Symptoms ruining the joy of driving
Discussion
Right, first time poster in this section so be nice 
I've been experiencing some symptoms since around September last year, and despite countless trips to the doctor we've ended up getting nowhere so I've decided (as usual!) to turn to PH for advice.
Background first, I'm a 25 year old, healthy, relatively active male. Last year I started going through weird light headed spells, almost a little dizzy and blurry. Nothing too serious but enough to make me feel a little weird and concerned. As well as this, and this bit is hard to describe, I just don't feel myself, struggling to focus on things in day to day life.
Anyway a few trips to the doctor and the blood tests all came back clear. Nothing of note to worry about. They advised I started drinking more water, which I've done, and getting tested for glasses. I've tried this and despite coming back as a little short sighted, this hasn't improved my symptoms (They've just made me have better vision when I do have them!).
Over the last few weeks/months I've managed to narrow down the symptoms to when I'm currently in, or just out of a car (passenger or driver, weirdly and important to note, not that I'm a passenger much).
Over the past few years I've been doing 25-30k per annum, and also been racing British Club Championships so I'm not exactly unaccustomed to driving. And these symptoms have been massively ruining my enjoyment of driving and have started to cause concern. I don't feel an issue continuing to drive, I've never felt close to fainting or anything like that, just a little light headed and nautious.
Any thoughts or inputs would be much appreciated. I'm running out of ideas.
I've been experiencing some symptoms since around September last year, and despite countless trips to the doctor we've ended up getting nowhere so I've decided (as usual!) to turn to PH for advice.
Background first, I'm a 25 year old, healthy, relatively active male. Last year I started going through weird light headed spells, almost a little dizzy and blurry. Nothing too serious but enough to make me feel a little weird and concerned. As well as this, and this bit is hard to describe, I just don't feel myself, struggling to focus on things in day to day life.
Anyway a few trips to the doctor and the blood tests all came back clear. Nothing of note to worry about. They advised I started drinking more water, which I've done, and getting tested for glasses. I've tried this and despite coming back as a little short sighted, this hasn't improved my symptoms (They've just made me have better vision when I do have them!
).Over the last few weeks/months I've managed to narrow down the symptoms to when I'm currently in, or just out of a car (passenger or driver, weirdly and important to note, not that I'm a passenger much).
Over the past few years I've been doing 25-30k per annum, and also been racing British Club Championships so I'm not exactly unaccustomed to driving. And these symptoms have been massively ruining my enjoyment of driving and have started to cause concern. I don't feel an issue continuing to drive, I've never felt close to fainting or anything like that, just a little light headed and nautious.
Any thoughts or inputs would be much appreciated. I'm running out of ideas.
Could it be related to some kind of ear problem.
I had a problem with dizzy spells, and with hindsight they were triggered by me moving my head in a certain way. Turned out to be a loose particle in the part of my ear that deals with balance. It carried on moving when the rest of me wasn't, causing my brain to think I was still moving and then compensate for this. It took several weeks to get to the bottom of this, MRI scans and everything. Some quite simple manipulation to trap the loose particle cured the problem completely.
I had a problem with dizzy spells, and with hindsight they were triggered by me moving my head in a certain way. Turned out to be a loose particle in the part of my ear that deals with balance. It carried on moving when the rest of me wasn't, causing my brain to think I was still moving and then compensate for this. It took several weeks to get to the bottom of this, MRI scans and everything. Some quite simple manipulation to trap the loose particle cured the problem completely.
omniflow said:
Could it be related to some kind of ear problem.
I had a problem with dizzy spells, and with hindsight they were triggered by me moving my head in a certain way. Turned out to be a loose particle in the part of my ear that deals with balance. It carried on moving when the rest of me wasn't, causing my brain to think I was still moving and then compensate for this. It took several weeks to get to the bottom of this, MRI scans and everything. Some quite simple manipulation to trap the loose particle cured the problem completely.
Good shout, I would look into ears, least you can rule them out if anything elseI had a problem with dizzy spells, and with hindsight they were triggered by me moving my head in a certain way. Turned out to be a loose particle in the part of my ear that deals with balance. It carried on moving when the rest of me wasn't, causing my brain to think I was still moving and then compensate for this. It took several weeks to get to the bottom of this, MRI scans and everything. Some quite simple manipulation to trap the loose particle cured the problem completely.
How is your diet?
em177 said:
Over the past few years I've been doing 25-30k per annum,
Have you changed cars recently? - I used to get lifts in a Fiat Panda (hated the thing) and the ride mixed with the smell of exhaust every time the car stopped had me feeling really groggy. It did not help that I am a terrible passenger, and get really car sick.Car sickness bands help, have you tried them? - Boots sell them, just bands that go around your wrist and press a little plastic ball in-between the tendons where your watch strap should be.
Also as above, get your ears checked over - my mother got an ear infection mixed with a cold, thought it was just a cold, and now 5 years on is still unable to walk around a room without feeling dizzy.
omniflow said:
Could it be related to some kind of ear problem.
I had a problem with dizzy spells, and with hindsight they were triggered by me moving my head in a certain way. Turned out to be a loose particle in the part of my ear that deals with balance. It carried on moving when the rest of me wasn't, causing my brain to think I was still moving and then compensate for this. It took several weeks to get to the bottom of this, MRI scans and everything. Some quite simple manipulation to trap the loose particle cured the problem completely.
I'll have a look into that. Cheers.I had a problem with dizzy spells, and with hindsight they were triggered by me moving my head in a certain way. Turned out to be a loose particle in the part of my ear that deals with balance. It carried on moving when the rest of me wasn't, causing my brain to think I was still moving and then compensate for this. It took several weeks to get to the bottom of this, MRI scans and everything. Some quite simple manipulation to trap the loose particle cured the problem completely.
TwistingMyMelon said:
Good shout, I would look into ears, least you can rule them out if anything else
How is your diet?
Diet is pretty good, gym 3-4 times a week, the odd pizza and curry as we all do but certainly wouldn't say it was worse than average. How is your diet?
Peanut Gallery said:
Have you changed cars recently? - I used to get lifts in a Fiat Panda (hated the thing) and the ride mixed with the smell of exhaust every time the car stopped had me feeling really groggy. It did not help that I am a terrible passenger, and get really car sick.
Car sickness bands help, have you tried them? - Boots sell them, just bands that go around your wrist and press a little plastic ball in-between the tendons where your watch strap should be.
Also as above, get your ears checked over - my mother got an ear infection mixed with a cold, thought it was just a cold, and now 5 years on is still unable to walk around a room without feeling dizzy.
Interesting theory but I work in the motor trade, so I'm in 10+ different cars a day so it can't be that. Intrigued about the band though, however I have a weird phobia of things touching my wrist so will need to give them a try and see how I find wearing one Car sickness bands help, have you tried them? - Boots sell them, just bands that go around your wrist and press a little plastic ball in-between the tendons where your watch strap should be.
Also as above, get your ears checked over - my mother got an ear infection mixed with a cold, thought it was just a cold, and now 5 years on is still unable to walk around a room without feeling dizzy.
I know, I'm a nightmare. I think Omniflow made a good call. He(?)'s probably referring to something known as benign paroxysmal positional vertigo. There's a good breakdown of it here:
http://www.menieres.org.uk/information-and-support...
The fact that your symptoms are elicited by sitting / moving while in a sitting position, could possibly point toward this. It's often sorted with a simple fix, as Omniflow says.
Luke
http://www.menieres.org.uk/information-and-support...
The fact that your symptoms are elicited by sitting / moving while in a sitting position, could possibly point toward this. It's often sorted with a simple fix, as Omniflow says.
em177 said:
Over the last few weeks/months I've managed to narrow down the symptoms to when I'm currently in, or just out of a car (passenger or driver, weirdly and important to note, not that I'm a passenger much).
Fingers crossed for a speedy fix, whatever the cause.Luke
popeyewhite said:
You say you had bloods done - did this include an endocrine test? Adrenaline (noradrenaline) can elicit the symptoms you describe. BP? Breathing difficulties? Any stress in life?
I strongly suspect it isn't this, as not only is it very rare, it almost certainly wouldn't time itself with car journeys. With the symptoms the OP complained of, I would be thinking to exclude the following: cardiac arrhythmia (again unusual that it would present just when driving), some kind of inner ear pathology (although the symptoms don't particularly fit with BPPV as mentioned above), stress or anxiety. With the latter two being, in my experience, the most likely cause of symptoms.
Could I ask how long the symptoms last when they present, and do you get any other concurrent symptoms: such as palpitations, sweating, nausea etc. How long does it take for you to recover? And also what is your caffeine and alcohol intake like? Feel free to PM me if you don't want to answer on a public forum.
meddyg said:
popeyewhite said:
You say you had bloods done - did this include an endocrine test? Adrenaline (noradrenaline) can elicit the symptoms you describe. BP? Breathing difficulties? Any stress in life?
I strongly suspect it isn't this, as not only is it very rare, it almost certainly wouldn't time itself with car journeys. I've been having similar symptoms which have been worrying me, I gave up all caffeine, hadn't been drinking a lot, 1 costa in the morning and 4-5 cups of tea during the day (but bear in mind that a cup of tea has 50% the caffeine of a coffee).
Within 2-3 days I was close to "normal", my biggest issues had been with peripheral vision and observation (along with some concentration issues when things got stressful at work).
Nothing to lose, give it a go.
Within 2-3 days I was close to "normal", my biggest issues had been with peripheral vision and observation (along with some concentration issues when things got stressful at work).
Nothing to lose, give it a go.
gareth h said:
I've been having similar symptoms which have been worrying me, I gave up all caffeine, hadn't been drinking a lot, 1 costa in the morning and 4-5 cups of tea during the day (but bear in mind that a cup of tea has 50% the caffeine of a coffee).
Within 2-3 days I was close to "normal", my biggest issues had been with peripheral vision and observation (along with some concentration issues when things got stressful at work).
Nothing to lose, give it a go.
Cheers. What prompted you to decided it was caffeine to give up if you don't mind me asking? Within 2-3 days I was close to "normal", my biggest issues had been with peripheral vision and observation (along with some concentration issues when things got stressful at work).
Nothing to lose, give it a go.
em177 said:
So update time. I've not driven in the last 2 days and the symptoms are still appearing.
I'm going to give the no caffeine idea a go over the next week or so and report back
How much coffee do you drink? I've been on decaffeinated coffee for several years now. No more racing pulse etc in the mornings (x3 cups Nescafe). Discovered how bad coffee could be for me when I used to meet a friend at a cafe and have a large mug. I'd leave high as a kite.I'm going to give the no caffeine idea a go over the next week or so and report back
What have the Quacks checked / tested?
Have they checked your heart?
I've suffered similar and did pass out once. I was told it was "just one of those things and can happen to anyone". I didn't really buy the explanation and deep down knew that something was wrong and built up considerable anxiety. This was especially so as five years before I'd had a very close brush with the grim reaper due to a viral infection that decided to attack my heart. The sensations were similar.
Numerous visits to the GP didn't really help, I got referred for an MRI, all clear. And yet it continued. In the end the GP decided it was anxiety despite me locically explaining that the anxiety was a product of the dizzy spells.
How could the GP be wrong? I got with the programme and started taking anti anxiety pills as suggested. Things quietened down after about 18 months or so. Back to the GP and said, I want off the pills so we agreed to taper them down and with 6 months I was off them.
Things were good for about three years and then all of a sudden they dizzies were back, this in May 2013.
Late July 2013 I passed out at the wheel, with very little warning, a few seconds at most from the onset to me passing out. Luckily I was on a slow road and pootling along under the 30mph limit. I had the presecnce of mind to flick the car into neutral and slam the brakes on. I was lucky, I came round I don't know how long afterwards about a hundred yards down the road and on the other side of the road.
Other cars had stopped and an ambulance was on its way. In typical bloke fashion I insisted I was ok but despite that off I went in the ambulance.
A&E for a few hours, you get seen quite quickly if you arrive in an ambulance, blood tests back showing a raised tropanin protein level. That meant I'd had a cardiac arrest.
A cardiac MRI revealed scarring on my heart which must have been caused by the viral infection eight years previously. That scarring gives rise to erratic heart actiity which causes the dizzies. Two weeks on the cardio ward for observation and I come home with an ICD (Implanted Cardioverter Defibrillator) and a mandatory six month driving ban.
Little or no aftercare.
I dropped dead at Xmas 2013, the ICD shocked me back to life.
Still no aftercare other than periodic checks of the ICD and on a low dose of a beta blocker.
Got my licence back, incorrectly I've since found out, in Feb 2014.
June 14, dropped dead again, this time off to the Brompton for an attempt at some heart surgery. It didn't work. Sent home on some powerful drugs.
Aug 14, dropped dead again but the ICD shocked me back. even stronger drugs.
Oct 14, I almost dropped dead but the ICD managed to pace me out of it, a strange feeling. They doubled the drug dose!
Mar 16, Licence back for the second time. Since then I've been absolutely fine physically but mentally the anxiety is still a huge issue.
I know that storey is quite dramatic but the message is to keep badgering your GP get referrals and never take no for an answer. In particular please make sure you get referred to a cardiologist who should book you for something called a 'holter monitor'. A Holter is quite simply a 24 or 48 hour ECG that has a button to press when you feel an episode.
You may need to feign things to get this but it will eliminate your heart as a cause. Having been through what I have and having had some very candid conversations with my GP after the ICD implant, it is worryingly apparent that many of them are simply not aware of heart rhythm disorders.
Get yourself checked out if only to eliminate your ticker as a cause. You are getting nowhere at the moment so there is nothing to loose.
And sorry for potentially scaring the crap out of you.
Have they checked your heart?
I've suffered similar and did pass out once. I was told it was "just one of those things and can happen to anyone". I didn't really buy the explanation and deep down knew that something was wrong and built up considerable anxiety. This was especially so as five years before I'd had a very close brush with the grim reaper due to a viral infection that decided to attack my heart. The sensations were similar.
Numerous visits to the GP didn't really help, I got referred for an MRI, all clear. And yet it continued. In the end the GP decided it was anxiety despite me locically explaining that the anxiety was a product of the dizzy spells.
How could the GP be wrong? I got with the programme and started taking anti anxiety pills as suggested. Things quietened down after about 18 months or so. Back to the GP and said, I want off the pills so we agreed to taper them down and with 6 months I was off them.
Things were good for about three years and then all of a sudden they dizzies were back, this in May 2013.
Late July 2013 I passed out at the wheel, with very little warning, a few seconds at most from the onset to me passing out. Luckily I was on a slow road and pootling along under the 30mph limit. I had the presecnce of mind to flick the car into neutral and slam the brakes on. I was lucky, I came round I don't know how long afterwards about a hundred yards down the road and on the other side of the road.
Other cars had stopped and an ambulance was on its way. In typical bloke fashion I insisted I was ok but despite that off I went in the ambulance.
A&E for a few hours, you get seen quite quickly if you arrive in an ambulance, blood tests back showing a raised tropanin protein level. That meant I'd had a cardiac arrest.
A cardiac MRI revealed scarring on my heart which must have been caused by the viral infection eight years previously. That scarring gives rise to erratic heart actiity which causes the dizzies. Two weeks on the cardio ward for observation and I come home with an ICD (Implanted Cardioverter Defibrillator) and a mandatory six month driving ban.
Little or no aftercare.
I dropped dead at Xmas 2013, the ICD shocked me back to life.
Still no aftercare other than periodic checks of the ICD and on a low dose of a beta blocker.
Got my licence back, incorrectly I've since found out, in Feb 2014.
June 14, dropped dead again, this time off to the Brompton for an attempt at some heart surgery. It didn't work. Sent home on some powerful drugs.
Aug 14, dropped dead again but the ICD shocked me back. even stronger drugs.
Oct 14, I almost dropped dead but the ICD managed to pace me out of it, a strange feeling. They doubled the drug dose!
Mar 16, Licence back for the second time. Since then I've been absolutely fine physically but mentally the anxiety is still a huge issue.
I know that storey is quite dramatic but the message is to keep badgering your GP get referrals and never take no for an answer. In particular please make sure you get referred to a cardiologist who should book you for something called a 'holter monitor'. A Holter is quite simply a 24 or 48 hour ECG that has a button to press when you feel an episode.
You may need to feign things to get this but it will eliminate your heart as a cause. Having been through what I have and having had some very candid conversations with my GP after the ICD implant, it is worryingly apparent that many of them are simply not aware of heart rhythm disorders.
Get yourself checked out if only to eliminate your ticker as a cause. You are getting nowhere at the moment so there is nothing to loose.
And sorry for potentially scaring the crap out of you.
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