Ketosis - Low carb/high fat diet. Experiences?

[944fan]

Deisel Weisel said:

944fan said:

First thing I found hard was actually getting carbs below 50g.

Is 50g the magic number, no matter what sex or bf% you are? I heard '5% of your total calorific input' as the goal posts.

Not sure really. 50 was the value talked about on most sites. Some people are going as low as 20 but that seems mad to me. Wont be getting any veg and fk all fibre.

I know what veg to avoid now (tomato and fennel sausage casserole is a no go) and have it roughly around 50 gs so will see how it goes.

Anyone else find it messes their sleep up a bit? Just seem to be waking in the night more than usual and then waking up a bit tired.

[Gecko1978]

I do this diet now did it last year too. 4th of Jan is my first day back at work each year so I start then. Last year I was 16st did atkins for 12 weeks got to 12.5 stone. Ate like a pig rest of year (penut butter cups are so nice) by Dec put it all back on. So it took 12 weeks too loose it then 9 months to put it all back on. This year started the same and am 10kg or neaerly 2 stone down with more to go. However this time I intend to switch diet to more balanced one once I hit target weight also I do piliaties so I noticed that even though I put weight on my stomach is not as flabby etc.

End of day diets are just that diets not a healthy balanced way of eating so you need to find the latter with food you enjoy. I have discovered while I don't like fresh fruiut i like dried fruit which has many of same benefits (just sugars more concentrated so eat less of it). I aslo only drink diet soft drinks so get my sugar taste from thoes.

[944fan]

Fell off the wagon with this. Love of cake and chips got the better of me.

Decided to get back on it though as it does seem to work well for me. Been a few days now. Cycled for 90 mins yesterday and felt OK. Went for a run this morning. About 40 mins in I blew up. Couldn't get my legs to move. Think I should have waited till i was back in ketosis as I'm guessing I bonked from using all my glycogen up. Still managed 11km though but it was very slow and painful.

[13m]

944fan said:

Fell off the wagon with this. Love of cake and chips got the better of me.

Decided to get back on it though as it does seem to work well for me. Been a few days now. Cycled for 90 mins yesterday and felt OK. Went for a run this morning. About 40 mins in I blew up. Couldn't get my legs to move. Think I should have waited till i was back in ketosis as I'm guessing I bonked from using all my glycogen up. Still managed 11km though but it was very slow and painful.

I personally find it takes me 4 days to achieve ketosis. Then it's like flicking a switch - one minute I feel grim, the next full of beans. Once in ketosis my stamina is very good.

[944fan]

Any else get Montezuma's revenge when adapting?

Had a bad run yesterday and felt rough after. Then last night suddenly explosive bum runs. Spent most of the night on the bog, 4 diacalm coudln't stop it.

Not sure if its related to the diet or just something I ate.

[FrankAbagnale]

I've been on a no/low carb diet since Jan 4th and planned to do it for 3 months. Weight loss is always very quick and i'd say after 2 months it gets to a stage where other people really start to notice that body shape is changing which always feels good.

The first couple of weeks are quite tricky as it is hard to get in to the habit of not eating meals that contain carb and unless well planned the menu options seem very boring/limited. I find that I wake up around 3/4am and am wide awake without a chance of getting back to sleep and this results in a couple of very tired weeks.

After I get through the first couple of weeks and have established a pattern of meals and good sleep I find that I am a lot more alert and generally feel less lethargic. It's a hugely positive change.

I have done it before to lose weight and find it a very simple, one rule method to achieving weight loss. I piled on the pounds over Sep-Dec as tore my MCL and substituted exercise with booze, lunches and dinners!

Come the beginning of April, i'll really ramp up my exercise and re-introduce carbs in to my meals - keeping a close eye on the scales.

[13m]

944fan said:

Any else get Montezuma's revenge when adapting?

Had a bad run yesterday and felt rough after. Then last night suddenly explosive bum runs. Spent most of the night on the bog, 4 diacalm coudln't stop it.

Not sure if its related to the diet or just something I ate.

Unlikely to be keto, if anything you'll have exactly the opposite problem. I use Fybogel if I am going to be doing keto to keep things moving.

[944fan]

13m said:

Unlikely to be keto, if anything you'll have exactly the opposite problem. I use Fybogel if I am going to be doing keto to keep things moving.

Fair enough. I think the chicken I had last night may have been past its best.

Does anyone on here doing Keto also do endurance events? I am doing Keto to lose weight. In July I am doing a half ironman. I am wondering if I can continue keto during the race and whether I should fuel in the race or rely on fat burning? I see there are a couple of pro iron man racers who do keto/LCHF but I can't find any information about their race fueling.

I am just looking to complete it, not bothered by times

[13m]

944fan said:

13m said:

Unlikely to be keto, if anything you'll have exactly the opposite problem. I use Fybogel if I am going to be doing keto to keep things moving.

Fair enough. I think the chicken I had last night may have been past its best.

Does anyone on here doing Keto also do endurance events? I am doing Keto to lose weight. In July I am doing a half ironman. I am wondering if I can continue keto during the race and whether I should fuel in the race or rely on fat burning? I see there are a couple of pro iron man racers who do keto/LCHF but I can't find any information about their race fueling.

I am just looking to complete it, not bothered by times

Just pack sausages instead of energy bars

[Pvapour]

944fan said:

Does anyone on here doing Keto also do endurance events? I am doing Keto to lose weight. In July I am doing a half ironman. I am wondering if I can continue keto during the race and whether I should fuel in the race or rely on fat burning? I see there are a couple of pro iron man racers who do keto/LCHF but I can't find any information about their race fueling.

I am just looking to complete it, not bothered by times

Not sure it counts as endurance but I'm using fasting to drop bf for 10k OCR, 1st time for me in 4 weeks, dropped 16lb of fat since Jan 1st, my endurance on fast days is far superior to normal diet days, considering fasting on day of comp tbh, should hav dropped another 4llb by comp, 10% bf now, 5'10 14st

[LordGrover]

Feck! You must be packing some muscle!
Glad to see it.

[LordGrover]

What works for one may not work for another.
I don't do any sport as such, just moderate weight lifting. Low carb, high fat is the only thing that keeps me in any kind of shape. Grains in particular (bread, pasta, cake, etc.) make me puffy, slow, lethargic and fat. Every time. Even a sandwich brings me down for a couple of days.
Many here, way fitter, stronger and more athletic than me swear by high carb low fat.
We have to find what works - there's no ideal that works for everyone.

[mcelliott]

944fan said:

Does anyone on here doing Keto also do endurance events?

I gave a brief outline of the background to my experience on keto on page 1 - it was specifically to find out what affects keto would have on endurance athletes. I would say that it definitely affected me adversely in terms of my endurance capabilities. I stayed on it for approx 6 weeks - I did a couple of long bicycle rides ranging from 100km to 130km and never felt comfortable on them whatsoever, lacking any sort of power. I and a group of friends are riding from one end of the Pyrenees to the other in September - that's roughly 140km a day, 4,000m of climbing daily as well. Would not dream of doing it on a high fat low carb diet. Very good for short term weight loss but that's all it's good for, in my opinion. Bit of a ramble, hope it helps.

[Pvapour]

LordGrover said:

What works for one may not work for another.
I don't do any sport as such, just moderate weight lifting. Low carb, high fat is the only thing that keeps me in any kind of shape. Grains in particular (bread, pasta, cake, etc.) make me puffy, slow, lethargic and fat. Every time. Even a sandwich brings me down for a couple of days.
Many here, way fitter, stronger and more athletic than me swear by high carb low fat.
We have to find what works - there's no ideal that works for everyone.

Getting the macronutrients right is pretty much key for everyone i think, single biggest learn in nutrition for me, after finding what works for you then you can just play with kcal balance to control fat levels, i'm the same as you in respect to carbs, 200g of protein is my priority, then essential fats and a smattering of carbs.

I'm hoping my muscle size will give me the edge when moving rocks etc but not looking forward to the 9ft wall, might try and run through it

[All that jazz]

13m said:

I personally find it takes me 4 days to achieve ketosis. Then it's like flicking a switch - one minute I feel grim, the next full of beans. Once in ketosis my stamina is very good.

This is the same for me too. I did it a few years ago and lost 3st in 3 months (16st down to 13) without doing a jot of exercise but I was strict with what I ate and didn't deviate from it at all. Grated cheese and tinned tina mayo mix with black pepper was a daily thing plus grilled pork loin steaks/chicken breast fillets/bacon etc. Still used normal tomato ketchup on them to give them a bit of zing. You find that this kind of food is very filling (lots of protein in meat especially) and your portions will get smaller and smaller whilst still feeling full, to the point where your daily food intake drops to fk all = weight falling off.

As for the medical scare-mongering it's a load of bks. Despite feeling absolutely great and full of life when on Atkins I had some concerns about cholestrol levels so had a full check-up and everything came back fine. It works for me and I never suffered any constipation or bad breath issues that are oft reported. If you do it right, once the sugar cravings for the first week or two pass, you should find that you don't have any interest in sweet stuff, pizzas, take-aways etc as you just don't feel hungry. It does take a lot of willpower to get to that point though. I find that a tub of fresh double cream in the fridge to sip from helps a lot to stave off those initial sugar cravings, even though it doesn't actually have any sugar in it the taste just seems to work.

[13m]

All that jazz said:

13m said:

I personally find it takes me 4 days to achieve ketosis. Then it's like flicking a switch - one minute I feel grim, the next full of beans. Once in ketosis my stamina is very good.

This is the same for me too. I did it a few years ago and lost 3st in 3 months (16st down to 13) without doing a jot of exercise but I was strict with what I ate and didn't deviate from it at all. Grated cheese and tinned tina mayo mix with black pepper was a daily thing plus grilled pork loin steaks/chicken breast fillets/bacon etc. Still used normal tomato ketchup on them to give them a bit of zing. You find that this kind of food is very filling (lots of protein in meat especially) and your portions will get smaller and smaller whilst still feeling full, to the point where your daily food intake drops to fk all = weight falling off.

As for the medical scare-mongering it's a load of bks. Despite feeling absolutely great and full of life when on Atkins I had some concerns about cholestrol levels so had a full check-up and everything came back fine. It works for me and I never suffered any constipation or bad breath issues that are oft reported. If you do it right, once the sugar cravings for the first week or two pass, you should find that you don't have any interest in sweet stuff, pizzas, take-aways etc as you just don't feel hungry. It does take a lot of willpower to get to that point though. I find that a tub of fresh double cream in the fridge to sip from helps a lot to stave off those initial sugar cravings, even though it doesn't actually have any sugar in it the taste just seems to work.

My major negatives were:

1. Constipation (if I didn't add fibre supplements)

2. Difficulty in staying hydrated.

3. Sweats if I was not hydrated (oddly)

4. Loss of muscle tone.

5. Looking drawn and haggard.

I also have a suspicion that it was depressing testosterone, because what fat I was carrying wasn't particularly in a male pattern. It was on my pecs, under my arms etc. Back on carbs and the only fat that remains is lower belly and minor love handles - where blokes should store it.

[FredClogs]

I started to realise I was suffering from quite bad post luncheon (usually thick butties and a can of coke) attention deficit disorder so have adopted a no sugar, low carb diet during the week - it really help and I'm off the bread and pasta 5 days a week. I think you need to do more than this to hit full ketosis but when I did try for full ketosis by going high fat and no sugar (i.e lots of nuts instead of fruit, MCT oil and 2 avacados a day) I literally nearly shat myself.

[944fan]

FredClogs said:

I started to realise I was suffering from quite bad post luncheon (usually thick butties and a can of coke) attention deficit disorder so have adopted a no sugar, low carb diet during the week - it really help and I'm off the bread and pasta 5 days a week. I think you need to do more than this to hit full ketosis but when I did try for full ketosis by going high fat and no sugar (i.e lots of nuts instead of fruit, MCT oil and 2 avacados a day) I literally nearly shat myself.

Interestingly last year I did a DNA test from DNA Fit. One of the things it looked at was carbohydrate sensitivity. Basically for some people 1 cal is worth more to them depending on where it comes from. For me I am very sensitive to carbs, causing huge insulin spikes and afternoon slumps as you say.

Sounds like you are similar and avoiding the starch, even if not doing full keto, is helping you.

[FredClogs]

944fan said:

FredClogs said:

I started to realise I was suffering from quite bad post luncheon (usually thick butties and a can of coke) attention deficit disorder so have adopted a no sugar, low carb diet during the week - it really help and I'm off the bread and pasta 5 days a week. I think you need to do more than this to hit full ketosis but when I did try for full ketosis by going high fat and no sugar (i.e lots of nuts instead of fruit, MCT oil and 2 avacados a day) I literally nearly shat myself.

Interestingly last year I did a DNA test from DNA Fit. One of the things it looked at was carbohydrate sensitivity. Basically for some people 1 cal is worth more to them depending on where it comes from. For me I am very sensitive to carbs, causing huge insulin spikes and afternoon slumps as you say.

Sounds like you are similar and avoiding the starch, even if not doing full keto, is helping you.

I'd definitely say so and I haven't really felt much knock on effect to my energy levels when exercising, I've also noticed that some of my tendinitis and arthritic sort of old age aches and pains may be easing which I think may be down to the inflammatory nature of fluctuating sugar in the blood (bro science levels of knowledge on these things though I'm afraid). When I was reading up I was quite surprised to read that they prescribe ketosis diets for kids with severe epilepsy because of the effect it can having on calming down the "energy" levels and spurious electrical activity in the brain!

[944fan]

mcelliott said:

I gave a brief outline of the background to my experience on keto on page 1 - it was specifically to find out what affects keto would have on endurance athletes. I would say that it definitely affected me adversely in terms of my endurance capabilities. I stayed on it for approx 6 weeks - I did a couple of long bicycle rides ranging from 100km to 130km and never felt comfortable on them whatsoever, lacking any sort of power. I and a group of friends are riding from one end of the Pyrenees to the other in September - that's roughly 140km a day, 4,000m of climbing daily as well. Would not dream of doing it on a high fat low carb diet. Very good for short term weight loss but that's all it's good for, in my opinion. Bit of a ramble, hope it helps.

Thanks, that's useful. I am finding the same with exercising. Endurance is ok but I have no power. Running this morning was ok when it was flat but as soon as there was even a slight gradient I just couldn't get my legs to move fast. Swam 2.5 KM yesterday. At slow pace it was fine but when I wanted to go fast my arms just wouldn't turn over.

I seem to fall of a cliff as well, suddenly fatigue just swallows me. It isn't bonking because my muscles have been glycogen depleted by now. Unless I am getting to much protein and that is effecting the ketosis.

I think I will use the diet to get down to race weight and then one or two weeks out switch to a higher carb diet and fuel the half IM as normal.