seem to be a particular thing that triggers the pain, last night i was lying in bed, last week i was the passenger in a car when it came on.

Could this be a "frozen shoulder" starting or what else could it be? I haven't done anything recently where i might have obviously damaged my shoulder.

[CAPP0]

I have very similar symptoms to you (the "toothache" description fits it perfectly) and it also comes and goes, but I know mine was caused by a skiing fall just over 3 weeks ago. It has taken a while to work my way through the AxaPPP system but I have an appointment with a consultant this evening. I'll report back - but if you don't recall damaging yours then it may be another issue. I did see a physio and he said that if I didn't get this looked at and sorted, THEN it could lead to frozen shoulder, and in his words, "you don't want that" - so maybe yours is not frozen yet, but it looks like you ought to get it looked at.

[ED209]

CAPP0 said:

I have very similar symptoms to you (the "toothache" description fits it perfectly) and it also comes and goes, but I know mine was caused by a skiing fall just over 3 weeks ago. It has taken a while to work my way through the AxaPPP system but I have an appointment with a consultant this evening. I'll report back - but if you don't recall damaging yours then it may be another issue. I did see a physio and he said that if I didn't get this looked at and sorted, THEN it could lead to frozen shoulder, and in his words, "you don't want that" - so maybe yours is not frozen yet, but it looks like you ought to get it looked at.

Cheers, I deal with doctors at work on a daily basis. I think when I am back on Thurs i will ask one for their thoughts. Will be quicker than the three weeks it will take to get an appointment.

[Halmyre]

I had something similar and my GP diagnosed it as cervical spondylosis

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spondylosis

He said it's just natural wear-and-tear and there wasn't much I could do about it short of taking pain-killers and some mild therapy. It comes and goes and at the moment it's gone.

Edited by Halmyre on Tuesday 9th December 07:43

[ED209]

Been for a brisk 5 mile run this afternoon and not the slightest bit pain from my shoulder, I can't understand how it was hurting like hell 12hrs earlier then nothing?

[Squiggs]

A frozen shoulder restricts arm movement and gives you pain like you never thought possible - I read in a couple of places accounts of the pain and women who had had a frozen shoulder said the pain is worse than child birth!
I first noticed pain throwing a ball for the dog and put it down to a pulled muscle. A few months on and I couldn't lift my hand above my head. I had two cortisone/saline injections into the shoulder joint, physio and pain killers but nothing helped.
Sleeping was the worst. I kept waking the missis with my sudden crying out. ..... once comfy the slightest movement resulted in pain!!! If I did fall asleep my arm used to go numb (like severe pins and needles but without the sensation of pins and needles) and I had to use my other hand to move it - and the pain!!!!!!!
Putting on a shirt or tee shirt was agony and I had to be helped into a coat.
2 years on and whilst I don't get any pain now I still haven't got full movement back.
So I just hope for your sake that it isn't a frozen shoulder and that if it is it can be caught early enough to let the cortisone/saline injections help.
Good luck fella

[ED209]

Squiggs said:

A frozen shoulder restricts arm movement and gives you pain like you never thought possible - I read in a couple of places accounts of the pain and women who had had a frozen shoulder said the pain is worse than child birth!
I first noticed pain throwing a ball for the dog and put it down to a pulled muscle. A few months on and I couldn't lift my hand above my head. I had two cortisone/saline injections into the shoulder joint, physio and pain killers but nothing helped.
Sleeping was the worst. I kept waking the missis with my sudden crying out. ..... once comfy the slightest movement resulted in pain!!! If I did fall asleep my arm used to go numb (like severe pins and needles but without the sensation of pins and needles) and I had to use my other hand to move it - and the pain!!!!!!!
Putting on a shirt or tee shirt was agony and I had to be helped into a coat.
2 years on and whilst I don't get any pain now I still haven't got full movement back.
So I just hope for your sake that it isn't a frozen shoulder and that if it is it can be caught early enough to let the cortisone/saline injections help.
Good luck fella

Its nowhere near as bad as you describe, theres no restriction of movement at all at the minute and its not even hurting either.

I am dreading going to bed tonight though in case it starts playing up again.

[ReaderScars]

You might find it flares up with changes to atmospheric conditions - forthcoming cold and damp/wet weather - I've got a long term problem with a tendon or something inside the deltoids which does the same. Doesn't tell me when it's going to be sunny, mind.

[CAPP0]

Update on mine. Saw a consultant last night.

He examined and x-rayed me. The x-ray was inconclusive although there were some irregularities on the bones which he isn't yet able to explain. So now I am booked for an MRI, including a procedure where dye is (apparently painfully) injected. He suspects either a labral cartilage tear, or a torn rotator cuff muscle. Whilst the pain seems to be in the rotator cuff area, I'm very much hoping it's the labral tear (although indications are that it i won't be) and that is because a torn rotator cuff will not only require surgery, but will then mean SIX WEEKS in a sling

They can't MRI me until next Thus so I have another wait now.

[PositronicRay]

Squiggs said:

A frozen shoulder restricts arm movement and gives you pain like you never thought possible - I read in a couple of places accounts of the pain and women who had had a frozen shoulder said the pain is worse than child birth!
I first noticed pain throwing a ball for the dog and put it down to a pulled muscle. A few months on and I couldn't lift my hand above my head. I had two cortisone/saline injections into the shoulder joint, physio and pain killers but nothing helped.
Sleeping was the worst. I kept waking the missis with my sudden crying out. ..... once comfy the slightest movement resulted in pain!!! If I did fall asleep my arm used to go numb (like severe pins and needles but without the sensation of pins and needles) and I had to use my other hand to move it - and the pain!!!!!!!
Putting on a shirt or tee shirt was agony and I had to be helped into a coat.
2 years on and whilst I don't get any pain now I still haven't got full movement back.
So I just hope for your sake that it isn't a frozen shoulder and that if it is it can be caught early enough to let the cortisone/saline injections help.
Good luck fella

This is a good description of a frozen shoulder. I would advise anyone to consider capsular release. My wife used BUPA and all was clear in a few months. I decided to "man mine out" 4 yrs later no pain but still reduced movement.

[shouldbworking]

It's not just 6 weeks in a sling if you have surgery. That is just as much bs as the 4-6 weeks till its better that I was told when I fractured my humerus and shoulder joint back in august.

I was in a sling for 6 weeks, and had similar issues to the chap with the frozen shoulder earlier - mine isn't frozen per se, but the muscles are extremely tight from that forced immobility and I'm looking at permanent loss of some range of motion, after in the region of a years physio to try and get the best I can out of it.

Being in a sling was the easy part (ok, except the 4 weeks of sleeping upright, that was proper st)

[WD39]

Frozen Shoulder?
I had it several times in the eighties and it is extremely painful, with restricted arm movement. I took my father's advice ('any joint or muscular/tendon type injury/pain.KEEP IT MOVING.)
So that's what I did. I didn't go sick from work, I carried on as normal. Well, as normal as is possible and took some strong painkillers if it got bad.
One morning a few weeks later I woke with a 'Pins and Needles' type feeling in the affected arm.
This lasted several hours and when it disappeared, so had the shoulder pain!
I was cured!
On subsequent attacks the pattern was exactly the same.
A real mystery.

[Squiggs]

WD39 said:

Frozen Shoulder?
I had it several times in the eighties and it is extremely painful, with restricted arm movement. I took my father's advice ('any joint or muscular/tendon type injury/pain.KEEP IT MOVING.)
So that's what I did. I didn't go sick from work, I carried on as normal. Well, as normal as is possible and took some strong painkillers if it got bad.
One morning a few weeks later I woke with a 'Pins and Needles' type feeling in the affected arm.
This lasted several hours and when it disappeared, so had the shoulder pain!
I was cured!
On subsequent attacks the pattern was exactly the same.
A real mystery.

Keeping it moving and working as normal is what I tried to do - but the thing is frozen shoulder has nothing to do with a muscular or tendon injury.
The shoulder joint loses it's lubrication and with time movement becomes restricted as the joint literally tries to lock itself solid and pinches nerves.

With all due respect I don't think you had a frozen shoulder.

[jonamv8]

My client is a leading shoulder surgeon and wrote up a useful guide to shoulder conditions

http://shoulderelbowsurgeon.co.uk/shoulder.html

Maybe worth a read and try and define whats up

[WD39]

Squiggs said:

WD39 said:

Frozen Shoulder?
I had it several times in the eighties and it is extremely painful, with restricted arm movement. I took my father's advice ('any joint or muscular/tendon type injury/pain.KEEP IT MOVING.)
So that's what I did. I didn't go sick from work, I carried on as normal. Well, as normal as is possible and took some strong painkillers if it got bad.
One morning a few weeks later I woke with a 'Pins and Needles' type feeling in the affected arm.
This lasted several hours and when it disappeared, so had the shoulder pain!
I was cured!
On subsequent attacks the pattern was exactly the same.
A real mystery.

Keeping it moving and working as normal is what I tried to do - but the thing is frozen shoulder has nothing to do with a muscular or tendon injury.
The shoulder joint loses it's lubrication and with time movement becomes restricted as the joint literally tries to lock itself solid and pinches nerves.

With all due respect I don't think you had a frozen shoulder.

Sorry, but verified by two GP's at my local practice

[Squiggs]

WD39 said:

Squiggs said:

WD39 said:

Frozen Shoulder?
I had it several times in the eighties and it is extremely painful, with restricted arm movement. I took my father's advice ('any joint or muscular/tendon type injury/pain.KEEP IT MOVING.)
So that's what I did. I didn't go sick from work, I carried on as normal. Well, as normal as is possible and took some strong painkillers if it got bad.
One morning a few weeks later I woke with a 'Pins and Needles' type feeling in the affected arm.
This lasted several hours and when it disappeared, so had the shoulder pain!
I was cured!
On subsequent attacks the pattern was exactly the same.
A real mystery.

Keeping it moving and working as normal is what I tried to do - but the thing is frozen shoulder has nothing to do with a muscular or tendon injury.
The shoulder joint loses it's lubrication and with time movement becomes restricted as the joint literally tries to lock itself solid and pinches nerves.

With all due respect I don't think you had a frozen shoulder.

Sorry, but verified by two GP's at my local practice

I'd change GP's if I were you ..... my GP referred me to hospital for an xray before being certain of his diagnosis.

The fact is a frozen shoulder can't just cure itself after a couple of weeks cos you've 'worked it off' because you simply can't move a frozen shoulder to 'work it off' - the clue to problem is in the name "frozen shoulder"!
I went to a physiotherapist and even with his sometimes forceful actions he couldn't get my shoulder moving past a very limited point.
As I said it's not muscular/tendon problem - it's a completely different kettle of fish. The joint loses it's lubrication and locks - even if you could move it the lubrication wouldn't suddenly re-appear.
And once it starts freezing if cortisone/saline injections (to replace the lubricating fluid that's missing from the joint) don't work it will last at least 18 months.

[PositronicRay]

Squiggs said:

WD39 said:

Squiggs said:

WD39 said:

Frozen Shoulder?
I had it several times in the eighties and it is extremely painful, with restricted arm movement. I took my father's advice ('any joint or muscular/tendon type injury/pain.KEEP IT MOVING.)
So that's what I did. I didn't go sick from work, I carried on as normal. Well, as normal as is possible and took some strong painkillers if it got bad.
One morning a few weeks later I woke with a 'Pins and Needles' type feeling in the affected arm.
This lasted several hours and when it disappeared, so had the shoulder pain!
I was cured!
On subsequent attacks the pattern was exactly the same.
A real mystery.

Keeping it moving and working as normal is what I tried to do - but the thing is frozen shoulder has nothing to do with a muscular or tendon injury.
The shoulder joint loses it's lubrication and with time movement becomes restricted as the joint literally tries to lock itself solid and pinches nerves.

With all due respect I don't think you had a frozen shoulder.

Sorry, but verified by two GP's at my local practice

I'd change GP's if I were you ..... my GP referred me to hospital for an xray before being certain of his diagnosis.

The fact is a frozen shoulder can't just cure itself after a couple of weeks cos you've 'worked it off' because you simply can't move a frozen shoulder to 'work it off' - the clue to problem is in the name "frozen shoulder"!
I went to a physiotherapist and even with his sometimes forceful actions he couldn't get my shoulder moving past a very limited point.
As I said it's not muscular/tendon problem - it's a completely different kettle of fish. The joint loses it's lubrication and locks - even if you could move it the lubrication wouldn't suddenly re-appear.
And once it starts freezing if cortisone/saline injections (to replace the lubricating fluid that's missing from the joint) don't work it will last at least 18 months.

I concur (as a frozen shoulder sufferer)

[WD39]

PositronicRay said:

Squiggs said:

WD39 said:

Squiggs said:

WD39 said:

Frozen Shoulder?
I had it several times in the eighties and it is extremely painful, with restricted arm movement. I took my father's advice ('any joint or muscular/tendon type injury/pain.KEEP IT MOVING.)
So that's what I did. I didn't go sick from work, I carried on as normal. Well, as normal as is possible and took some strong painkillers if it got bad.
One morning a few weeks later I woke with a 'Pins and Needles' type feeling in the affected arm.
This lasted several hours and when it disappeared, so had the shoulder pain!
I was cured!
On subsequent attacks the pattern was exactly the same.
A real mystery.

Keeping it moving and working as normal is what I tried to do - but the thing is frozen shoulder has nothing to do with a muscular or tendon injury.
The shoulder joint loses it's lubrication and with time movement becomes restricted as the joint literally tries to lock itself solid and pinches nerves.

With all due respect I don't think you had a frozen shoulder.

Sorry, but verified by two GP's at my local practice

I'd change GP's if I were you ..... my GP referred me to hospital for an xray before being certain of his diagnosis.

The fact is a frozen shoulder can't just cure itself after a couple of weeks cos you've 'worked it off' because you simply can't move a frozen shoulder to 'work it off' - the clue to problem is in the name "frozen shoulder"!
I went to a physiotherapist and even with his sometimes forceful actions he couldn't get my shoulder moving past a very limited point.
As I said it's not muscular/tendon problem - it's a completely different kettle of fish. The joint loses it's lubrication and locks - even if you could move it the lubrication wouldn't suddenly re-appear.
And once it starts freezing if cortisone/saline injections (to replace the lubricating fluid that's missing from the joint) don't work it will last at least 18 months.

I concur (as a frozen shoulder sufferer)

It would appear that frozen shoulder moves and manifests itself in mysterious ways.

[CAPP0]

Woo bloody hoo to me. I had the arthrogram (anaesthetise the shoulder, stick a big needle into the shoulder joint (he said size Black?) and move it around under x-Ray until it's in the right place, then shoot dye in. Then it's off to the good-for-claustrophics MRI scanner (thanks Grohl, Hawkins et al for getting me through that).

Results this evening. No tearing. Thus no surgery. Just physio to speed up recovery. "Will you be booking another ski trip this season?" Asks the consultant. I will now, I laughed. "Not the response I was hoping for" he replied!

Just very bloody chuffed that I don't need surgery so I won't be completely out of action.