Is a rowing machine the silver bullet to weight loss?

Sunday 22nd January 2017

throt said:

On my new C2 ( brand new ) the fly wheel has slowed right down as you slide back towards it for the next pull back. 1200m every 5 mins is a workout and so is 8.15 secs for 2000m. On the gym C2 those times would be smashed by me..

Have you got the damper on 10? Go into options and check your drag factor, somewhere around 130 is fine. Adjust that by lowering or increasing the fan lever.

All of which said, my newish Model D slows down more quickly than the well-used ones at the gym.

dxg

8,206 posts

260 months

Sunday 22nd January 2017

Birdster said:

My longest row so far. Quite chuffed.

Just over 20 minutes for 4500m.

With all this talk of the Concept 2, does anyone make use of the graph option on the bottom half of the screen - that shows pull strength over the duration of the stroke?

I'm not sure what a good profile looks like. I suppose you're supposed to maximise the area under the curve, but I'm just focusing on keeping each stroke consistent(ly bad!). Does anyone know?

It's something to focus on to break the monotony, I suppose...

mondeoman

11,430 posts

266 months

Sunday 22nd January 2017

It should be like sine wave, or a decent boob:

http://www.concept2.co.uk/indoor-rowers/training/t...

Its all about the transition from legs to core to arms, try to keep it smooth

mondeoman

11,430 posts

266 months

Sunday 22nd January 2017

throt said:

13m said:

throt said:

15,, that sounds a gutty workout. I bet on the last few sets you arms start to detach from your shoulders.. biggrin

..

It's not my arms, it's my lungs and my legs.

Surely thats saying something about my technique because my legs could go on and on, or i just have strong legs, or I am not working them enough. My upstairs muscle is also fine and i never am puffing and panting after a hard workout. I just can't work it out, looked at youtube etc etc and am quite sure Im doing everything okay. And , yes, I am pushing myself.

However, I do recall the C2's down my gym and the pull back on them was so much more free. Once you got going the fly wheel spinning fast, every pull back was easy, so it was a case to just keep the momentum.

On my new C2 ( brand new ) the fly wheel has slowed right down as you slide back towards it for the next pull back. 1200m every 5 mins is a workout and so is 8.15 secs for 2000m. On the gym C2 those times would be smashed by me..

I did notice the same scenario, thinking back when I was filling my home gym, that my Life Fitness Elliptical machine , also purchased from new, had so much more resistants than the gym one I used prior. I have to move the foot rest, there is no aid from the machine.

So, can C2's differ that much with ease of use across various ones. And maybe its just that a new one takes time and use to be kind of run in. Time will tell.

Ant thoughts on the above guys.

Edited by throt on Sunday 22 January 13:35

Two identical machines at the gym I go to... I use a drag factor of around 143 (i'm a heavy bugger) and on 1 machine, the damper is set at 8, right next to it the damper has to be on 10. These machines are only three months old... Thats why checking DF when you get set up is a good thing to do.

10,529 posts

209 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

13m said:

Cheib said:

clonmult said:

13m said:

Derek Chevalier said:

13m said:

mondeoman said:

Love rowing!

4 sets of 500m with 1 min rest is a great warm up before a gym session.

Do 10 sets @ 1:45 and see how much you still love it.

To be fair that's "only" a 17:30 5k time (not that I could do that now). I think it would feel easier to do the 5k rather than 10 individual ones.

Quite. You cannot do it and neither can most other people. Rowing 4 x 500 is within most people's grasp; 10x500 @1:45 is someting few can do in practice.

I've only ever really trained for the 2k, one of the tests was 8x500, and I managed to do it at just under 1:40 .... felt close to death. Will have to give it a go next week, need to see where I'm at for the upcoming EIRC.

That's different gravy!

For anyone who's never competed/been trained 5000m going along at say a pace of 1.50 to 1.55 for any decent length of time is pretty good IMHO? Certainly in most gyms its very rare to see blokes on the rowing machines for more than 10 mins at any kind of pace beginning with a 1...people can't hack it! Exception was when I worked in The City, used to be a few blokes in the gyms then who to my untrained eye could row.

I did four reps of 100m as 1.40 at part of a super set the other day(repeated four times)....I can handle that but have no idea how on earth you can row at that pace for 8x500 !!!!!

On the advice of my PT, I don't do much rowing of any distance now. It's all intervals.

I do 30 second intervals, 30 seconds rest. I try to stay sub-140 every interval for 10, sometimes 15. Sub-138 when I am feeling good.

The advantage fitness-wise is that to get sub-140 you've got to employ some exposive power to start the fan which is either dead or dying followed by a steadier but relatvely fast row for about 25 seconds. I view it as like chasing an antelope in primeval times.

It gets results and is quick to do.

I've seen a few PTs suggest intervals, and then proceed to not demonstrate proper usage of the monitor to correctly dial in an interval session - they tend to use a stopwatch, and it is VERY rare for a PT to have a clue on proper erg technique.

But for a PT to only suggest intervals shows that the PT in question is close to completely incompetent and has no decent background in fitness training.

I tried a public gym for the first time in a year yesterday. Ruddy hilarious. None of their ergs (they had 7) were in good shape for sprinting. Thankfully they had one ski erg that was in good shape, and I did a 100m on that. Equalled my PB (16.2), and managed a low pull of 1:16.

johnwilliams77

8,308 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

clonmult said:

I've seen a few PTs suggest intervals, and then proceed to not demonstrate proper usage of the monitor to correctly dial in an interval session - they tend to use a stopwatch, and it is VERY rare for a PT to have a clue on proper erg technique.

But for a PT to only suggest intervals shows that the PT in question is close to completely incompetent and has no decent background in fitness training.

I tried a public gym for the first time in a year yesterday. Ruddy hilarious. None of their ergs (they had 7) were in good shape for sprinting. Thankfully they had one ski erg that was in good shape, and I did a 100m on that. Equalled my PB (16.2), and managed a low pull of 1:16.

Depends very much on the goals he is trying to achieve. I know guys who are pretty fit on weights / HIIT only.

I also understand the benefits of aerobic (sub 150bpm) on my watch long cardio sessions.

13m

26,288 posts

222 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

clonmult said:

I've seen a few PTs suggest intervals, and then proceed to not demonstrate proper usage of the monitor to correctly dial in an interval session - they tend to use a stopwatch, and it is VERY rare for a PT to have a clue on proper erg technique.

But for a PT to only suggest intervals shows that the PT in question is close to completely incompetent and has no decent background in fitness training.

I tried a public gym for the first time in a year yesterday. Ruddy hilarious. None of their ergs (they had 7) were in good shape for sprinting. Thankfully they had one ski erg that was in good shape, and I did a 100m on that. Equalled my PB (16.2), and managed a low pull of 1:16.

My PT is an ex varsity rower, so he does know a bit about setting up an erg and rowing it.

The reason he suggests HIIT is that it boosts testosterone, whereas long steady state cardio lowers it.

Why do you think he is wrong?

10,529 posts

209 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

13m said:

clonmult said:

I've seen a few PTs suggest intervals, and then proceed to not demonstrate proper usage of the monitor to correctly dial in an interval session - they tend to use a stopwatch, and it is VERY rare for a PT to have a clue on proper erg technique.

But for a PT to only suggest intervals shows that the PT in question is close to completely incompetent and has no decent background in fitness training.

I tried a public gym for the first time in a year yesterday. Ruddy hilarious. None of their ergs (they had 7) were in good shape for sprinting. Thankfully they had one ski erg that was in good shape, and I did a 100m on that. Equalled my PB (16.2), and managed a low pull of 1:16.

My PT is an ex varsity rower, so he does know a bit about setting up an erg and rowing it.

The reason he suggests HIIT is that it boosts testosterone, whereas long steady state cardio lowers it.

Why do you think he is wrong?

Because unless you're training for something very specific, HIIT on its own may not be that useful. You need a variety of training. Weights, steady state cardio (HR cap sessions are amazing for increasing aerobic capacity).

I'm used to PTs invariably being incompetent when it comes to the erg (and generally pretty incompetent in general, although I've known a few who have been utterly amazing).

anonymous-user

54 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

clonmult said:

13m said:

clonmult said:

I've seen a few PTs suggest intervals, and then proceed to not demonstrate proper usage of the monitor to correctly dial in an interval session - they tend to use a stopwatch, and it is VERY rare for a PT to have a clue on proper erg technique.

But for a PT to only suggest intervals shows that the PT in question is close to completely incompetent and has no decent background in fitness training.

I tried a public gym for the first time in a year yesterday. Ruddy hilarious. None of their ergs (they had 7) were in good shape for sprinting. Thankfully they had one ski erg that was in good shape, and I did a 100m on that. Equalled my PB (16.2), and managed a low pull of 1:16.

My PT is an ex varsity rower, so he does know a bit about setting up an erg and rowing it.

The reason he suggests HIIT is that it boosts testosterone, whereas long steady state cardio lowers it.

Why do you think he is wrong?

Because unless you're training for something very specific, HIIT on its own may not be that useful. You need a variety of training. Weights, steady state cardio (HR cap sessions are amazing for increasing aerobic capacity).

I'm used to PTs invariably being incompetent when it comes to the erg (and generally pretty incompetent in general, although I've known a few who have been utterly amazing).

I typically row 3 times a week at the end of my gym session. I do a 2K sprint on one day, a solid 30 min row the other and the 3rd row is tabata - 20 seconds full on, 10 second rest repeated 8 times. I think a mix is a good idea and certianly works for me. I never fail to almost puke on tabata but the others hurt in a completely different way smile

13m

26,288 posts

222 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

clonmult said:

13m said:

clonmult said:

I've seen a few PTs suggest intervals, and then proceed to not demonstrate proper usage of the monitor to correctly dial in an interval session - they tend to use a stopwatch, and it is VERY rare for a PT to have a clue on proper erg technique.

But for a PT to only suggest intervals shows that the PT in question is close to completely incompetent and has no decent background in fitness training.

I tried a public gym for the first time in a year yesterday. Ruddy hilarious. None of their ergs (they had 7) were in good shape for sprinting. Thankfully they had one ski erg that was in good shape, and I did a 100m on that. Equalled my PB (16.2), and managed a low pull of 1:16.

My PT is an ex varsity rower, so he does know a bit about setting up an erg and rowing it.

The reason he suggests HIIT is that it boosts testosterone, whereas long steady state cardio lowers it.

Why do you think he is wrong?

Because unless you're training for something very specific, HIIT on its own may not be that useful. You need a variety of training. Weights, steady state cardio (HR cap sessions are amazing for increasing aerobic capacity).

I'm used to PTs invariably being incompetent when it comes to the erg (and generally pretty incompetent in general, although I've known a few who have been utterly amazing).

I am training specifically to have low body fat, strength and maintain testosterone levels. Do you think that what I am doing is wrong?

The chap I use is, in my opinion, brilliant. I know a lot of PTs and he is the best of them. He has certainly helped me address some issues that other PTs have failed to resolve.

10,529 posts

209 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

garyhun said:

I typically row 3 times a week at the end of my gym session. I do a 2K sprint on one day, a solid 30 min row the other and the 3rd row is tabata - 20 seconds full on, 10 second rest repeated 8 times. I think a mix is a good idea and certianly works for me. I never fail to almost puke on tabata but the others hurt in a completely different way smile

A full on tabata like that is absolute hell, but definitely a good session. I need to try it on the erg - did it on the ski erg a few weeks back and almost puked. So obviously wasn't trying hard enough.

10,529 posts

209 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

13m said:

I am training specifically to have low body fat, strength and maintain testosterone levels. Do you think that what I am doing is wrong?

The chap I use is, in my opinion, brilliant. I know a lot of PTs and he is the best of them. He has certainly helped me address some issues that other PTs have failed to resolve.

HIIT will work well, and if you're finding results from the sessions then ignore me.

I'm just used to seeing most PTs (and gym staff) being pretty useless.

johnwilliams77

8,308 posts

103 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

clonmult said:

Because unless you're training for something very specific, HIIT on its own may not be that useful. You need a variety of training. Weights, steady state cardio (HR cap sessions are amazing for increasing aerobic capacity).

I'm used to PTs invariably being incompetent when it comes to the erg (and generally pretty incompetent in general, although I've known a few who have been utterly amazing).

What HR cap are you thinking of? Sub 150bpm (talking HR?)

I don't think he said his trainer told him not to do anything other than HIIT and don't do weights, perhaps you're assuming things?

anonymous-user

54 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

clonmult said:

garyhun said:

I typically row 3 times a week at the end of my gym session. I do a 2K sprint on one day, a solid 30 min row the other and the 3rd row is tabata - 20 seconds full on, 10 second rest repeated 8 times. I think a mix is a good idea and certianly works for me. I never fail to almost puke on tabata but the others hurt in a completely different way smile

A full on tabata like that is absolute hell, but definitely a good session. I need to try it on the erg - did it on the ski erg a few weeks back and almost puked. So obviously wasn't trying hard enough.

I remember the first time I did it and just before starting I thought to myself, 4 minutes is a nothing. Oh how wrong I was smile

10,529 posts

209 months

Monday 23rd January 2017

johnwilliams77 said:

clonmult said:

Because unless you're training for something very specific, HIIT on its own may not be that useful. You need a variety of training. Weights, steady state cardio (HR cap sessions are amazing for increasing aerobic capacity).

I'm used to PTs invariably being incompetent when it comes to the erg (and generally pretty incompetent in general, although I've known a few who have been utterly amazing).

What HR cap are you thinking of? Sub 150bpm (talking HR?)

I don't think he said his trainer told him not to do anything other than HIIT and don't do weights, perhaps you're assuming things?

I'm a proponent of varied sessions - tabata is brilliant, I was encouraged to try maffetone caps (which for me is 138 bpm, 47 years old) for distance sessions (10k and up), which ultimately resulted in a sub 3 hour marathon (2:07.8 pace) at an average of 136bpm.

Lunchtime today I did 10x1 minute, 1 minute rest. Average was 1:42.4 - which turned out to be the fastest that I've done that session in 2 seasons.

But if you've found something you enjoy and you're finding improvements in time or how you feel, then stick with it.

Cheib

23,256 posts

175 months

Tuesday 24th January 2017

13m said:

Cheib said:

clonmult said:

13m said:

Derek Chevalier said:

13m said:

mondeoman said:

Love rowing!

4 sets of 500m with 1 min rest is a great warm up before a gym session.

Do 10 sets @ 1:45 and see how much you still love it.

To be fair that's "only" a 17:30 5k time (not that I could do that now). I think it would feel easier to do the 5k rather than 10 individual ones.

Quite. You cannot do it and neither can most other people. Rowing 4 x 500 is within most people's grasp; 10x500 @1:45 is someting few can do in practice.

I've only ever really trained for the 2k, one of the tests was 8x500, and I managed to do it at just under 1:40 .... felt close to death. Will have to give it a go next week, need to see where I'm at for the upcoming EIRC.

That's different gravy!

For anyone who's never competed/been trained 5000m going along at say a pace of 1.50 to 1.55 for any decent length of time is pretty good IMHO? Certainly in most gyms its very rare to see blokes on the rowing machines for more than 10 mins at any kind of pace beginning with a 1...people can't hack it! Exception was when I worked in The City, used to be a few blokes in the gyms then who to my untrained eye could row.

I did four reps of 100m as 1.40 at part of a super set the other day(repeated four times)....I can handle that but have no idea how on earth you can row at that pace for 8x500 !!!!!

On the advice of my PT, I don't do much rowing of any distance now. It's all intervals.

I do 30 second intervals, 30 seconds rest. I try to stay sub-140 every interval for 10, sometimes 15. Sub-138 when I am feeling good.

The advantage fitness-wise is that to get sub-140 you've got to employ some exposive power to start the fan which is either dead or dying followed by a steadier but relatvely fast row for about 25 seconds. I view it as like chasing an antelope in primeval times.

It gets results and is quick to do.

back in the gym last night with my PT.

Rowing was 4 x 100m @1.38 with 20 sec break at the start of a superset/circuit which I repeated four times. f

k me it was hard work! It's really sodding hard getting it up to speed quick enough to have a chance of doing 100m in 1.38.

PT said at the end "that should get you to the next level for your cardio"....I certainly hope so.

throt

3,055 posts

170 months