Going abroad for dental work
Discussion
snowy said:
I'm just going through the process of having a dental implant in the UK, single front tooth fell out in March, so I'm looking like a t
t until it's all completed in August, listed are the breakdown of costs
Implant Consultation £95
Implant Placement and bone graft - Xenograft £1225
Implant Impressions - £700
Anterior Implant Crown Fit - £1000
total £3020
Gives some balance as to costs here and the costs abroad
Jeez! t until it's all completed in August, listed are the breakdown of costsImplant Consultation £95
Implant Placement and bone graft - Xenograft £1225
Implant Impressions - £700
Anterior Implant Crown Fit - £1000
total £3020
Gives some balance as to costs here and the costs abroad
When I think what that girl had done in Turkey for only a few hundred pounds more than your cost.
I really wish I'd taken a pic of her 'new' full set of gnashers, it was truly incredible. Pity I didn't, as I'm sure she would have let me as she really was over the moon with her treatment. I bet she's been grinning ever since!
I asked my dentist why implants were so expensive, she told me it was because they have to train for 5 years (i think) and that her public liability would go up another couple k a year (she doesnt do them btw).
I know i am a tradesman who obviously isn't as skilled or intelligent but wow it takes years to do what i can do, my public liability is not mega money but its a lot more than a single sole trader, i also have a lot of expensive plant which gets worn out fairly quickly.
I just cant see why they cost what they do, one dentist who did do implants told me its because of vanity/image, people will pay it! And i suppose they will
How much is an implant? how much is the margin? what are their overheads? In my case for example i just cant see how we are getting to 30 grand! I do appreciate the training, skill, knowledge, costs etc but 30k is just incredible.
Some of the prices i see i would be embarrassed to give to someone
yes mate, build a new wall? yes thats 10 hours at £180 an hour plus vat, plus fuel and so on (btw i am obviously below a dentist on the brain size scale 
)
I know i am a tradesman who obviously isn't as skilled or intelligent but wow it takes years to do what i can do, my public liability is not mega money but its a lot more than a single sole trader, i also have a lot of expensive plant which gets worn out fairly quickly.
I just cant see why they cost what they do, one dentist who did do implants told me its because of vanity/image, people will pay it! And i suppose they will
How much is an implant? how much is the margin? what are their overheads? In my case for example i just cant see how we are getting to 30 grand! I do appreciate the training, skill, knowledge, costs etc but 30k is just incredible.
Some of the prices i see i would be embarrassed to give to someone
yes mate, build a new wall? yes thats 10 hours at £180 an hour plus vat, plus fuel and so on (btw i am obviously below a dentist on the brain size scale )There's been a few threads on here about the cost of implants & you'll upset the resident dentists enoumously if you imply they are grossly overcharging for them. You'll annoy them even more if you ask if paying UK prices means that the work is guaranteed & any failures will be rectified for free.
The funniest one was the bloke defending the cost & then in another thread complaining about his builder overcharging him on a huge extension he was having built. Karma's a bh.
The funniest one was the bloke defending the cost & then in another thread complaining about his builder overcharging him on a huge extension he was having built. Karma's a b
h.We’ve just had this topic chatted about at work…
In 2010 a work mate went to the dentist for some treatment and enquired about getting a permanent fix done - £7K – EEK!
He’s half Hungarian, so he asked his family out there, what it would cost. They didn’t know but not that much. He went out there on a Friday night, appointment Saturday, back home on Sunday. Hungarian dentist wasn’t impressed with his prior UK treatment.
3 weeks later, he went out on Friday night with his wife and baby, treatment/op Saturday pm, overnight stay, out on Sunday. They stayed in Hungary for the week, for a “holiday”. Another check-up while still there and returned to the UK.
A month after that, there and back again in 24 hours to see the orthodontist. All OK.
Total cost to him, all flights, treatment, holiday AND including his week off work (he was a contractor) was just under £4K.
All the people being seen at the weekend clinic (like him) were from the UK.
His UK dentist was not a happy bunny. So, he just moved practices.
While my dentist has a new RS6, if I ever need serious treatment, I’ll look into this.
In 2010 a work mate went to the dentist for some treatment and enquired about getting a permanent fix done - £7K – EEK!
He’s half Hungarian, so he asked his family out there, what it would cost. They didn’t know but not that much. He went out there on a Friday night, appointment Saturday, back home on Sunday. Hungarian dentist wasn’t impressed with his prior UK treatment.
3 weeks later, he went out on Friday night with his wife and baby, treatment/op Saturday pm, overnight stay, out on Sunday. They stayed in Hungary for the week, for a “holiday”. Another check-up while still there and returned to the UK.
A month after that, there and back again in 24 hours to see the orthodontist. All OK.
Total cost to him, all flights, treatment, holiday AND including his week off work (he was a contractor) was just under £4K.
All the people being seen at the weekend clinic (like him) were from the UK.
His UK dentist was not a happy bunny. So, he just moved practices.
While my dentist has a new RS6, if I ever need serious treatment, I’ll look into this.
Interesting thread. I am probably about to lose all my molars due to having Stevie Wonder as my last dentist.
I'm seeing a highly regarded dentist. So far, it's £1,800 for one root canal to see if one can be saved, two extractions and clean up the mess left by the last extraction.
The root canal work won't proceed if it looks as it's a waste of time so it will be filled pending extraction.
I'm seeing a highly regarded dentist. So far, it's £1,800 for one root canal to see if one can be saved, two extractions and clean up the mess left by the last extraction.
The root canal work won't proceed if it looks as it's a waste of time so it will be filled pending extraction.
I hate my teeth, aways a cause of stress though they are likely not as bad as I perceive them. Always been tempted to get them done - but something I've often wondered - how sustainable is the work? I'm assuming its things like veneers/implants - can you eat pretty much anything you would normally eat?
okgo said:
crossle said:
Can anybody else remember when you could get proper dental treatment on the NHS?
You still can. But they're not going to do cosmetic work for you are they. Some people are ugly, should NHS sort their faces out? No.I'm waiting to take the plunge and whilst I don't look like Plug from the Bash Street Kids, 8 crowns, 4 implants and some 'general' tidying work the (UK) estimate of £18k was too much to swallow.
OP who did you use in Turkey?
Kreativ Dental in Budapest gets a lot of (supposedly) good press - advertise in the Daily Mail, but it looks like a conveyor belt approach. That said I reckon for the same work I'm looking £6-8k
OP who did you use in Turkey?
Kreativ Dental in Budapest gets a lot of (supposedly) good press - advertise in the Daily Mail, but it looks like a conveyor belt approach. That said I reckon for the same work I'm looking £6-8k
ozzuk said:
I hate my teeth, aways a cause of stress though they are likely not as bad as I perceive them. Always been tempted to get them done - but something I've often wondered - how sustainable is the work? I'm assuming its things like veneers/implants - can you eat pretty much anything you would normally eat?
Pretty much.The several people I've seen who've been on dental holidays have come back with totally unsuitable treatment.
These are people who have never looked after their teeth properly. This doesn't change once they've spent thousands on inappropriate treatment that requires even more rigorous aftercare.
I don't get involved if their treatment starts failing either as you always tend to get ring fenced within someone else's failures. It's much easier for sueyourdentist.com to go after the nearest dentist unfortunate enough to become involved. Multiple implants, crowns and bridgework is specialist treatment and you're going to need a specialist in the UK to fix your problem or hop on the plane.
I'm wondering if the poster further up asks every business owner what car they drive before deciding whether to do business with them
What they charge abroad we can’t compete, there is no way. So I would say, if you are happy with the option and the clinician abroad go for it.
As for extortionate in UK... well certainly some dentists are extortionate but what feels extortionate to the customer rarely is for the dentist with the costs of training and doing business in the U.K.
I can give you a few examples....
My implant training in the U.K. cost me £35k alone. This is postgraduate training at the UCL. If I account for the time/loss of income took of work to train the real cost is about 70-80k.
On top of this just so I can have the privilege of treating people in a regulated and safe manner I pay around 8k to regulatory bodies and indemnity. This is not optional so every year is paid before I can work.
Any staff employed by the dentist or clinic will on a wage of minimum 22k. This for nurses/receptionist. Hygienist can be £40-50k, practice managers 30k.
Nurses, hygienists need to pay registration and indemnity as well.
The dental laboratories we must use need to be regulated and the technicians are also registered and pay membership to regulatory body.
Then the supplies are also more expensive in the UK.
On top of this it’s not a business where cash in hand works or tax evasion. Ilegal and you can jeopardise your registration and loose the right to practice.
I am not defending anything in fact my advice is to for it as we can’t match it if you are happy with everything.
For the poster that wants unit costs I can tell you. For a single tooth implant in the U.K., excluding machinery kit out, implant drills, etc is as follows.
Implant - 360 ( Straumann implants not some cheap implant system)
Implant healing abutment - 38
Implant impression post - 45
Implant crown, includes technician labour, implant gold alloy castable abutment - 600.
Total is over 1000 this is purely cost. Doesn’t account like I said cost for the normal run of the business, machinery investment, implant drills and all other sundries.
There are variables like bone graft, temporary crowns, temporary dentures that are extra if required.
Also to do it well terms of time you probably need about 3h in total from initial consultation to fit crown, maybe more.
This is meant just to be helpful nothing else.
Of course we can all say that everyone is extortionate same applies to anyone on any job but some balance should be had.
I felt I should post this as some previous posters comments felt a bit unfair and made without facts.
As for extortionate in UK... well certainly some dentists are extortionate but what feels extortionate to the customer rarely is for the dentist with the costs of training and doing business in the U.K.
I can give you a few examples....
My implant training in the U.K. cost me £35k alone. This is postgraduate training at the UCL. If I account for the time/loss of income took of work to train the real cost is about 70-80k.
On top of this just so I can have the privilege of treating people in a regulated and safe manner I pay around 8k to regulatory bodies and indemnity. This is not optional so every year is paid before I can work.
Any staff employed by the dentist or clinic will on a wage of minimum 22k. This for nurses/receptionist. Hygienist can be £40-50k, practice managers 30k.
Nurses, hygienists need to pay registration and indemnity as well.
The dental laboratories we must use need to be regulated and the technicians are also registered and pay membership to regulatory body.
Then the supplies are also more expensive in the UK.
On top of this it’s not a business where cash in hand works or tax evasion. Ilegal and you can jeopardise your registration and loose the right to practice.
I am not defending anything in fact my advice is to for it as we can’t match it if you are happy with everything.
For the poster that wants unit costs I can tell you. For a single tooth implant in the U.K., excluding machinery kit out, implant drills, etc is as follows.
Implant - 360 ( Straumann implants not some cheap implant system)
Implant healing abutment - 38
Implant impression post - 45
Implant crown, includes technician labour, implant gold alloy castable abutment - 600.
Total is over 1000 this is purely cost. Doesn’t account like I said cost for the normal run of the business, machinery investment, implant drills and all other sundries.
There are variables like bone graft, temporary crowns, temporary dentures that are extra if required.
Also to do it well terms of time you probably need about 3h in total from initial consultation to fit crown, maybe more.
This is meant just to be helpful nothing else.
Of course we can all say that everyone is extortionate same applies to anyone on any job but some balance should be had.
I felt I should post this as some previous posters comments felt a bit unfair and made without facts.
^^^ Very useful to know and I don't doubt the cost to practice etc. On the other hand looking at the Eastern European countries can we not apply the logic that the average national wage, cost of living, dentist salaries etc is low and that as a 'tourist' (despite I reckon paying more than a local) we are getting a better deal?
Judging by the 'fleet' of supercars the cosmetic dentist near me has there must be a good profit margin in it. Or he has them on a conveyor belt, a bit like the NHS dentists in the 70s who got paid by the Govt per job and many of us ended up with a mouthful of fillings we didn't need. Back then it was a licence to print money.
Judging by the 'fleet' of supercars the cosmetic dentist near me has there must be a good profit margin in it. Or he has them on a conveyor belt, a bit like the NHS dentists in the 70s who got paid by the Govt per job and many of us ended up with a mouthful of fillings we didn't need. Back then it was a licence to print money.
Living in the far east I have no choice but to go 'abroad' for health treatment, I've had bypass, retina and cataract surgery, several retina laser 'stitches", a bridge, etc, My oldest daughter had "inserted' contact lenses to correct myopia, the follow ups have been done in both Australia and Europe and the doctors there couldn't believe the quality of the work, my youngest daughter lives in Bali, had a wisdom tooth out earlier this week, she was terrified, so I told her to follow my advice, and it was a complete success,
My advice, check for personal references, make sure the doctor's English skills tie up to the certs on the wall, and check the certs for where they qualified, e.g. the eye surgeon I use qualified at Birmingham Eye, Be wary of certs from Moscow, Bombay etc, but having said that the local FIA approved doctor qualified from Bombay as did my GP and they are great.
Do basic checks as above, be aware that you wont have the same recourse if it goes wrong as you would in the UK, and you ill be fine.
Don't be afraid to walk away, I've walked out of two hospitals local to where I live, one of which was the newest and most modern in the city, the reason was Indian doctors who didn't convince me that they understood what was wrong because of poor English.
My advice, check for personal references, make sure the doctor's English skills tie up to the certs on the wall, and check the certs for where they qualified, e.g. the eye surgeon I use qualified at Birmingham Eye, Be wary of certs from Moscow, Bombay etc, but having said that the local FIA approved doctor qualified from Bombay as did my GP and they are great.
Do basic checks as above, be aware that you wont have the same recourse if it goes wrong as you would in the UK, and you ill be fine.
Don't be afraid to walk away, I've walked out of two hospitals local to where I live, one of which was the newest and most modern in the city, the reason was Indian doctors who didn't convince me that they understood what was wrong because of poor English.
CrgT16 said:
What they charge abroad we can’t compete, there is no way. So I would say, if you are happy with the option and the clinician abroad go for it.
As for extortionate in UK... well certainly some dentists are extortionate but what feels extortionate to the customer rarely is for the dentist with the costs of training and doing business in the U.K.
I can give you a few examples....
My implant training in the U.K. cost me £35k alone. This is postgraduate training at the UCL. If I account for the time/loss of income took of work to train the real cost is about 70-80k.
On top of this just so I can have the privilege of treating people in a regulated and safe manner I pay around 8k to regulatory bodies and indemnity. This is not optional so every year is paid before I can work.
Any staff employed by the dentist or clinic will on a wage of minimum 22k. This for nurses/receptionist. Hygienist can be £40-50k, practice managers 30k.
Nurses, hygienists need to pay registration and indemnity as well.
The dental laboratories we must use need to be regulated and the technicians are also registered and pay membership to regulatory body.
Then the supplies are also more expensive in the UK.
On top of this it’s not a business where cash in hand works or tax evasion. Ilegal and you can jeopardise your registration and loose the right to practice.
I am not defending anything in fact my advice is to for it as we can’t match it if you are happy with everything.
For the poster that wants unit costs I can tell you. For a single tooth implant in the U.K., excluding machinery kit out, implant drills, etc is as follows.
Implant - 360 ( Straumann implants not some cheap implant system)
Implant healing abutment - 38
Implant impression post - 45
Implant crown, includes technician labour, implant gold alloy castable abutment - 600.
Total is over 1000 this is purely cost. Doesn’t account like I said cost for the normal run of the business, machinery investment, implant drills and all other sundries.
There are variables like bone graft, temporary crowns, temporary dentures that are extra if required.
Also to do it well terms of time you probably need about 3h in total from initial consultation to fit crown, maybe more.
This is meant just to be helpful nothing else.
Of course we can all say that everyone is extortionate same applies to anyone on any job but some balance should be had.
I felt I should post this as some previous posters comments felt a bit unfair and made without facts.
Thank you for making this post. As for extortionate in UK... well certainly some dentists are extortionate but what feels extortionate to the customer rarely is for the dentist with the costs of training and doing business in the U.K.
I can give you a few examples....
My implant training in the U.K. cost me £35k alone. This is postgraduate training at the UCL. If I account for the time/loss of income took of work to train the real cost is about 70-80k.
On top of this just so I can have the privilege of treating people in a regulated and safe manner I pay around 8k to regulatory bodies and indemnity. This is not optional so every year is paid before I can work.
Any staff employed by the dentist or clinic will on a wage of minimum 22k. This for nurses/receptionist. Hygienist can be £40-50k, practice managers 30k.
Nurses, hygienists need to pay registration and indemnity as well.
The dental laboratories we must use need to be regulated and the technicians are also registered and pay membership to regulatory body.
Then the supplies are also more expensive in the UK.
On top of this it’s not a business where cash in hand works or tax evasion. Ilegal and you can jeopardise your registration and loose the right to practice.
I am not defending anything in fact my advice is to for it as we can’t match it if you are happy with everything.
For the poster that wants unit costs I can tell you. For a single tooth implant in the U.K., excluding machinery kit out, implant drills, etc is as follows.
Implant - 360 ( Straumann implants not some cheap implant system)
Implant healing abutment - 38
Implant impression post - 45
Implant crown, includes technician labour, implant gold alloy castable abutment - 600.
Total is over 1000 this is purely cost. Doesn’t account like I said cost for the normal run of the business, machinery investment, implant drills and all other sundries.
There are variables like bone graft, temporary crowns, temporary dentures that are extra if required.
Also to do it well terms of time you probably need about 3h in total from initial consultation to fit crown, maybe more.
This is meant just to be helpful nothing else.
Of course we can all say that everyone is extortionate same applies to anyone on any job but some balance should be had.
I felt I should post this as some previous posters comments felt a bit unfair and made without facts.
I suppose in a lot of ways its similar to the building trade in that the general public simply dont have a clue about why their extension costs 100k when the bricks are 80p each....... Lots of other hidden costs in materials you wont ever even see, overheads, liability and a biggie no one likes to actually mention: the person doing the job is rewarded for producing a great job through their experience and expertise.
I also suppose tax has a lot to play in it as well, i can imagine this type of work isn't vat exempt so thats a lump straight away, significantly cheaper wages and other associated overheads will also hurt.
okgo said:
crossle said:
Can anybody else remember when you could get proper dental treatment on the NHS?
You still can. But they're not going to do cosmetic work for you are they. Some people are ugly, should NHS sort their faces out? No.
In 1970 aged 10, mum took me to the NHS dentist up the road as she thought I had an abscess.
The dentist removed one of my front adult front teeth and said I could have a denture, age 10.
8 year later a bridge, fast forward 40 years to the top of this thread.
Several have asked where I went, I didn’t post it as I started the post just as how how it went for me not an advert for the dentist, but I went to the “Dental centre Turkey” in Antalya.
The dentist removed one of my front adult front teeth and said I could have a denture, age 10.
8 year later a bridge, fast forward 40 years to the top of this thread.
Several have asked where I went, I didn’t post it as I started the post just as how how it went for me not an advert for the dentist, but I went to the “Dental centre Turkey” in Antalya.
m3jappa said:
I asked my dentist why implants were so expensive, she told me it was because they have to train for 5 years (i think) and that her public liability would go up another couple k a year (she doesnt do them btw).
Cost of materials, price of liability insurance, time taken to fully plan the treatment/carry out treatment, cost of training, cost of membership fees, review appointments. And then the cost of fully trained support staff, practice costs, practice insurance.. the costs go on and on and onThe UK is one of the most litigious countries and this pushes risks for practitioners, which ups prices of insurance and others costs for dentists, which is passed on to patients. I'm assuming in these dental tourism countries litigation is a non issue.
Ive heard manufacturers price equipment cheaper in 'other' countries, and we cannot import them as they are not necessarily CE marked/ do not go through the complex UK standards tests.
dandarez said:
So, bit like the old days when the first thing a dentist did was to give your teeth a clean. Then it changed, and from somewhere came the hygienists.
Is it changing back?
NHS is more focussed on providing what is necessary for your dental health. Any cosmetic things or treatment that is not clinically necessary is usually not offered. Is it changing back?
That being said if someone comes in and is struggling with cleanliness or suffers from tartar build up - it would be justified to clean them in their checkup.
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